Cr150

[AlexandruH]

You're doing that yourself. What are you trying to prove is that it's better to play a full final game and lose it rather than a part of it and win it. Nobody apart from extreme Messi fans would agree to it: a trophy is forever, it's a record of pride and historical achievement. And I bet that not even you believe this - 'cos you'd happily give up the 2014 final for a Copa win this month. Messi would do it. I would do it. Every player on the planet would do it.

 

[KingLeo10]

Can't make a single post in the CR7 thread without Fati following me. Never seen a more relentless stalker.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

You're doing that yourself. What are you trying to prove is that it's better to play a full final game and lose it rather than a part of it and win it. Nobody apart from extreme Messi fans would agree to it: a trophy is forever, it's a record of pride and historical achievement. And I bet that not even you believe this - 'cos you'd happily give up the 2014 final for a Copa win this month. Messi would do it. I would do it. Every player on the planet would do it.

I wouldnt even call him an extreme Messi fan, i call him the 'narcisstic traits man' - Messi himself would be ashamed to have a fan like him in his fanbase.

 

[KingLeo10]

You're doing that yourself. What are you trying to prove is that it's better to play a full final game and lose it rather than a part of it and win it.

Nope. What I am saying is when comparing two historically great players, details matter. Credit goes based on contributions and for one to make any.contributions, they have to actually be on the field.

Nobody apart from extreme Messi fans would agree to it: a trophy is forever, it's a record of pride and historical achievement. And I bet that not even you believe this - 'cos you'd happily give up the 2014 final for a Copa win this month. Messi would do it. I would do it. Every player on the planet would do it.

That's not the discussion at hand. The discussion is a comparison of their output on the international level. Not whether one would rather have a WC without playing in the final or not. The second is a different discussion altogether. And I'd also be inclined to choose the trophy.

 

[AlexandruH]

Output? Ok.

Portugal overachieved with Ronaldo in the team. Got its first continental trophy (beating their previous performance as a finalist in 2004).

Argentina underachieved with Messi in the team. Didn't win the WC (after winning it twice previously) and reached the finals (not a great achievement for a nation that had already lost 2 previous finals). Didn't win the Copa (after winning it 14 times in its history) and reached the finals three times (after doing it 11 times already).

So you have countless Argentinian players that have a better international trophy haul than Messi but not a single Portuguese (apart from Ronaldo's teammates) better at that than Ronaldo.

So yeah, Messi's future ranking will have a disappointing chapter for his international performance.

 

[KingLeo10]

Output? Ok.

Portugal overachieved with Ronaldo in the team. Got its first continental trophy (beating their previous performance as a finalist in 2004).

Argentina underachieved with Messi in the team. Didn't win the WC (after winning it twice previously) and reached the finals (not a great achievement for a nation that had already lost 2 previous finals). Didn't win the Copa (after winning it 14 times in its history) and reached the finals three times (after doing it 11 times already).

So you have countless Argentinian players that have a better international trophy haul than Messi but not a single Portuguese (apart from Ronaldo's teammates) better at that than Ronaldo.

So yeah, Messi's future ranking will have a disappointing chapter for his international performance.

Output is generally defined as G+A in KO stages. And here you are pulling generic blanket statements like:

"Portugal overachieved with Ronaldo in the team."

I fail to see the overachieving in, for example,:

- WC 2010 (R of 16 exit, no goals)
- Euro 2012 (SF exit, no goals)
- WC 2014 (Group stage exit, LOL)
- Euro 2016 (W, credit here but he also didn't play the final. also joke opponents through the KO stages except for France)
- WC 2018 (R of 16 exit, no goals)
- Euro 2020 (R of 16 exit, no goals)

The one time they actually made it anywhere in the KO stage, he didn't even play a role in winning the final. How is that overachieving?

You're changing the goalposts in every response. Not to mention Portugal in CR7's time have had strong squads in 04, 06 (especially), 08 and then 16 and 18 and 20 (especially). Messi's squads have on average been stronger but not by some outlandish gap. It's not like CR7 is playing with Iceland teammates. In fact, out of the teammates from both sides over the years, Figo and Pepe would be the best players, followed by Mascherano. Messi's had more attacking talent help though in Aguero, Higuain, and Di Maria.

 

[AlexandruH]

You still say that Ronaldo didn't play in the final EVEN THOUGH HE PLAYED IN THE FINAL.

Yeah, you're a bad-faith actor. No reason or use to argue with someone like you.

 

[KingLeo10]

You still say that Ronaldo didn't play in the final EVEN THOUGH HE PLAYED IN THE FINAL.

Yeah, you're a bad-faith actor. No reason or use to argue with someone like you.

He played 15-20 minutes out of 120, which I've mentioned before

Tell me, is that a meaningful contribution.

What you can do is stick to your hipster CR7 defending while having an inability to "argue" without shifting goalposts and eventually resorting to ad hominems. Bye.

 

[AlexandruH]

I wouldnt even call him an extreme Messi fan, i call him the 'narcisstic traits man' - Messi himself would be ashamed to have a fan like him in his fanbase.

Yeah, I see what you mean.

 

[KingLeo10]

Yeah, I see what you mean.

You're agreeing with a guy who has been banned here on multiple accounts for trolling Messi/Barcelona and slurping CR7 with names like 'messi15478', and 'RonaldinhoBarca10'. Also, got caught supporting CR7 on a Juventus forum pretending to be a Juventus fun, while he now claims he's a Barcelona fan.

Congrats on making yourself look foolish.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

Output is generally defined as G+A in KO stages. And here you are pulling generic blanket statements like:

"Portugal overachieved with Ronaldo in the team."

I fail to see the overachieving in, for example,:

- WC 2010 (R of 16 exit, no goals)
- Euro 2012 (SF exit, no goals)
- WC 2014 (Group stage exit, LOL)
- Euro 2016 (W, credit here but he also didn't play the final. also joke opponents through the KO stages except for France)
- WC 2018 (R of 16 exit, no goals)
- Euro 2020 (R of 16 exit, no goals)

The one time they actually made it anywhere in the KO stage, he didn't even play a role in winning the final. How is that overachieving?

You're changing the goalposts in every response. Not to mention Portugal in CR7's time have had strong squads in 04, 06 (especially), 08 and then 16 and 18 and 20 (especially). Messi's squads have on average been stronger but not by some outlandish gap. It's not like CR7 is playing with Iceland teammates. In fact, out of the teammates from both sides over the years, Figo and Pepe would be the best players, followed by Mascherano. Messi's had more attacking talent help though in Aguero, Higuain, and Di Maria.

Since when output is only defined in KO Stage scorer points? So Messi had nearly 0 output in WC 14 ?

Oh, if you dont score in the match in which you lost the goals/assists from the other matches have no value for your individual performance ? So Messi had done nothing in WC 2010,Copa 11, WC 14, Copa 15/16/19 as he had 0 scorer points in the last matches Honestly, its not even funny anymore how this lad turn everything to support his self-created worldview.

 

[KingLeo10]

Since when output is only defined in KO Stage scorer points? So Messi had nearly 0 output in WC 14 ?

Oh, if you dont score in the match in which you lost the goals/assists from the other matches have no value for your individual performance ? So Messi had done nothing in WC 2010,Copa 11, WC 14, Copa 15/16/19 as he had 0 scorer points in the last matches Honestly, its not even funny anymore how this lad turn everything to support his self-created worldview.

Messi had 16 G+A in KO stages of Copas and WC. I think CR7 is around 10 in WC and Euro. I might be off by 1 or 2 but pretty sure. Neither are impressive really, but CR7's low numbers go unnoticed because he now has 100+ goals padding v farmers.

I didn't like Messi's WC 14 KO all that much. In fact, I stated in my first post that Messi has been barely above average at NT level for this club standards. How about you stop acting frantic for a second and read.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

Yeah, I see what you mean.

I have warned you, i do often the same mistake but discussing with him is hopeless. I wonder how he got his science graduation (probably a lie) without being able to think logical.

 

[AlexandruH]

You're agreeing with a guy who has been banned here on multiple accounts for trolling Messi/Barcelona and slurping CR7 with names like 'messi15478', and 'RonaldinhoBarca10'. Also, got caught supporting CR7 on a Juventus forum pretending to be a Juventus fun, while he now claims he's a Barcelona fan.

Congrats on making yourself look foolish.

He could be Hitler or Stalin.

He is right about you though.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

Messi had 16 G+A in KO stages of Copas and WC. I think CR7 is around 10. I might be off by 1 or 2 but pretty sure.

I didn't like Messi's WC 14 KO all that much. In fact, I stated in my first post that Messi has been barely above average at NT level for this club standards. How about you stop acting frantic for a second and read.

You are referring to a point which i didnt even mention.