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Maradona37

Well-known member
Gazzznigga said:
Dont get what you are writing about, man. much of here and there and all not adding up. Maybe you just felt like jumping in on this one.

So what did they pay 60m and also letting go of a more skilled, more experienced,more versatile, less injury prone and higher valued player with a far lower TCO if not for an assurance/guarantee that the replacement will help in "beating" big teams....C'mon man!!!

Buying Olmo for that much and dispensing a "better but older legs" could only have been induced either by an "assurance" that you will "beat" big teams with him otherwise it is plain buffoonery(no other way to spin it).
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Apparently it's my posts not adding up, when you are still saying that Olmo assures/guarantees beating big teams. NOONE SAID THAT, SO IT'S A STRAWMAN. Who said that? Did Barca say it? You keep making arguments noone has said. Nobody said that Gundogan is worse than Olmo, or that Olmo is a guarantee in beating big teams.

Teams don't sign new players because they think it guarantees beating teams. Is that what you read into this? That's insane. There's no guarantees in football, Yes, maybe they think Olmo gives them more chance than Gundogan of being successful (which I think is a reasonable view for reasons later in my post), but they aren't guaranteeing it. How the fuck do you make that leap? You've made a leap from A to M there. This is something you have made up in your head and are now claiming everyone else thinks. It's fucking laughable pal.

Clubs sign players hoping to improve their squad. If you think they buy players and think 'right, that is us DEFINITELY winning La Liga and the CL as we have Olmo/Olise/whoever now' then you're living in la la land. Do you think clubs are that dumb? They're well aware of the competition at the elite level of the game and one player not being the difference.

I don't know what TCO is. Either way, you can't really say what I am saying isn't adding up when you're the one putting words in the other lad's mouth.

Also, I never said Gundogan is an inferior player to Olmo. But he is getting older and is not prime Gundogan anymore, and providing (huge if) Olmo stays fit, he's one for the future. I also agree it was probably unnecessary to spend so much on Olmo in barca's predicament, But...

While I am a big big fan of Gundogan as a player, I am of Olmo too and believe you are underselling him. You're talking about him like he's a poor player when he is not. He's a very gifted technical player and has a high football IQ too.

And again, stop building arguments out of straw men - nobody has fucking said it's an assurance or guarantee Barca will beat big teams with him in the side. You can't guarantee wins against anyone, whether you have Olmo, Gundogan, Messi, R9, Maradona etc. Football isn't a game of guarantees. The only buffoonery I see here is you making up lies about what people have said. Unless someone did say that on a previous page, in which case I apologise.

Either way, you know I agree Olmo guarantees nothing. But neither did Gundogan. It's not like Barca were pulling up trees with Gundogan in the team either.

Honestly, you're just coming across as a hysterical Gundogan fanboy who can't handle any criticism of him, with your constant exclamation marks and outbursts. Yes he's a great player, but he's not infallible.
 
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Gazzznigga

Active member
Nonsense. Funny how you needed writing an epsitle with beffudled and more convoluted reasoning over something so basic.

Someone stated that Barca went for olmo because he will help "beat" big teams compared to Gundo's tired legs. If that was the reason for spending 60m extra for Olmo, it must have been based on assurance or guarantee that you will beat bigger teams or do better with Olmo than Gundo. Simple.

Besides, I am not even a fan of Gundo, I am.just not delusional about praising the transfer of Olmo as if ut was one ingenious plan made from heaven to replace one terrible player

Dont have time for nonsense.
 
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Maradona37

Well-known member
How does 'help beat big teams' equal 'assures or guarantees beating big teams'?

Read what i said again. Maybe some of the guys think chances are increased with Olmo rather than Gundogan, that's a fair shout. But guaranteed? No. You can't guarantee anything in football.

' reason for spending 60m extra for Olmo, it must have been based on assurance or guarantee that you will beat bigger teams or do better with Olmo than Gundo. Simple.'

NO IT ISN'T. It's based on increasing the likelihood, not guaranteeing it. For fuck sake. it's what you said at the end - do better. Do better is not the same as assuring you'll win.

I can't believe I am having to explain something so rudimentary. Banging my fucking head against a brick wall here.
 
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Maradona37

Well-known member
Think of it like this.

You might have 45 percent shot of beating Real Madrid with Gundogan. Maybe Barca and Olmo fans think that goes up 5-10 percent with Olmo instead. Whether they're right or not isn't the argument.

Hence it's worth it in their eyes. But nobody is saying it's 100 percent or even 95 percent likely.
 
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Maradona37

Well-known member
' I am.just not delusional about praising the transfer of Olmo as if ut was one ingenious plan made from heaven to replace one terrible player'

This is more fucking straw man bollocks - you're a weak debater as your only trick is to induce logical fallacies.

Nobody had claimed Olmo is the messiah, or Gundogan is awful. You've made that argument up and then called other people delusional based on an extreme position nobody has took. Thinking Olmo offers more than present Gundogan is not equal to saying Olmo is Messi and Gundogan is hopeless.

Just fuck off with your lies and poor faith arguing.

And, despite your protests, you're clearly a big fan of Gundogan. Nobody who isn't would read such irrational bollocks into this and get so emotional and misconstrue what people have said. You are on the defensive as you love Gundogan, and see this as people thinking Olmo is light years better because of that defensive nature. Hence the tantrums and fallacies.
 
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serghei

serghei

Senior Member
Nobody thinks Olmo is better than peak Gundogan. The argument in favor of Olmo is because Gundogan is on the decline. Decline can come quickly post 33-34 years old.
 
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Gazzznigga

Active member
Maradona37 said:
How does 'help beat big teams' equal 'assures or guarantees beating big teams'?

Read what i said again. Maybe some of the guys think chances are increased with Olmo rather than Gundogan, that's a fair shout. But guaranteed? No. You can't guarantee anything in football.

' reason for spending 60m extra for Olmo, it must have been based on assurance or guarantee that you will beat bigger teams or do better with Olmo than Gundo. Simple.'

NO IT ISN'T. It's based on increasing the likelihood, not guaranteeing it. For fuck sake. it's what you said at the end - do better. Do better is not the same as assuring you'll win.

I can't believe I am having to explain something so rudimentary. Banging my fucking head against a brick wall here.
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Dont understand why you are being so touchy and hysterical on this.

I am not even a fan of Gundo like i have said up there. I came into this discussion when people were making it seem like it was an ingenious plan by the board to get rid of a very bad and overpaid player in Gundo by going for Olmo snd as typical of some deluded ones here, began to bash Gundo. Every reasonable and non delusional being knew it was a face saving if not a very dumb move on the part of the board for a hard to come by 60m. So your angle of reasoning especially on me being a touchy Gundo fanboy is warped to start with. I am not surpised though, delusion most times make their hosts attack preconcievedly albeit blindly.

On the rest of gibberish you wrote, i decided to ignore, there are better things to expend one's energy on than some foaming in the mouth of a fellow with so much IQ to label a serial winner as having a "wasted" career just for reasons he ashamedly and admittedly agree were stupid.

As I typed up there, dont have time for nonsense and delusions.
 
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M

Maradona37

Well-known member
serghei said:
Nobody thinks Olmo is better than peak Gundogan. The argument in favor of Olmo is because Gundogan is on the decline. Decline can come quickly post 33-34 years old.
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You'd think this line of argument would be obvious but apparently not.

It also doesn't mean that Olmo is suddenly the best player on Earth, and Gundogan is a pub player, as Gazzznigga implied.
 
serghei

serghei

Senior Member
These old players we brought as free agents and paid them big salaries, they were always meant as a short term option in ideal terms. And with Gundogan, a good option on the market presented itself in Olmo, and we made the move. Completely logical.
 
M

Maradona37

Well-known member
Gazzznigga said:
Dont understand why you are being so touchy and hysterical on this.

I am not even a fan of Gundo like i have said up there. I came into this discussion when people were making it seem like it was an ingenious plan by the board to get rid of a very bad and overpaid player in Gundo by going for Olmo snd as typical of some deluded ones here, began to bash Gundo. Every reasonable and non delusional being knew it was a face saving if not a very dumb move on the part of the board for a hard to come by 60m. So your angle of reasoning especially on me being a touchy Gundo fanboy is warped to start with. I am not surpised though, delusion most times make their hosts attack preconcievedly albeit blindly.

On the rest of gibberish you wrote, i decided to ignore, there are better things to expend one's energy on than some foaming in the mouth of a fellow with so much IQ to label a serial winner as having a "wasted" career just for reasons he ashamedly admittedly agreed were stupid.

As I typed up there, dont have time for nonsense and delusions.
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I am getting annoyed because I hate logical fallacies, and you keep using them.

You're obviously a troll, and yes you are indeed a Gundogan fanboy. Nobody who isn't gets this hysterical. You're in denial pal.

I also don't know what you are talking about with wasted career - Varane made the most of his talent. I never disagreed with that. He won more than he should have based on his ability, and was never one of the best players at Real Madrid (but yes with France).

I ignored the rest of that thread because idiots like you were talking absolute nonsense and I can't be bothered coming down to your clueless level.

'
I came into this discussion when people were making it seem like it was an ingenious plan by the board to get rid of a very bad and overpaid player in Gundo by going for Olmo'
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lol who said this? I saw a lot of praise for Gundogan and claims he was too good for Barca anyway.

Few points:

Thinking Olmo is a better bet at this point than Gundogan doesn't mean Gundogan is rubbish now, or wasn't a superior player in the past, or won't go down as the superior player when all is said and done;

I never said it was the right move to spend 60m on Olmo;

Your posts in here make zero sense. I am gonna add you to ignore I think. I will read your posts on bigotry etc, that I agree with, but not your football posts.
 
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