Luis Suárez
- Thread starter jj_101
- Start date
henias
New member
BBZ, not true at all. Alot people weigh their good and bads, not just plainly hating as you claimed.
Neymar sure has his good side, but his flaws just seems to overwhelm his underlying talent, sad that he brought this upon himself.
You keep emphasising that Dembele is wierd in his playstyle, but ironically, you dont want Barca to play the slow possession style. Dembele is the one of the few who can turn this side into a fast counter attacking side, and he has been contributing alot ever since he started this season.
On the contrary, you seem like the biggest critic and only try to be "neutral" with opposing views just because you dont agree with them.
And you actually admitted the fact that you talked bad about players in the past but they turn out good. Your posts keep changing according to the situation to try to stay as relevant and correct as possible. The moment something change drastically you will just switch your standpoint completely, and you just make another huge prediction hoping you're right. And you talk about predictability, man, you try too hard to be unpredictable and in turn it makes you even more predictable
Neymar sure has his good side, but his flaws just seems to overwhelm his underlying talent, sad that he brought this upon himself.
You keep emphasising that Dembele is wierd in his playstyle, but ironically, you dont want Barca to play the slow possession style. Dembele is the one of the few who can turn this side into a fast counter attacking side, and he has been contributing alot ever since he started this season.
On the contrary, you seem like the biggest critic and only try to be "neutral" with opposing views just because you dont agree with them.
And you actually admitted the fact that you talked bad about players in the past but they turn out good. Your posts keep changing according to the situation to try to stay as relevant and correct as possible. The moment something change drastically you will just switch your standpoint completely, and you just make another huge prediction hoping you're right. And you talk about predictability, man, you try too hard to be unpredictable and in turn it makes you even more predictable
FinBarcelonafan
Well-known member
I'm so glad our players are taking break from NT. It feels like waste of time most of the time.
Total-Football
Senior Member
that was a nice book BBZ.. is that the book cover at the end of your post ?
Gnidrologist
Senior Member
Should've been ''Life and times of BBZ''. Sounds more classical and because a lot of times have been spent posting.
I'll reply to your post, since I made some mess, it seems.
I have said a few times that some of my posts are exaggerated on purpose and poking on purpose.
I don't have problems with your post for example, when someone says that I posted some shit. Because it is true. Some of my posts are quite bad and bs.
But that is because, imo, our forum is turning into some sort of Reddit and on the other hand into some sort of a cult.
Now I'll explain why I see it that way.
For example, I have said a lot of times, I am not too emotionally connected with any of our players. If a player is not good, I could sell anyone.
Also, if someone is not good, no matter how much I like a player, feel free to bench or sell him if you have better alternatives in a team.
For me, it is about Fc Barcelona and club's interests and not about Ballon D ors, Fc Messi, Fc Neymar or Fc Dembele.
Further, every single player has lots of flaws and lots of good sides.
And you can write a post about any player and offer a lot of statistical data and it can be accurate, even if you show only one side.
For example, Neymar:
A positive post:
1. he is a talented player
2. he was a key member of our treble
3. he scored a lot of goals
4. during one year, he was a top2-3 footballer in the world
5. overally an awesome player
So, if you write a post like that, there is nothing wrong with it. EVERYTHING in it is TRUE.
The problem is that we have seen only one side of a story in that post.
The other side is, a negative:
1. Neymar fighting with all opponents
2. showboating
3. dribbling backwards
4. slowing down the play
5. not passing enough
6. diving and antics
7. not as lethal as in the past
8. his dad, surroundings, his behavior off the field
So, you see, both these posts are 100% correct.
Anyone, as a poster, can pick a positive side, a negative side, or accept that a player has BOTH sides.
Now, my "problem" with a lot of posters on this forum is:
1. they see only positive sides from new signings (usually with young players)
2. they see only positive sides from La Masia kids
And then, since all players have BOTH pros and cons, when I am reading some topics here (new young signings or La Masia prospects), everything is too optimistic and too romantic.
People don't want to see or mention bad sides, and on majority of bad traits, replies are: he is young and has potential.
Fine, some things will be improved, but we can still mention those flaws.
Plus, there are some flaws which you can never fix, like Adama's IQ for example.
Also, another problem for me, is some sort of a cult following towards Pep and towards everything what Pep has done and HOW he has played.
Especially among youngers, aged let's say 15-25.
Since I watched Barca in 90s, Pep is NOT my favorite coach.
He won the highest amount of trophies, but I equally love Cruijff, Van Gaal, Rijkaard and Pep. And each of them has good and bad skills.
My dream Barca would take something from all 4 coaches + evolve for 2018' (which means faster football and faster players, for example).
So, I have 2 problems:
1. bias towards young players and people not willing to read about young player's flaws
2. and a cult following of Pep and how we should do more or less everything exactly the same how we did in Pep's era
And then, this is how I see it:
1. Arthur: gets hype because BOTH he is young and looks like a player from Pep's era (double amount of crazy and not objective hype, imo)
2. Rakitic: hate. He is not young. And doesn't look like a player from Pep's era. Double hate.
3. Suarez: not young anymore. Not too technical. Hate
4. Dembele: young. Love and hype.
5. Alena: young, technical, La Masia. Love
6. Rabiot: young, but not Pep's type of a player. Hate
So, some of my posts are genuine dislike of some players and their abilities and I genuinely think that they are NOT good enough for Barca.
In some cases, I am exaggerating because our forum looks like Reddit regarding some players.
Since some guys say that I hate on all players or something like that, here is my view on our current squad, to show that I don't HATE all players, lol:
1. Messi=still world class, even though weaker than prime Messi
2. Suarez=currently below our standard level. Probably good enough for LA liga title, but not good enough for a CL. On the other hand, there are no other Cfs who would be an improvement over him except Costa and Cavani, who are also older.
So, there are no young guys even close to this: not on a prime Suarez.
3. Dembele=a weird player. A lot of talent, but a questionable fit for Barca.
4. Coutinho=a world class player. Good enough for winning a CL.
5. Rakitic=very good player, useful. But I understand where are remarks how he is not on Barca's level are coming from. In terms of passing and creativity.
6. Busquets=once a world class player, currently good enough for La liga, but probably not good enough for a CL. Imo, not too much better than Suarez, similar cases.
7. Roberto/Semedo=Roberto is good enough for La liga, even though not exactly a world class. None of them is good enough for a CL probably.
8. Pique=once a world class player. Today good enough for La liga, probably a ticking bomb in a CL.
9. Umtiti=a world class, like Messi and Coutinho.
10. Alba=somewhat dumb player, but still good enough for both La Liga and a CL.
11. Mats=the only player about whom I once talked bad and who actually turned good. A world class player currently, the best with Messi, Coutinho and Umtiti.
New guys:
1. Dembele=as said: a lot of individual talent, but a lot of flaws also. He doesn't understand some basics of movement off the ball. He looks as if he never defended in his life also. Let's see how will he develop at Barca.
I still don't think that he will stay here for years and be a leader of a future Barca.
2. Arthur=what he has shown till now, I think that he naturally ISN'T a creative player. He is a controller who only controls and doesn't do too much forward.
3. Malcom=don't have any opinion, we haven't seen enough of him.
4. Lenglet=well, one of young guys whom I actually like. Imo, he has the highest chance to stay here, either as a starter or as a squad player, in 4-5 years.
Anyway, one more time: each player has both pros and cons.
Add Pep's cult into that mix, and a bias towards young players, and I feel as in some kind of a weird dreamland while reading some topics here.
Also, add bandwagon opinion of majority of posters.
For example, for years I was calling Neymar: a clown, Neyclown, how he is dribbling backwards, more show than end product, how he is slowing down the play etc.
For years I was called an idiot on his topic and with 100s of random insults and classical: you don't know shit about football.
Fast forward 2-3 years: suddenly, everyone is hating on Neymar. People are calling him a clown, Divemar and similar.
I was the most hated guy on his topic for calling him with bad names like Neyclown, today even his official topic is having insults in topic's name
When I was saying that he is diving and provoking opponents and thus the opponents are kicking him, 2-3 years ago people used to reply: No. That is not his fault. The opponents are kicking him because he is TOO GOOD (lol, wtf).
So, you see, Neymar is the same player as in Barca.
But 2-3 years ago, his current traits were "good" and people were pissed off when I pointed at those flaws in his game and called me an idiot.
Now, 3 years later, probably 80-90% of posters are mentioning those Neymar's traits in his thread as a bad thing even though he ALWAYS had those traits.
My point: you see, ALL players have BOTH good and bad sides.
While Neymar was here, people had Barca's glases and majority of people were defending him and didn't want to hear about his flaws, even though he had them.
(Someone will say now: yeah, but you always pointed ONLY his flaws, even when we won a treble. Ok, I am not the most moral poster either, but I am doing the same thing as majority: majority were too positive about his skills, I was too negative. And we were both right. The only problem was that NEITHER side was willing to accept BOTH good and bad sides of his play).
So, my post from this topic was a bs post:
But on the other hand, I am dead serious (and I think that a lot of those points stand) when I say:
1. that Dembele is a weird fit. His movement is so strange. His defending is horrible. His IQ is questionable.
2. Arthur is meh player for now for our standards due to almost zero forward passes
3. Semedo is just horrible in attack and lost equally as Dembele in off the ball movement (Dembele is good in counters and knows how to move, but is lost against parked buses. Semedo is lost both in counters and against parked buses).
So, I am accepting bad words for my posts when I write some bs, and I know that I am writing bs often, from reasons explained above since people are (imo) too not objective regarding some players and tactics.
Imo, when we'll start to see more posts like:
Dembele was very good with the ball today, but his off the ball movement needs to be better, then:
=> you will see less shitposts from TotalFootball, me and some others like: he is weird player and moves weird off the ball.
I am quite sure that a lot of negative shitposts are just an answer for overly positive: shit-hype-posts about some players.
** Anyway, off topic for the end, a behavior of some users who don't like my posts about Dembele and thus don't like me too much is quite predictable in psychology.
People are animals and we live in tribes.
In tribes, you are helping to eachother and you "fight" with other tribes who want to hurt you.
So, even if someone from your tribe is not perfect, you are on his side.
Now, in footballing sense, that means:
Barcelona is one tribe.
Barcaforum is our tribe.
Our main rival is Real Madrid. We hate them and they want to "hurt" us.
Now, on a deep psychological level, people want to stick together and NOT to talk shit about our players/or our tribe.
Add to this a basic human's need to have HOPE for a brighter future since a HOPE is pushing you forward to live and work.
In footballing sense: young players are HOPE. Dembele is a hope for our fans. Arthur is a hope for our fans. Alena is a hope for our fans.
So, you see, on a psychological level, when I am writing bad about Dembele or Arthur, I am doing a lot of deadly/animal/tribal sins:
1. I am attacking our tribe (our players). Especially when I said that CR7 has a lot of good traits. That is a a lot of deadly sins on a unconscious-tribal level.
2. further, I am killing or attacking hope and dreams of a lot of fans in the start with saying how Arthur is not good for Barca or how Dembele is extremely weird fit and with a low-ish IQ.
For example, go back now to Neymar's case and you will understand this tribal psychological behavior mentioned above.
When he was our player, in our TRIBE, people defended him and disliked tribe members who were shitting on our player (especially since he was a key member of our tribe and a HOPE for the brighter future).
But when Neymar has left us, he left our tribe in an ugly way, and people again defended our tribe: this time with shitting on a player who tuned his back on our tribe (Fc Barcelona).
So, a lot of this, at the end of a day, is about our animal nature and tribes.
So, in my situation, since I really don't like these players (as footballers for Barca):
1. I can either stay quiet and don't say anything and we can turn this into a Reddit. But less people will get annoyed.
2. or I (and some guys) can do what I am doing and then a lot of people will get offended and will always call us names.
I could, though, write less bs posts, but I am also only an animal like all of us and I get pissed off also and then I am writing some shit from time to time
So, to some extent:
man you really have plenty of time in your hands
Ronaldinho10
New member
Barcilliant
Senior Member
I'll reply to your post, since I made some mess, it seems.
I have said a few times that some of my posts are exaggerated on purpose and poking on purpose.
I don't have problems with your post for example, when someone says that I posted some shit. Because it is true. Some of my posts are quite bad and bs.
But that is because, imo, our forum is turning into some sort of Reddit and on the other hand into some sort of a cult.
Now I'll explain why I see it that way.
For example, I have said a lot of times, I am not too emotionally connected with any of our players. If a player is not good, I could sell anyone.
Also, if someone is not good, no matter how much I like a player, feel free to bench or sell him if you have better alternatives in a team.
For me, it is about Fc Barcelona and club's interests and not about Ballon D ors, Fc Messi, Fc Neymar or Fc Dembele.
Further, every single player has lots of flaws and lots of good sides.
And you can write a post about any player and offer a lot of statistical data and it can be accurate, even if you show only one side.
For example, Neymar:
A positive post:
1. he is a talented player
2. he was a key member of our treble
3. he scored a lot of goals
4. during one year, he was a top2-3 footballer in the world
5. overally an awesome player
So, if you write a post like that, there is nothing wrong with it. EVERYTHING in it is TRUE.
The problem is that we have seen only one side of a story in that post.
The other side is, a negative:
1. Neymar fighting with all opponents
2. showboating
3. dribbling backwards
4. slowing down the play
5. not passing enough
6. diving and antics
7. not as lethal as in the past
8. his dad, surroundings, his behavior off the field
So, you see, both these posts are 100% correct.
Anyone, as a poster, can pick a positive side, a negative side, or accept that a player has BOTH sides.
Now, my "problem" with a lot of posters on this forum is:
1. they see only positive sides from new signings (usually with young players)
2. they see only positive sides from La Masia kids
And then, since all players have BOTH pros and cons, when I am reading some topics here (new young signings or La Masia prospects), everything is too optimistic and too romantic.
People don't want to see or mention bad sides, and on majority of bad traits, replies are: he is young and has potential.
Fine, some things will be improved, but we can still mention those flaws.
Plus, there are some flaws which you can never fix, like Adama's IQ for example.
Also, another problem for me, is some sort of a cult following towards Pep and towards everything what Pep has done and HOW he has played.
Especially among youngers, aged let's say 15-25.
Since I watched Barca in 90s, Pep is NOT my favorite coach.
He won the highest amount of trophies, but I equally love Cruijff, Van Gaal, Rijkaard and Pep. And each of them has good and bad skills.
My dream Barca would take something from all 4 coaches + evolve for 2018' (which means faster football and faster players, for example).
So, I have 2 problems:
1. bias towards young players and people not willing to read about young player's flaws
2. and a cult following of Pep and how we should do more or less everything exactly the same how we did in Pep's era
And then, this is how I see it:
1. Arthur: gets hype because BOTH he is young and looks like a player from Pep's era (double amount of crazy and not objective hype, imo)
2. Rakitic: hate. He is not young. And doesn't look like a player from Pep's era. Double hate.
3. Suarez: not young anymore. Not too technical. Hate
4. Dembele: young. Love and hype.
5. Alena: young, technical, La Masia. Love
6. Rabiot: young, but not Pep's type of a player. Hate
So, some of my posts are genuine dislike of some players and their abilities and I genuinely think that they are NOT good enough for Barca.
In some cases, I am exaggerating because our forum looks like Reddit regarding some players.
Since some guys say that I hate on all players or something like that, here is my view on our current squad, to show that I don't HATE all players, lol:
1. Messi=still world class, even though weaker than prime Messi
2. Suarez=currently below our standard level. Probably good enough for LA liga title, but not good enough for a CL. On the other hand, there are no other Cfs who would be an improvement over him except Costa and Cavani, who are also older.
So, there are no young guys even close to this: not on a prime Suarez.
3. Dembele=a weird player. A lot of talent, but a questionable fit for Barca.
4. Coutinho=a world class player. Good enough for winning a CL.
5. Rakitic=very good player, useful. But I understand where are remarks how he is not on Barca's level are coming from. In terms of passing and creativity.
6. Busquets=once a world class player, currently good enough for La liga, but probably not good enough for a CL. Imo, not too much better than Suarez, similar cases.
7. Roberto/Semedo=Roberto is good enough for La liga, even though not exactly a world class. None of them is good enough for a CL probably.
8. Pique=once a world class player. Today good enough for La liga, probably a ticking bomb in a CL.
9. Umtiti=a world class, like Messi and Coutinho.
10. Alba=somewhat dumb player, but still good enough for both La Liga and a CL.
11. Mats=the only player about whom I once talked bad and who actually turned good. A world class player currently, the best with Messi, Coutinho and Umtiti.
New guys:
1. Dembele=as said: a lot of individual talent, but a lot of flaws also. He doesn't understand some basics of movement off the ball. He looks as if he never defended in his life also. Let's see how will he develop at Barca.
I still don't think that he will stay here for years and be a leader of a future Barca.
2. Arthur=what he has shown till now, I think that he naturally ISN'T a creative player. He is a controller who only controls and doesn't do too much forward.
3. Malcom=don't have any opinion, we haven't seen enough of him.
4. Lenglet=well, one of young guys whom I actually like. Imo, he has the highest chance to stay here, either as a starter or as a squad player, in 4-5 years.
Anyway, one more time: each player has both pros and cons.
Add Pep's cult into that mix, and a bias towards young players, and I feel as in some kind of a weird dreamland while reading some topics here.
Also, add bandwagon opinion of majority of posters.
For example, for years I was calling Neymar: a clown, Neyclown, how he is dribbling backwards, more show than end product, how he is slowing down the play etc.
For years I was called an idiot on his topic and with 100s of random insults and classical: you don't know shit about football.
Fast forward 2-3 years: suddenly, everyone is hating on Neymar. People are calling him a clown, Divemar and similar.
I was the most hated guy on his topic for calling him with bad names like Neyclown, today even his official topic is having insults in topic's name
When I was saying that he is diving and provoking opponents and thus the opponents are kicking him, 2-3 years ago people used to reply: No. That is not his fault. The opponents are kicking him because he is TOO GOOD (lol, wtf).
So, you see, Neymar is the same player as in Barca.
But 2-3 years ago, his current traits were "good" and people were pissed off when I pointed at those flaws in his game and called me an idiot.
Now, 3 years later, probably 80-90% of posters are mentioning those Neymar's traits in his thread as a bad thing even though he ALWAYS had those traits.
My point: you see, ALL players have BOTH good and bad sides.
While Neymar was here, people had Barca's glases and majority of people were defending him and didn't want to hear about his flaws, even though he had them.
(Someone will say now: yeah, but you always pointed ONLY his flaws, even when we won a treble. Ok, I am not the most moral poster either, but I am doing the same thing as majority: majority were too positive about his skills, I was too negative. And we were both right. The only problem was that NEITHER side was willing to accept BOTH good and bad sides of his play).
So, my post from this topic was a bs post:
But on the other hand, I am dead serious (and I think that a lot of those points stand) when I say:
1. that Dembele is a weird fit. His movement is so strange. His defending is horrible. His IQ is questionable.
2. Arthur is meh player for now for our standards due to almost zero forward passes
3. Semedo is just horrible in attack and lost equally as Dembele in off the ball movement (Dembele is good in counters and knows how to move, but is lost against parked buses. Semedo is lost both in counters and against parked buses).
So, I am accepting bad words for my posts when I write some bs, and I know that I am writing bs often, from reasons explained above since people are (imo) too not objective regarding some players and tactics.
Imo, when we'll start to see more posts like:
Dembele was very good with the ball today, but his off the ball movement needs to be better, then:
=> you will see less shitposts from TotalFootball, me and some others like: he is weird player and moves weird off the ball.
I am quite sure that a lot of negative shitposts are just an answer for overly positive: shit-hype-posts about some players.
** Anyway, off topic for the end, a behavior of some users who don't like my posts about Dembele and thus don't like me too much is quite predictable in psychology.
People are animals and we live in tribes.
In tribes, you are helping to eachother and you "fight" with other tribes who want to hurt you.
So, even if someone from your tribe is not perfect, you are on his side.
Now, in footballing sense, that means:
Barcelona is one tribe.
Barcaforum is our tribe.
Our main rival is Real Madrid. We hate them and they want to "hurt" us.
Now, on a deep psychological level, people want to stick together and NOT to talk shit about our players/or our tribe.
Add to this a basic human's need to have HOPE for a brighter future since a HOPE is pushing you forward to live and work.
In footballing sense: young players are HOPE. Dembele is a hope for our fans. Arthur is a hope for our fans. Alena is a hope for our fans.
So, you see, on a psychological level, when I am writing bad about Dembele or Arthur, I am doing a lot of deadly/animal/tribal sins:
1. I am attacking our tribe (our players). Especially when I said that CR7 has a lot of good traits. That is a a lot of deadly sins on a unconscious-tribal level.
2. further, I am killing or attacking hope and dreams of a lot of fans in the start with saying how Arthur is not good for Barca or how Dembele is extremely weird fit and with a low-ish IQ.
For example, go back now to Neymar's case and you will understand this tribal psychological behavior mentioned above.
When he was our player, in our TRIBE, people defended him and disliked tribe members who were shitting on our player (especially since he was a key member of our tribe and a HOPE for the brighter future).
But when Neymar has left us, he left our tribe in an ugly way, and people again defended our tribe: this time with shitting on a player who tuned his back on our tribe (Fc Barcelona).
So, a lot of this, at the end of a day, is about our animal nature and tribes.
So, in my situation, since I really don't like these players (as footballers for Barca):
1. I can either stay quiet and don't say anything and we can turn this into a Reddit. But less people will get annoyed.
2. or I (and some guys) can do what I am doing and then a lot of people will get offended and will always call us names.
I could, though, write less bs posts, but I am also only an animal like all of us and I get pissed off also and then I am writing some shit from time to time
So, to some extent:
Dude, are you a Trust Fund baby?
Potroh
New member
I personally don't have any problem with your redundant posts.
I wish there were more detailed, objectively analytic opinions around, and you are damn right actually criticizing the forum for the number of oversimplified and primitively emotional messages.
And yes, some of your posts are quite bad, even bs but for the same reason, namely that when you start to dislike a particular player, you simply can't let him go and finish chewing on him, which is rather emotional, specially compared to your original aim to be analytical and watching the entire scene from above.
Nevertheless I wish you keep on posting those often questionable long posts, because you at least try to think, whereas many others don't even make an attempt to use anything else but their instinctive gut feelings in single sentences or even just some words.
This is also the reason why I very rarely post anything anymore, but you are a good example in my eyes, even if often with slightly questionable content... and I wish there were others to actually have a kind of thorough conversation with...
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