A non paying passenger at that !
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Ivan Rakitić
- Thread starter Barcaman
- Start date
A non paying passenger at that !
Raketa10
Senior Member
Of course there are more than 5 games he was good. IMHO except El Classico, he was good against Tottenham (away), Espanyol, Inter (both games), PSV (home), few games in the beginning of the season etc. but now you'll say no he wasn't and we are in no-mans land again.
Raki is today very different player than he was under Lucho (first year) and I honestly like him more as DM. He was also great in that position during WC. He has PERFECT long ball and great tactical awareness. His last pass is also very good and his long shots are excellent. I agree that he is bad one on one and in tight spaces, he is slow as turtle and he doesn't take to much risks. I am aware of all of that. That's why I said he could never reach the level of Xavi or Madric. I am also aware that his way of playing is different than Barca used to have that's why I am looking forward to De Jong and that's the reason I said we should sell him next summer.
Sorin
Well-known member
Can we stop using stats as the be all and end all for evaluating a player? Especially for a CM. Otherwise you'd have Gerard and Lampard as better than Iniesta by some distance when in reality it's the other way around. Or Matic being better than Busquets.
Fact is, you don't need stats to see that Rakitic just doesn't bring enough for a CM that wants to start for a team like Barcelona. He can't control a match trough his movements and passing, he's not good enough for a B2B workhorse since he is too slow and not really that physical, he can't dribble and is not creative enough for a more advanced role in the midfield. He can do a bit of everything but he doesn't really excel at anything. I'd rather have a specialist in one area than a jack of all trades like Rakitic.
As for comparisons with what we have:
- Arthur is better at in the movement and passing areas; he's also much better at beating the press.
- Arturo Vidal is a better B2B midfielder, better mobility, stronger, covers more ground.
- Busquets is just as slow as Rakitic but he still thinks faster than Rakitic. Can still read the game from the DM position better than Rakitic because he knows when to drop between the CB to help them advance the ball forward but he also knows when the CM are being pressed and need another outlet to pass the ball to and pitches in mid. Rakitic just camps as the 3rd CB and that's it. Having said this, the difference between them is not that large and he can slot in his place for half the games to keep both of them fresh.
He's better than all the others so I'm not gonna compare him any further.
Anyway, he can still be quite valuable for another team where there's slightly less pressure and the system could help his profile more. It's just not for Barcelona and that's why we should sell him in the summer while he still holds some value. The guy will be 31 in march and he won't have more than 2 or 3 seasons max at this level if that.
Fact is, you don't need stats to see that Rakitic just doesn't bring enough for a CM that wants to start for a team like Barcelona. He can't control a match trough his movements and passing, he's not good enough for a B2B workhorse since he is too slow and not really that physical, he can't dribble and is not creative enough for a more advanced role in the midfield. He can do a bit of everything but he doesn't really excel at anything. I'd rather have a specialist in one area than a jack of all trades like Rakitic.
As for comparisons with what we have:
- Arthur is better at in the movement and passing areas; he's also much better at beating the press.
- Arturo Vidal is a better B2B midfielder, better mobility, stronger, covers more ground.
- Busquets is just as slow as Rakitic but he still thinks faster than Rakitic. Can still read the game from the DM position better than Rakitic because he knows when to drop between the CB to help them advance the ball forward but he also knows when the CM are being pressed and need another outlet to pass the ball to and pitches in mid. Rakitic just camps as the 3rd CB and that's it. Having said this, the difference between them is not that large and he can slot in his place for half the games to keep both of them fresh.
He's better than all the others so I'm not gonna compare him any further.
Anyway, he can still be quite valuable for another team where there's slightly less pressure and the system could help his profile more. It's just not for Barcelona and that's why we should sell him in the summer while he still holds some value. The guy will be 31 in march and he won't have more than 2 or 3 seasons max at this level if that.
Arizona Scott
New member
Yea, obviously keep the Classico out it. It not only is the most historical rivalry in football but generally it has matched the two best teams in the world since Rakitic arrived at Barca. It is often the matches with the singularly highest level of football displayed on a pitch in a given year. I get it, you are just focused on CL round 8 & 4 ties, which has also happened with dips in Barca's whole team' form in March-April for most of the last 8 years running (pre and post Rakitic BTW). Lots of reasons for this and I have been extremely frustrated with Enrique and Valverde's rotations leading up to some CL matches we were very lifeless and our opponents we all in and full of life, in these matches Barca was a shadow of the energy & quality Barca had been playing most October-Feb periods. Rakitic at times could be lifeless in some big matches, like a lot of other key players including Suarez, Iniesta, Busi, Roberto, too. Even Messi wasn't his best most of those matches. I can point to each of those losses relative to energy and sometimes injuries sustained in sets of league and CDR matches leading up to those collapses @Atleti, @PSG, @Juv, @Roma In fact one of the elements to Enrique's treble was that Suarez and Neymar came on strong after Messi carried them on his back to the semis. In that team we also had Xavi providing high quality sub minutes, so Iniesta and Rakitic could be managed better between matches and subbed within the matches. I'll be honest, IMO I don't think Rakitic should be used as a 90 minute player. The only midfielder we have maybe a 90 minute player is Busi, because he doesn't do as much running, doesn't need to in his role and his mind for the game. And I want Busi to get every 1/rd game off too, or at least mostly off (just get him in last 1/4 if we have a slim lead and need some more control).
Stats are far more useful to compare players on the same team, in similar positions. There the conditions are relatively constant. So yes the season stats on what they show on Rakitic, Busi, Arthur and Vidal are useful. Particularly with off the wall comments like Rakitic sticks out like a sore thumb and those others are so much better. They are not. They all have strengths and the all have limitations--so more when we have the ball and some more defending. Some when we need more discipline and some when we need a kick in the pants to emotionally get into the game. None is on the same planet right now as a prime Xavi, Iniesta, Modric, Pirlo, Gerrard, (or even a prime Busi--which we don't have). Each however is a Barca quality, capable and situational player. It is now great we have 4 at this level, we haven't been better in the midfield depth since Xavi retired--Paulhino, Turan, Gomes, Denis, Roberto, Samper--just were not Barca quality midfielders and the drop off too big when we played them.
I believe your assessment is close on Rakitic but misses other elements (doesn't acknowledge his clearences, that he is the best of our midfielders in contributing to set pieces (defensively and offensively)--though concur he is a bit of the jack of all trades type relative to the others and some of the others have some attributes better than he has.
It also doesn’t fully acknowledge…Vidal is the least accurate in his passing and most like to leave us with 10 men…Arthur has yet to compete in the most pressured situations and against the kinds of physically and athletically imposing midfields and pressuring forwards that we would encounter vs City or Liverpool or Bayern. (having said this looking forward to see how he reacts vs Lyon and when we can clinch the league by beating Atleti, and the next classico—if he passes all these test maybe I will feel he is ready to start vs Liverpool, City, Bayern when those ties happen). And Busquets. Despite so many great things he is the most likely to be exposed on a counter, as even as smart he is if he is too far upfield and we have a sloppy TO he isn’t going to be able to get back in the play. All 4 have some warts, and lots of positive attributes. This is why this year we need all 4 to be at their best—and Rakitic IMO is the 1-2nd most important but if someone wants to say yes he is important but I think he should be the 4th of these 4, I don’t agree but I can accept that point of view just fine.
For the record I think we should sign Rabiot of a free, and with their consent, sell one of Rakitic or Busi to the highest bigger (EPL, PSG, Bayern) and keep the other for at least two years while FDJ adapts to playing with 10x the quality of his teammates and 5x the quality of regular opposition. I am not seeing Rakiti through a sentimental lens any more than I am seeing Busquets from one. I think getting rid of Vidal’s wages (given them to the 23 year old Rabiot) is also probably the right thing to do. I say on one swoop get a young core midfield of FDJ, Arthur, Rabiot, with experimenting Alena and Coutinho in there in the most advantage position, and have one seasoned vet (Busi or Rakitic) for substitution, stability and teaching. But that is next year, this year we will need fresh Rakitic, Busi and Vidal to go along with growing Arthur to finish the season like we hope.
BusiTheKing
Senior Member
let's hope Sevilla decide to field only 10 players tonight
Absolutely fantastic assessment !
BusiTheKing
Senior Member
We've had a habit of keeping players with goodwill on for too long as long as they offer anything above the absolute minimum of what would be expected. In the short run, the complacency suffocates the possiblity of us reaching the heights required for winning key CL figures. In the long run, it's an unsustainable strategy which ensures turbulent generational shifts and missing out on top talent.
CatalinR10
Senior Member
wanted to control the ball , instead his touch made the ball go into the net
now he will be unbenchable forever
unreal.
now he will be unbenchable forever
unreal.
George_Costanza
Active member
Good game homie
Enjoy your life
Banned
what a b.s!!
in fact it is opposite! !
fans will call raki a shit every match no matter what........
suarez and raki most underrated players.
same thing happen with cr7 and madrid. fans called him a shit even though they were winning cl every year. now look.....
u will understand how good our senior players r when they retire and we struggle to win league and do even worse in CL! !
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