Lionel Messi - v7

[Sailor Mars]

Bayern battered team in the CL and beat PSG when Neymar and Mbappe were poor.

PSG beat Dortmund, Atalanta and Liepzig to get there. They did not beat one top team.

If he was voting based on CL clearly Bayern players is the realistic choice.

Bayern was a much more complete team 1-11 and even including the bench.

PSG is a team built with flaws, so it is very possible Messi appreciated those select players' performances in taking PSG to the Champions League Final, and making it a close final.

 

[JamDav1982]

Bayern was a much more complete team 1-11 and even including the bench.

PSG is a team built with flaws, so it is very possible Messi appreciated those select players' performances in taking PSG to the Champions League Final, and making it a close final.

PSG had better more expensive team than every side they eliminated.

Navas didnt play the semi and lost the final... is Messi naming him best keeper in what he did to get them past Atalanta in QF?

Mbappe getting the vote for failing to score in knockout stages and getting a couple of assists against average sides?

The idea that PSG had great individuals that took them far falls flat when look at teams they beat and how much Navas/Mbappe really did.

 

[Sailor Mars]

PSG had better more expensive team than every side they eliminated.

Navas didnt play the semi and lost the final... is Messi naming him best keeper in what he did to get them past Atalanta in QF?

Mbappe getting the vote for failing to score in knockout stages and getting a couple of assists against average sides?

The idea that PSG had great individuals that took them far falls flat when look at teams they beat and how much Navas/Mbappe really did.

Navas was immense in the QF against Atalanta. Kept PSG in it with some big saves so that they could pull of the late game dramatics. And was solid as usual in another final.
Often times, voters do take into account previous performances beyond the last season. Navas' 3 peat in the CL and his performances for Real Madrid in the league and specifically El Clasicos wouldve factored in.

In regards to Mbappe, it isn't just Messi voting him that high. Several other voters placed him in their top 3 and he eventually finished 7th. It's not some off the board vote. And could be just appreciation for a talented prodigy, much like Messi was at that age.

How expensive the PSG team does not necessarily speak to the quality. We've seen it with Barca spending hundreds of millions on subpar players.

 

[JamDav1982]

Navas was immense in the QF against Atalanta. Kept PSG in it with some big saves so that they could pull of the late game dramatics. And was solid as usual in another final.
Often times, voters do take into account previous performances beyond the last season. Navas' 3 peat in the CL and his performances for Real Madrid in the league and specifically El Clasicos wouldve factored in.

In regards to Mbappe, it isn't just Messi voting him that high. Several other voters placed him in their top 3 and he eventually finished 7th. It's not some off the board vote. And could be just appreciation for a talented prodigy, much like Messi was at that age.

How expensive the PSG team does not necessarily speak to the quality. We've seen it with Barca spending hundreds of millions on subpar players.

So Navas having a good game in QF and not being in a winning team outweighs Neuer who was immense in final and winning side? But now it is not the CL it is previous seasons Navas got the vote for.....

Messi voted them to make a statement. Keep clutching trying to make it about some great individual performances in CL which was not reality.

PSG were more expensive AND BETTER than every team they beat so this idea Neymar, Mbappe and Navas dragged them there against odds is a farce.

 

[Sailor Mars]

So Navas having a good game in QF outweighs Neuer who was immense in final and winning side?

Messi voted them to make a statement. Keep clutching trying to make it about some great individual performances in CL which was not reality.

PSG were more expensive AND BETTER than every team they beat so this idea Neymar, Mbappe and Navas dragged them there against odds is a farce.

Neuer had a great season, but his team in front of him was also much better. Different voters appreciate different things and voting for Navas is perfectly reasonable.

Likewise, you can continue to keep clutching at straws that Messi's voting was to make a statement. All a matter of individual opinion.

I agree here that PSG was the better side, but a big reason they were a better side was that they had some great performances from specific players.

 

[JamDav1982]

Neuer had a great season, but his team in front of him was also much better. Different voters appreciate different things and voting for Navas is perfectly reasonable.

Likewise, you can continue to keep clutching at straws that Messi's voting was to make a statement. All a matter of individual opinion.

I agree here that PSG was the better side, but a big reason they were a better side was that they had some great performances from specific players.

Voting for Navas is nothing but politics as is putting Ney and Mbappe 1 & 2.

Players playing worse but given excuse as in poorer team doesnt cut it when there are players playing better and helping their teams win.

The fact you tried to justify it as if Navas and Mbappe/Neymar individually took PSG to CL final is false and also no huge achievement to beat teams better than. That is best you can come up with says it all.

PSG were better sides than those teams across the park. Terrible argument anway when try to say it is about individuals when three of them on same team. It is a contradiction.

Thats me done with this one. Keep up the fight for all things Messi.

 

[KingLeo10]

MSN 2021-2022 at PSG. Watch this space.

No literally, watch that space on the counter...

 

[Sailor Mars]

Voting for Navas is nothing but politics as is putting Ney and Mbappe 1 & 2.

Players playing worse but given excuse as in poorer team doesnt cut it when there are players playing better and helping their teams win.

The fact you tried to justify it as if Navas and Mbappe/Neymar individually took PSG to CL final is false and also no huge achievement to beat teams better than. That is best you can come up with says it all.

PSG were better sides than those teams across the park. Terrible argument anway when try to say it is about individuals when three of them on same team. It is a contradiction.

Thats me done with this one. Keep up the fight for all things Messi.

I don't think my argument was terrible at all. It was a pretty good one. The voting is for individual performances.


A terrible argument would be more along the lines of saying something like Messi voted the way he did because he is playing child like games, winking at PSG for a move, and perhaps being a petulant child.

 

[JamDav1982]

I don't think my argument was terrible at all. It was a pretty good one. The voting is for individual performances.


A terrible argument would be more along the lines of saying something like Messi voted the way he did because he is playing child like games, winking at PSG for a move, and perhaps being a petulant child.

'Voting is for individual performances' is not the terrible part. The terrible part of argument is applying that logic to those PSG players...to argue Mbappe was voted second best player based on that or Neymar the best when both failed against the one decent team came up against and in case of Mbappe was not great individually against those weaker teams they beat anyway.

Voting Mbappe no2 in world based on CL performance where he was poor in final and didnt score in any knockout games or was even fit enough to perform to any great level. Marquinhos and Choupo Mouting scored more...Great individual performance that.

Vote Navas best because he had a good QF and didnt win another game.

Terrible argument and naive to boot.

Ignore the other players that won and were better individually.

 

[FC433]

Picked every single PSG player. You will find the voting breakdown in the References section at the very end: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Best_FIFA_Football_Awards_2020

 

[Sailor Mars]

'Voting is for individual performances' is not the terrible part. The terrible part of argument is applying that logic to those PSG players...to argue Mbappe was voted second best player based on that or Neymar the best when both failed against the one decent team came up against and in case of Mbappe was not great individually against those weaker teams they beat anyway.

Voting Mbappe no2 in world based on CL performance where he was poor in final and didnt score in any knockout games or was even fit enough to perform to any great level. Marquinhos and Choupo Mouting scored more...Great individual performance that.

Vote Navas best because he had a good QF and didnt win another game.

Terrible argument and naive to boot.

Ignore the other players that won and were better individually.

There is not a clear cut option for best goalkeeper, especially if one is of the opinion that Neuer had a great season because of the team in front of him. Many people were calling Neuer past his prime the past 2 years. Some people might attribute Neuer's great season more to his team's performance rather than his. Again, all a matter of opinion.

Mbappe did return from an ankle injury in the QF and gave the assist late in the game. While he missed some "sitters" in the final, he did have a strong game overall.


You are entitled to your opinion regarding Messi's voting choices. I just strongly disagree with the notion that he did this to send a message, or that he is playing games. I think his voting choices can be explained my some of the reasoning I already provided above.

 

[JamDav1982]

There is not a clear cut option for best goalkeeper, especially if one is of the opinion that Neuer had a great season because of the team in front of him. Many people were calling Neuer past his prime the past 2 years. Some people might attribute Neuer's great season more to his team's performance rather than his. Again, all a matter of opinion.

Mbappe did return from an ankle injury in the QF and gave the assist late in the game. While he missed some "sitters" in the final, he did have a strong game overall.


You are entitled to your opinion regarding Messi's voting choices. I just strongly disagree with the notion that he did this to send a message, or that he is playing games. I think his voting choices can be explained my some of the reasoning I already provided above.

Just had a look back and a last summer and few months previous you were claiming Neymar is slow, fat and lost a yard of pace... now Messi votes him best in world it is being justified for a couple of assist v Liepzig and Atalanta and failing v Bayern in final.

Mbappe was poor in knockouts and missed sitters you are correct.. he didnt have a strong game in final and those sitters count.

Of course he did it to send a message. There is no chance in hell he thinks Neymar and Mbappe were 1&2 with Navas best GK.

 

[Respekt_III]

Keep digging that hole sailor mars. Just accept the reality

 

[Sailor Mars]

Just had a look back and a last summer and few months previous you were claiming Neymar is slow, fat and lost a yard of pace... now Messi votes him best in world it is being justified for a couple of assist v Liepzig and Atalanta and failing v Bayern in final.

Mbappe was poor in knockouts and missed sitters you are correct.. he didnt have a strong game in final and those sitters count.

Of course he did it to send a message. There is no chance in hell he thinks Neymar and Mbappe were 1&2 with Navas best GK.

Neymar is still slower, fatter, and has lost a yard of pace compared to his Barca days. But he put together a very good Champions league campaign. Good stats, and visually by the eye test he performed well.

And no, Messi didn't vote to send a message. He voted because he saw them as the 2 best players and the best GK this year (perhaps past performances and friendship might have influenced him as well). He most certainly was not a petulant child playing games.

In a shortened year with Covid, a strong performance in a short stretch of meaningful games is all that is needed to gain votes.

 

[Sailor Mars]

Keep digging that hole sailor mars. Just accept the reality

The reality that Messi voted genuinely and did not vote to send some sort of message? I've accepted that reality.