KingLeo10
Senior Member
El Pistero
he is facetiming with Messi
Amazing player. Deserved the Ballon D'Or in 15/16.
Luis Suárez
- Thread starter jj_101
- Start date
Amazing player. Deserved the Ballon D'Or in 15/16.
Fati_Future_BallonDor
Well-known member
He did score 41 goals, didnt he? Just like Lewa this season both deserve ballon dor for this output
Your correct. We would have probably won LaLiga with Suarez and Atletico wouldn't have (hey Madrid might have won it as the Messi-Suarez clique could have opposed Koeman even more).
I'm reflecting on the point that we worked ourselves into a position that despite the transition away from Suarez, that we worked ourselves into opportunity to win LaLiga. Near the end of the season, with a favourable schedule in our hands.
Great post [MENTION=29755]Bobo32[/MENTION]. Fully agree.
evilhita666
Barçapocalypse NOW!
Yup, pretty much... Su?rez HAD to leave, it was not about skills or even non-football issues, it's just that his time here was up, plain and simple, no two ways around it...
Congrats to him, but spare me the drama...
khaled_a_d
Senior Member
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
Stats for La Liga:
Minutes total - shots total - goals total:
Suarez 2521, 103/21
Dembele 1781, 55/6
Trincao 683, 23/3
Braith 1164, 23/2
Griezz 2621, 71/13
Messi 3023, 196/30
Shotting accuracy, shots needed for 1 goal:
4,9 Suarez
5,5 Griezz
6,5 Messi
7,7 Trincao
9,2 Dembele
11,2 Braithwaite
How many minutes a player needs to get into a shooting position/chance:
15,4 Messi
24,5 Suarez
29,7 Trincao
32,4 Dembele
36,9 Griezz
50,6 Braithwaite
Minutes needed for 1 goal:
100 Messi
120 Suarez
202 Griezzman
228 Trincao
297 Dembele
582 Braithwaite
Roughly, in a season where a player will be available for let's say 32 out of 38 matches:
29 Messi (number of expected La Liga goals)
24 Suarez
14 Griezz
13 Trincao
10 Dembele
5 Braithwaite
Last season, Suarez played only 2002 minutes in La Liga, scoring 16 goals for us.
Which is one goal each 125 minutes, similar to one goal in 120 minutes this season.
On the other hand, Griezmann scored once in 285 minutes last season and we kept him instead of a guy who scores once in 125 minutes.
What happened in this season?
Suarez improved from scoring once in 125 minutes to scoring once in 120 minutes.
Griezmann improved from scoring once in 285 minutes to scoring once in 202 minutes.
Messi went from scoring once in 113 minutes to scoring once in 100 minutes this season.
Football is not only maths, but some patterns are predictable.
For example, Griezz, Dembele and friends will probably stay on similar numbers next season.
So, what can we expect?
More or less the same, or even worse since Messi will be older. (Only if Ansu will be banging goals like crazy, but he hasn't played for 1 year).
So, going from Suarez to Griezmann as a no9 meant losing 10-11 goals over the season.
Anyway, for the future, simple maths would indicate that a striker needs two skills:
1. getting in chances 4-5 times per match on average, like Messi and Suarez
2. having nice finishing accuracy, like 5,0 or 6,5 (Griezmann has good shooting accuaracy but he doesn't get into enough chances. Someone might reply: but this is why because all actions are aimed at Messi. Well, Suarez also played with Messi and still managed to shoot a lot).
In that sense, this is why I always liked Haaland: he gets into a lot of chances and he converts a lot of them.
I could survive with his bad passing, because as seen is Suarez' case:
1. a CF who can score, but has bad passes is BETTER
2. that a CF who is good in link up and passing, but is not scoring too much
Of course, it would be the best to buy attackers who can BOTH link up well and score, but if we can choose/or have money for only one: than scoring wins over link-up play.
On the other hand:
Lautaro 2519, 104/16
Haaland 2410, 93/27
Shots needed for 1 goal:
3,4 Haaland
6,5 Lautaro
Shots per match:
3,7 Lautaro with 15% chance of scoring in each shot
3,5 Haaland with 29% chance of scoring in each shot
= Haaland has almost around 90% higher chances than Lautaro in each match to score a goal
Who is better in link up?
Lautaro > Haaland
Minutes total - shots total - goals total:
Suarez 2521, 103/21
Dembele 1781, 55/6
Trincao 683, 23/3
Braith 1164, 23/2
Griezz 2621, 71/13
Messi 3023, 196/30
Shotting accuracy, shots needed for 1 goal:
4,9 Suarez
5,5 Griezz
6,5 Messi
7,7 Trincao
9,2 Dembele
11,2 Braithwaite
How many minutes a player needs to get into a shooting position/chance:
15,4 Messi
24,5 Suarez
29,7 Trincao
32,4 Dembele
36,9 Griezz
50,6 Braithwaite
Minutes needed for 1 goal:
100 Messi
120 Suarez
202 Griezzman
228 Trincao
297 Dembele
582 Braithwaite
Roughly, in a season where a player will be available for let's say 32 out of 38 matches:
29 Messi (number of expected La Liga goals)
24 Suarez
14 Griezz
13 Trincao
10 Dembele
5 Braithwaite
Last season, Suarez played only 2002 minutes in La Liga, scoring 16 goals for us.
Which is one goal each 125 minutes, similar to one goal in 120 minutes this season.
On the other hand, Griezmann scored once in 285 minutes last season and we kept him instead of a guy who scores once in 125 minutes.
What happened in this season?
Suarez improved from scoring once in 125 minutes to scoring once in 120 minutes.
Griezmann improved from scoring once in 285 minutes to scoring once in 202 minutes.
Messi went from scoring once in 113 minutes to scoring once in 100 minutes this season.
Football is not only maths, but some patterns are predictable.
For example, Griezz, Dembele and friends will probably stay on similar numbers next season.
So, what can we expect?
More or less the same, or even worse since Messi will be older. (Only if Ansu will be banging goals like crazy, but he hasn't played for 1 year).
So, going from Suarez to Griezmann as a no9 meant losing 10-11 goals over the season.
Anyway, for the future, simple maths would indicate that a striker needs two skills:
1. getting in chances 4-5 times per match on average, like Messi and Suarez
2. having nice finishing accuracy, like 5,0 or 6,5 (Griezmann has good shooting accuaracy but he doesn't get into enough chances. Someone might reply: but this is why because all actions are aimed at Messi. Well, Suarez also played with Messi and still managed to shoot a lot).
In that sense, this is why I always liked Haaland: he gets into a lot of chances and he converts a lot of them.
I could survive with his bad passing, because as seen is Suarez' case:
1. a CF who can score, but has bad passes is BETTER
2. that a CF who is good in link up and passing, but is not scoring too much
Of course, it would be the best to buy attackers who can BOTH link up well and score, but if we can choose/or have money for only one: than scoring wins over link-up play.
On the other hand:
Lautaro 2519, 104/16
Haaland 2410, 93/27
Shots needed for 1 goal:
3,4 Haaland
6,5 Lautaro
Shots per match:
3,7 Lautaro with 15% chance of scoring in each shot
3,5 Haaland with 29% chance of scoring in each shot
= Haaland has almost around 90% higher chances than Lautaro in each match to score a goal
Who is better in link up?
Lautaro > Haaland
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BBZ8800
Senior Member
Since 2014:
Minutes + goals in a CL:
Suarez: 5261 + 25 = 210 minutes
Messi in the same period: 5407 + 53 = 102 minutes
Cr7: 6575 + 67 = 98 minutes
Lewa: 5739 + 56 = 102 minutes
Mbappe: 3448 + 27 = 128 minutes
Neymar: 5127 + 37 = 139 minutes
Benzema: 4894 + 35 = 140 minutes
Griezz = 5152 + 25 = 206 minutes
Dembele = 1848 + 9 = 205 minutes
Messi, CR7 and Lewa are on a GOAT level in a CL with a goal each 100-ish minutes (but they do take pens and free kicks, though).
Neymar, Benzema and Mbappe are at around 130-140 minutes per goal (Neymar with pens and free kicks, right?)
Suarez is on a level with Griezmann and Dembele at around 200 minutes needed for 1 goal. (Suarez mostly without pens and freekicks due to Messi.)
So, in a CL, Suarez was behind world class strikers.
But in league, he was on the 4th best attacker in the world.
Still, we traded him for Griezmann who is on 13-15 league goals per season and on similarly meh numbers in a CL.
So, I agree with you: Suarez was subpar in a CL.
But what was the solution of our board?
= to trade him for Griezz, who is equally as subpar in a CL for years and far worse in league + Braithwaite.
And now we will trade him for Aguero who is near retirement and hasn't played for 1 year.
The only options are:
1. the board/Koeman thought that Griezz will improve a lot once when Suarez is gone
2. Fati will explode. A kid who had 112 minutes in a CL prior to this season.
Betting on Griezmann to improve was insane.
Betting on young Fati is quite hazardous.
DonAK
President of FC Barcelona
No one would have cared about this if Barca hadnt choked away the title.
Literally had it in their hands. Got multiple chances but squandered all of them. Looking at our defensive record we didnt deserve it.
Moving on from Suarez = right decision
Not getting a replacement and giving him away to Atleti = bad decisions
Ansu getting injured when it looked like he was going to have a huge breakthrough season = just terrible luck for him and us
Shit happens. Happy him and Atleti secured it though.
Literally had it in their hands. Got multiple chances but squandered all of them. Looking at our defensive record we didnt deserve it.
Moving on from Suarez = right decision
Not getting a replacement and giving him away to Atleti = bad decisions
Ansu getting injured when it looked like he was going to have a huge breakthrough season = just terrible luck for him and us
Shit happens. Happy him and Atleti secured it though.
DonAK
President of FC Barcelona
Maybe we could have sold Suarez to Inter if Barto and Koeman had not acted like idiots towards him. Suarez had a point to prove after he was basically thrown out. Played like it too.
Moving on from him was the right decision. The execution of it as I said last summer was terrible and showed a lack of respect towards him no matter what happened. Kinda ironic how Koeman now talks about how he should be respected more.
Moving on from him was the right decision. The execution of it as I said last summer was terrible and showed a lack of respect towards him no matter what happened. Kinda ironic how Koeman now talks about how he should be respected more.
serghei
Senior Member
Sure, but I'd rather Atletico are strong while we rebuild than having Real Madrid racking up some easy titles.
Barcilliant
Senior Member
I'm glad he left. He was a toxic influence and now acts like the victim. He won the league with Atleti. Good for him. As usual he delivered a shit show in the cl.
Let him have his moment of glory. Next season he will do nothing.
Let him have his moment of glory. Next season he will do nothing.
Horatio
You're welcome
Interesting thought experiment. So let's say one assumes he would have left us either way(he had gone to Inter for example). It would mean we would have played this season without him, but so would have Atletico. Who would've won the league then?
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