Lionel Messi - v7

[Porque]

I still think Messi is completely focused on Copa and will consider options once it ended. Ultimately he will stay, but negotiations won't make much progress during Copa.

If they lose the final to Brasil, he may strop and decide to retire [for a few months].


New best case scenario.

Brasil beat Argentina 5-0.
Messi retires.
January Messi decides to come out of retirement and sign for MLS team for 6 months.
Messi signs for Barcelona next Summer

 

[DonAK]

Sounds more and more like the realistic outcome is that Messi will join PSG or Man City after Copa America.

None of our players, some of them leeches, want to leave.

 

[Rassvet]

Ronaldo signing an extension at Juve while Messi wins Copa to seal #7 and then joins PSG or City

 

[khaled_a_d]

That would leave us with:

GK: ter Stegen, Pena
Defenders: Pique, Araujo, Mingueza, Garcia; Alba, Dest, Emerson
Midfielders: FdJ, Pedri, Busquets, Puig, Moriba, Collado
Attackers: Aguero, Fati, Depay, Messi

That's a weak-ass squad. These players we ousted may not be great, but are overall better than many left. Griezman >> Aguero & Depay, even though I'm not a fan. Dembele's got some pace. Not an ounce of pace in this attack. Lenglet isn't perfect, yet he started for us and there's a reason. Etc.

How so?
Only downgrade is Griezmann+Dembele for Depay+ Aguero

But a healthy Fati should compensate for the difference.
Midfield will get a more developed FDJ & Pedri after their first international tournament. Should get a better version of Puig & Moriba, Busquets likely be worse.
Is Lenglet really better than Eric? In Euro it surely looked the opposite, adding Emerson (one of Liga best defensive RBs last year) should improve us in that regard.
Araujo and Mingueza are no longer rookies either, Koeman is in 2nd year and getting players he actually wants.

For me it seems you ignore internal development, which is huge factor in young squad.
This squad can be at least a pretender, a team that will make you think they can win at some point before losing it. Just like last 2 years, but with far more long term reward.

 

[Luftstalag14]

IF they want to pay Messi's huge wages. Not that they can't if this is no FFP, but I don't know if they want to.

 

[DonAK]

I'd be more optimistic of us being pretenders without Messi if Ronald Koeman wasn't our manager.

Nothing Koeman has showed throughout his career makes me confident he'll be able to ride out the storm that a Messi exit would cause.

 

[Rassvet]

I think we'd struggle to be pretenders WITH Messi. Without him, we'll probably fight Villareal for top 4 at best.

 

[Luftstalag14]

I'd be more optimistic of us being pretenders without Messi if Ronald Koeman wasn't our manager.

Nothing Koeman has showed throughout his career makes me confident he'll be able to ride out the storm that a Messi exit would cause.

No manager in this world will smooth out the post-Messi transition and rebuild period though, I think no matter who is in charge it will be hard.

Of course people will always demand us to be a title contender, especially in the league and Copa del rey but honestly, people should dampen their expectations.

Worst case scenario, no Messi but we will be able to register other players, we might take a big hit on the sponsorship portion of the revenue (let's see), but we are more or less starting the next chapter, with help from La Liga. This is going to happen sooner or later, I'd rather Messi stays for at least another season to help us ride out COVID but, eh.

 

[Luftstalag14]

I think we'd struggle to be pretenders WITH Messi. Without him, we'll probably fight Villareal for top 4 at best.

I think our immediate and realistic goal post-Messi is to fight for a CL spot. I am OK with us doing so for several years during the rebuild period, without major trophies.

 

[DonAK]

No manager in this world will smooth out the post-Messi transition and rebuild period though, I think no matter who is in charge it will be hard.

Of course people will always demand us to be a title contender, especially in the league and Copa del rey but honestly, people should dampen their expectations.

Worst case scenario, no Messi but we will be able to register other players, we might take a big hit on the sponsorship portion of the revenue (let's see), but we are more or less starting the next chapter, with help from La Liga. This is going to happen sooner or later, I'd rather Messi stays for at least another season to help us ride out COVID but, eh.

We can maybe afford one year fighting to make top four, or two years. But three years is probably going to be where players like Frenkie and even Ansu start reconsidering their options.

Good players that would have multiple top level teams interested in them won't stick around for a losing project.

So if Messi leaves we need a top manager ASAP and also be able to re-invest in the squad ASAP.

I mean....we should be able to end at least 4th without Messi, but if Koeman and the team fall apart and some of the mid-table teams have strong years it could get ugly. But I would like to think it won't.

 

[Joan]

How so?
Only downgrade is Griezmann+Dembele for Depay+ Aguero

But a healthy Fati should compensate for the difference.
Midfield will get a more developed FDJ & Pedri after their first international tournament. Should get a better version of Puig & Moriba, Busquets likely be worse.
Is Lenglet really better than Eric? In Euro it surely looked the opposite, adding Emerson (one of Liga best defensive RBs last year) should improve us in that regard.
Araujo and Mingueza are no longer rookies either, Koeman is in 2nd year and getting players he actually wants.

For me it seems you ignore internal development, which is huge factor in young squad.
This squad can be at least a pretender, a team that will make you think they can win at some point before losing it. Just like last 2 years, but with far more long term reward.

I actually had it in mind but must admit I went in the other direction which is not warranted. I assumed some of those young players would certainly progress and improve (Pedri, FdJ, Araujo), but that the others would just fade away or prove to be weak choices (Mingueza, Dest). Namely, it's legit to have some concerns about Fati's future and I don't think Puig, Moriba, and Collado will help us all that much. But it's just me and I could rate these guys poorly.

You're right about Garcia in Lenglet's place and Emerson. One I'm looking forward to.

 

[khaled_a_d]

I actually had it in mind but must admit I went in the other direction which is not warranted. I assumed some of those young players would certainly progress and improve (Pedri, FdJ, Araujo), but that the others would just fade away or prove to be weak choices (Mingueza, Dest). Namely, it's legit to have some concerns about Fati's future and I don't think Puig, Moriba, and Collado will help us all that much. But it's just me and I could rate these guys poorly.

You're right about Garcia in Lenglet's place and Emerson. One I'm looking forward to.

I am not saying they will be stars suddenly, but I expect progress or at least staying same level.
Dest might not progress, but will he regress? Mingueza is limited for sure, but will he lose this fighting spirit?
Injuries can ruin any team season, if Fati or other core player get badly injured we are doomed, yeah.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Quick question, but is it me or all the dooms day news from today are coming from ESPN and goal? Arguably the two worst suorces for Barca news

 

[DonAK]

Quick question, but is it me or all the dooms day news from today are coming from ESPN and goal? Arguably the two worst suorces for Barca news

You need to look at the people behind the reports.

Moises Llorens has been the best Barcelona reporter/journalists the last few years now.

The report from GOAL comes from Adria Soldevila who works for TV3 and Cadena Ser as well, and was one of the three people who broke the Barcagate story and more or less doomed the last board.

ESPN and Goal are shit in general, but there are some reliable people working there. Messi's interview after Barto forced him to stay was with Ruben Uria who also works for GOAL.

 

[khaled_a_d]

You need to look at the people behind the reports.

Moises Llorens has been the best Barcelona reporter/journalists the last few years now.

The report from GOAL comes from Adria Soldevila who works for TV3 and Cadena Ser as well, and was one of the three people who broke the Barcagate story and more or less doomed the last board.

ESPN and Goal are shit in general, but there are some reliable people working there. Messi's interview after Barto forced him to stay was with Ruben Uria who also works for GOAL.

Maybe.
But last few years was a different board, and Barca gate was a different type of news.
As people said here, the Trincao deal proved that there is mo reliable journalist to this board. Laporta has went to war with media in his 1st term by cutting their sources.

Not saying that all news is lies, but something seems missing.
Who knows, maybe I am just in denial