European Super League

[serghei]

Imo, they are smart. What matters is not if UEFA can sanction them. What matters is the domestic turmoil they were (going to) face. They publicly backtracked while probably waiting the time when they will be given the green light. No backlash.

Bar?a, Real, Juve are totally different. Their fans are actually supporting the ESL. No threat from government.

No, they are cowards. They would still like the ESL to happen, but are too chickenshit to deal with the backlash.

Fans are not supporting the ESL in its entirety, but the initiative to bring something new and put pressure on UEFA to change how they approach the game. The CL is getting stale, and UEFA shows no interest to deal with some issues.

 

[serghei]

There are two lanes of discussions with ESL.

1. The proposed format, which was garbage imo.

2. The right to provide an alternative "product" to what UEFA is proposing which is valid and should be guaranteed by law.

The problem with UEFA's reaction is that they don't seem to be bothered or enraged by the proposed format, but simply by the fact that someone dared to challenge them. They do act as if they own the sport.

 

[JamDav1982]

No, they are cowards. They would still like the ESL to happen, but are too chickenshit to deal with the backlash.

Fans are not supporting the ESL in its entirety, but the initiative to bring something new and put pressure on UEFA to change how they approach the game. The CL is getting stale, and UEFA shows no interest to deal with some issues.

They are not at all hoping ESL happens or too 'chickenshit' to deal with backlash as reason for not yet leaving.

It is all about agreed sanctions if withdraw from it that they are trying to avoid.

Those EPL clubs are done with the ESL.

They made huge error in approach and should have made it more accessible and about pointing to UEFA corruption, how much cash they take from game and failing to deal with racism etc.

EPL clubs dont need it at all only fear for them was getting left behind but a ESL free Europe suits them better than being in it.

 

[Mateka]

The EPL when launched included promotion and relegation. Excluding this from the ESL meant it was dead in the water in the UK before it began.

 

[serghei]

They are not at all hoping ESL happens or too 'chickenshit' to deal with backlash as reason for not yet leaving.

It is all about agreed sanctions if withdraw from it that they are trying to avoid.

Those EPL clubs are done with the ESL.

They made huge error in approach and should have made it more accessible and about pointing to UEFA corruption, how much cash they take from game and failing to deal with racism etc.

If the EPL clubs are done with ESL, no problem. They still look like clowns. More so than clubs like Barca or Madrid.

And as said above, formats can be changed. The problem is UEFA is trying to block the ability to propose an alternative to what they are providing. And this is not right.

The stance of Barca and Madrid right now is that they have the right to plan football competitions outside of UEFA's ruling. I fail to see what is the big problem of UEFA, as long as Barca and Madrid adhere to the rules of UEFA in the competitions they take part in.

 

[JamDav1982]

If the EPL clubs are done with ESL, no problem. They still look like clowns. More so than clubs like Barca or Madrid.

And as said above, formats can be changed. The problem is UEFA is trying to block the ability to propose an alternative to what they are providing. And this is not right.

Dont really care who looks like clowns but reason they have not withdrawn is fear of sanctions not anything to do with hoping still goes ahead.

Barca, Real and Juve wont think it has any chance either but probably either want cash off the clubs who withdrew or want to face up to UEFA and clarify how much power they actually do have to stop such a league in future..or both.

I would guess Barca/Real/Juve will see is as some kind of victory when they receive no sanctions and have weakened UEFAs stance on how much they can do to stop such a league and in turn the power big clubs have on set up of CL etc.

 

[serghei]

Dont really care who looks like clowns but reason they have not withdrawn is fear of sanctions not anything to do with hoping still goes ahead.

Barca, Real and Juve wont think it has any chance either but probably either want cash off the clubs who withdrew or want to face up to UEFA and clarify how much power they actually do have to stop such a league in future..or both.

I even said it myself. They are scared of backlash.

Barca, Real, and Juve have no problem imo. UEFA is abusing its powers if they ban them, and if UEFA play with fire and are put in their place on Federal Courts, Barca, Madrid, and Juve end up looking like bosses that put UEFA in their corner.

UEFA are coming off as major crooks and authoritarian. They should have let it at that. ESL is a nearly dead project without EPL clubs. Let Barca, Madrid, Juve think of it until they get bored. But UEFA want to display their absolute power so much, that they just can't stand some clubs hold their ground and didn't come back to them with their tails between their legs like silly children that misbehaved.

This is purely an exercise where UEFA wants to put these clubs back in line. To show how strong they are. They had a very strong position, but are overplaying their hand with this.

 

[JamDav1982]

I even said it myself. They are scared of backlash.

That is long done.

The backlash came and they dont want ESL anymore but they are not too scared to leave and hope to go again as made out.

 

[Messigician]

Nice spin but the fact they have no legal grounds to punish means they have no leverage.

Without leverage the lawsuit the English clubs filed against Madrid, barca and juve has little to stand on and whatever penalty imposed for abandoning the project would be all but certain.

 

[JamDav1982]

Nice spin but the fact they have no legal grounds to punish means they have no leverage.

Without leverage the lawsuit the English clubs filed against Madrid, barca and juve has little to stand on and whatever penalty imposed for abandoning the project would be all but certain.

Nice spin?

You just come out with meaningless cliches?

 

[Luftstalag14]

Not quite.

The press has stated there are fines for leaving the agreement and they dont want to pay those so if gets abandoned by all its over.

Nothing to do with being hypocrites but defending their position.

Of course they are hypocrites. This is the textbook definition of hypocrisy by publicly doing one thing (announcing they are leaving the ESL and repenting their decision to join) and actually doing something the opposite (not leaving the ESL for fear of penalties or future stakes, whatever reason). An about-face made purely for PR reasons.

 

[El Gato]

Of course they are hypocrites. This is the textbook definition of hypocrisy by publicly doing one thing (announcing they are leaving the ESL and repenting their decision to join) and actually doing something the opposite (not leaving the ESL for fear of penalties or future stakes, whatever reason). An about-face made purely for PR reasons.

Repenting? Given the design they'll always fall back on 'this was a shit plan Perez+Agnelli came up with, and offered no relegation, but if there were normal relegations, we're down' or something to the effect that will suffer less backlash on home turf.

They want to leave this version of ESL - that much was clear enough from starters as soon as BoJo threatened luxury taxes and harsher work permit regulations.

Hypocrisy doesn't even matter in this business endeavour. If continental Europe decides to go with ESL 2.0 in 5-10 years while keeping English and Germans out, they would have done that about face turn anyway for their own business good, and the good of their league, which would otherwise potentially suffer from losing some talent draw.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Repenting? Given the design they'll always fall back on 'this was a shit plan Perez+Agnelli came up with, and offered no relegation, but if there were normal relegations, we're down' or something to the effect that will suffer less backlash on home turf.

They want to leave this version of ESL - that much was clear enough from starters as soon as BoJo threatened luxury taxes and harsher work permit regulations.

Hypocrisy doesn't even matter in this business endeavour. If continental Europe decides to go with ESL 2.0 in 5-10 years while keeping English and Germans out, they would have done that about face turn anyway for their own business good, and the good of their league, which would otherwise potentially suffer from losing some talent draw.

Yes, repenting as they publicly apologized and said "we are sorry" quite profusely. They might not actually mean it but they publicly said "sorry" rather sincerely. Obviously they didn't want to face any UK government sanctions and more bad PR that could potentially damage their interest.

Again, their hypocrisy lies in the fact that they said they were withdrawing and leaving but still kept their stakes in the company they formed together. If you withdraw, you really withdraw and face up all consequences, penalties or what not, not publicly saying one thing and privately placating the American investors behind the ESL (as I imagine).

 

[JamDav1982]

Of course they are hypocrites. This is the textbook definition of hypocrisy by publicly doing one thing (announcing they are leaving the ESL and repenting their decision to join) and actually doing something the opposite (not leaving the ESL for fear of penalties or future stakes, whatever reason). An about-face made purely for PR reasons.

That is not hypocrisy and it has been public knowledge and repeated constantly they have not formally withdrawn fully due to possible sanctions. No one cares or thinks that is hypocrisy on their side bar folk crying from outside.

They wont be part of ESL that is all anyone who wanted them out care about not being duped by clubs saying one thing and doing the other.

 

[Porque]

Contrarily this now gives the ESL trio time to build this project without the threat of Uefa. The fact this has (or is going to be) determined in a Swiss court was a genius move as it juristicts the current movements of FIFA and UEFA by their home country.

So now Floro can build teams teams and leagues who agree to join. Can the ESL guarantee more downside than the CL to teams from Portugal, Spain, Italy, Netherlands and possibly Russia, Turkey.

If the answer is yes then we can very well see a breakaway with a ESL consisting of Spanish, Italian, Portuguese teams and a CL consisting of English, French (well PSG), German teams.

EFL can easily win the global tv viewership if they do the opposite of the CL and focus on streaming service + Freeview rights sales (obv they would be blacklisted in the UK because of government intervention, and they say no monopoly exists lol).

From this you can see that the key battle ground would be Germany. The CL would just become a glorified EPL cup without the German, Spanish, Italian sides while the ESL would appear kind of week with just the top Spanish and Italian sides.

The last to join would be the EPL and only after proof of concept and proof of success.

This is how I see it playing out in all likelehood. It would be a marathon, not a sprint as Florentino foolishly initially thought.