Neymar Jr. - v5

[henias]

[MENTION=16494]Neymessi[/MENTION] Whether he has the most dribbles or not, most fouled or not, u cant just lose ur shit and not expect a yellow card. Footballers know attempting to dribble is definitely gonna draw alot of fouls and tackles, and this fouls will be ur advantage. You simply cant expect defenders to be ball watching while u dribble past them. Although in Ligue One, he probably is dribbling for fun, considering how atrocious the defenders are. And I dont think they even tried to break his legs, they just kinda tripped him alot, considering he's also a person who goes down very easily. That could also explain the huge number of fouls.

Messi had it worst against Madrid in 2011, I dont see him even close to losing his shit, he was just completely focused on the ball itself. He gets tripped he just stood up like nothing almost happen. And Messi has been top dribbler in La Liga for many years, yet has one of the cleanest discipline record.

And I dont think its a coincidence that he racks up 8 red cards and 138 yellow cards at the age of 25. It's simply not his first time that he has lost his shit and provoked opponents for the slightest reasons.

But what's even cringier is that you are a Neymar fan trying to hog the thread and justify his short temper and behaviour. I'm not a Neymar hater, but, pls, be realistic for once. It doesnt matter if you are the best or 3rd best player in the world, u dont just lose ur shit all the time.

 

[MessiCam]

you call him as Moneymar when 31 years old Messi got 100 m euros bonus in his new contract?

He left you to move to a better team. l'd not call him as Moneymar.

That 100 million hasn't been confirmed and even if it were I'd expect it to come with some ridiculous release clause. It's a crazy amount of money for an extension though but, after thinking about it, Messi consistently gives you 50 goals per year.

 

[Neymessi]

[MENTION=16494]Neymessi[/MENTION] Whether he has the most dribbles or not, most fouled or not, u cant just lose ur shit and not expect a yellow card. Footballers know attempting to dribble is definitely gonna draw alot of fouls and tackles, and this fouls will be ur advantage. You simply cant expect defenders to be ball watching while u dribble past them. Although in Ligue One, he probably is dribbling for fun, considering how atrocious the defenders are. And I dont think they even tried to break his legs, they just kinda tripped him alot, considering he's also a person who goes down very easily. That could also explain the huge number of fouls.

Messi had it worst against Madrid in 2011, I dont see him even close to losing his shit, he was just completely focused on the ball itself. He gets tripped he just stood up like nothing almost happen. And Messi has been top dribbler in La Liga for many years, yet has one of the cleanest discipline record.

And I dont think its a coincidence that he racks up 8 red cards and 138 yellow cards at the age of 25. It's simply not his first time that he has lost his shit and provoked opponents for the slightest reasons.

But what's even cringier is that you are a Neymar fan trying to hog the thread and justify his short temper and behaviour. I'm not a Neymar hater, but, pls, be realistic for once. It doesnt matter if you are the best or 3rd best player in the world, u dont just lose ur shit all the time.

You need to first improve your comprehension skills and understand that I never said its completely justified for him to lose his shit.

I am debating as said by bbz that the fouls he recieves are totally justified and neymar's own fault and that he recieves the fouls because of his playing style and less because of his temper issues which you seem to agree with as well.

You simply cant expect defenders to be ball watching while u dribble past them.

So if you read my posts again you would know that yes he has some issues but thats not really all his fault because of how much he is fouled and the main reason he is fouled is because of his style primarily and not his temper problems. Also players deliberately try to rile him up most of the times.

 

[henias]

You need to first improve your comprehension skills and understand that I never said its completely justified for him to lose his shit.

I am debating as said by bbz that the fouls he recieves are totally justified and neymar's own fault and that he recieves the fouls because of his playing style and less because of his temper issues which you seem to agree with as well.



So if you read my posts again you would know that yes he has some issues but thats not really all his fault because of how much he is fouled and the main reason he is fouled is because of his style primarily and not his temper problems. Also players deliberately try to rile him up most of the times.

Oh so now his fouls are one of a kind? He's the type to very easily go down with contact, of course one would have many fouls. U act like this type of fouls dont happen to anyone else. Plenty of dribblers out there but they dont act like that.

Messi still holds the highest dribbling record of 186 successful dribbles in La Liga during his 2010/2011 season. He gets absolutely hacked and fouled by Real Madrid, he was literally unfazed. Neymar's highest was 168 dribbles in 2015/16. In 2016/17, Hazard was the highest with 169 dribbles with a 75% success rate in the EPL. Neymar being 4th in Europe, has only 139 dribbles that season with a 53% success rate and already had a red card to his books against Malaga.

Of course, if every foul is so exaggerated, even the slightest touch will seem like opponents "rile" him up. Lmao. Give me a break. His "style" is just being overly dramatic when it's unnecessary and always has been. But if ur perception and judgement is just so biased then simply no point debating.

 

[Neymessi]

Oh so now his fouls are one of a kind? He's the type to very easily go down with contact, of course one would have many fouls. U act like this type of fouls dont happen to anyone else. Plenty of dribblers out there but they dont act like that.

Messi still holds the highest dribbling record of 186 successful dribbles in La Liga during his 2010/2011 season. He gets absolutely hacked and fouled by Real Madrid, he was literally unfazed. Neymar's highest was 168 dribbles in 2015/16. In 2016/17, Hazard was the highest with 169 dribbles with a 75% success rate in the EPL. Neymar being 4th in Europe, has only 139 dribbles that season with a 53% success rate and already had a red card to his books against Malaga.

Of course, if every foul is so exaggerated, even the slightest touch will seem like opponents "rile" him up. Lmao. Give me a break. His "style" is just being overly dramatic when it's unnecessary and always has been. But if ur perception and judgement is just so biased then simply no point debating.

This is just your perception that he goes down easily all the time. So not worth the debate.

Your second para serves no purpose to the debate. One red against malaga. So?

It is indeed no point debating as you are hell bent on considering neymar a diver. If one watched all his matches in the last 2 years it is clear always that he doesn't go down easily.

Also you are talking tangentially without addressing any of my main points. This is what I said

I am debating as said by bbz that the fouls he recieves are totally justified and neymar's own fault and that he recieves the fouls because of his playing style and less because of his temper issues

We seem to have a completely new perception provided by you that he is actually not fouled because he exxagerrates whereas bbz says he is fouled deservedly because he deserves it.

 

[henias]

This is just your perception that he goes down easily all the time. So not worth the debate.

Your second para serves no purpose to the debate. One red against malaga. So?

It is indeed no point debating as you are hell bent on considering neymar a diver. If one watched all his matches in the last 2 years it is clear always that he doesn't go down easily.

Also you are talking tangentially without addressing any of my main points. This is what I said



We seem to have a completely new perception provided by you that he is actually not fouled because he exxagerrates whereas bbz says he is fouled deservedly because he deserves it.

He got 8 red cards in his career. No big deal right? Bu.. but .. but Neymar is a top dribbler where opponents is likely to pick on him and not the others. He has this certain "style" that will somewhat attract alot of players and they somehow transform into a Ramos and Pepe type players. So unlucky Neymar has to deal with this... Damn if only refs and players and the whole world isnt so against him, Discipline record is totally invalid bcos of how he plays. Fair enough bruh. You do you. Im tired arguing with a Neymar fan.

 

[Neymessi]

He got 8 red cards in his career. No big deal right? Bu.. but .. but Neymar is a top dribbler where opponents is likely to pick on him and not the others. He has this certain "style" that will somewhat attract alot of players and they somehow transform into a Ramos and Pepe type players. So unlucky Neymar has to deal with this... Damn if only refs and players and the whole world isnt so against him, Discipline record is totally invalid bcos of how he plays. Fair enough bruh. You do you. Im tired arguing with a Neymar fan.

More idiocy from you. Its evident you have started to lose the debate when you start playing the neymar fan card.

You really have basic comprehension issues mate. Yes neymar has a part of that for himself to blame but main reasons for him getting fouled are different entirely. But you didn't get that from my posts did you when I spelled it out clearly for you did you? You probably are just intentionally avoiding it. Farewell 10 year old brat.

 

[henias]

More idiocy from you. Its evident you have started to lose the debate when you start playing the neymar fan card.

You really have basic comprehension issues mate. Yes neymar has a part of that for himself to blame but main reasons for him getting fouled are different entirely. But you didn't get that from my posts did you when I spelled it out clearly for you did you? You probably are just intentionally avoiding it. Farewell 10 year old brat.

Nothing wrong with my comprehension skills, mate. It's ur lame excuses. I know exactly what point you are trying to drive, and its just pure ridiculous. The number of fouls doesnt justify anything. It also has no correlation to how he got much less dribbles in the year 2016/17 but end up with more fouls than Hazard. And a foul would mean Neymar or Hazard would have already completed a dribble. Messi is also playing in the same league as Neymar, has almost the same number of successful dribbles yet has even lesser fouls. Sure u can say Neymar dives less, but I watch Barcelona for the whole season last year, he still goes down quite easily. That would easily rack up the number of fouls.

Also, Neymar also attempted the most dribbles (269, almost twice as much as Messi and the only player to attempt over 200 dribbles in Europe) but completed only 53% of the dribbles. Attempting THAT many dribbles would of course also increase the number of fouls and the probability of late tackles. And mind you, attempting to dribble is a matter of choice but if he cant handle it, then dont try to dribble at all.

Thats like saying if someone tries to illegally cross a busy road the most times and then expect a very low accident rate. Thats virtually impossible. And then blame the cars for knocking into him? Be more realistic.

Messi was fouled 107 times in 2010/2011. Not factoring in that Messi has one of the least tendencies to go down that year. He only racked up ONLY 3 yellow cards that season. I dont see him going bonkers or riling up to people, after being fouled tht many times. And trust me, I have seen much more of Neymar trying to provoke opponents and he sometimes got away without any cards, even against PSG in Europe, and the only time he got due punishment is against Malaga.

If he cant handle the tackles, then dont attempt to dribble that many times. Dont blame players for trying to "rile" him up, get all cranky and try to create a big drama scene, just bcos he's some big deal with a terribly short temper. He should jolly well be prepared if he's going head first into defenders that many times.

Quoted from Squawka and a Celtic defender: "In the Champions League he’s suffered 25 fouls – the third highest total across the entire competition – but Lustig, who had a heated confrontation with the 25-year-old earlier in the campaign – insists the striker can be rather dramatic at times.

“Neymar always falls very light, you can barely touch him, he is the biggest player in football,” Lustig said, as reported by AS."

Players themselves knows Neymar falls very easily, and they have the first hand experience. Not us, who only watch everything from the screen.

And no, the world, players, or refs aren't trying to go against him and not bcos he's that "special" kind of player. Overall, poor excuse and terrible way of trying to "justify" for his very poor discipline.

 

[Neymessi]

Also, Neymar also attempted the most dribbles (269, almost twice as much as Messi and the only player to attempt over 200 dribbles in Europe) but completed only 53% of the dribbles. Attempting THAT many dribbles would of course also increase the number of fouls and the probability of late tackles.

Your whole post is based on this premise. This is a completely different justification of his fouls that has been given yet. You said before he used to dive now you say this.

No he doesn't dive and no he doesn't go down easily. Most of the fouls that happen on him are legit. You post biased comments from opponents players who neymar humilated or fought with? They surely must be credible. lol

Why should i trust these few opposition players words if different referees who know much more about fouls than anyone have given fouls on him after knowing fully well about the diving reputation of neymar? A case could be made that the fouls registered on him are way less than actual because of his false image.


You again quoted messi's stats but if you read what I wrote earlier than you would know that most aren't like messi and staying sane in those conditions isn't easy. Again I am not saying he isn't short tempered but thats secondary.

Thats neymar's game style of dribbling players so what does it mean? That they have all the right to break his bones? Messi has never come close to getting injured that he got almost paralysed but neymar did get a knee in the spine which could have paralysed him. Did he dive that time? Did he provoke that dude by dribbling? No for both.

So to sum up the debate for you and point the point of view that you regularly fail to comprehend. Yes he is short tempered, which leads to shit, but is that the primary reason? No. Not at all. If he altered his style and dribbled less it would lead to much lesser fouls. So the primary reason for this is his playing style. The second reason is players have this irrational hate for him as bbz rightly pointed out but thats what it is, irrational.

You need to understand messi and r10 both were reputed and most people didn't take offense to what they did but with neymar they have this irrational bias which makes him more targetted. When was the last time someone criticised messi for dribbling past an opponent? All opposition players go wow he is goat which is right but why does no one call it offensive? And then when you have neymar rainbow flicking a dude the whole team gangs up on him and calls it offensive only to later hear from your legends cavi and coach lucho that neymar shouldn't have done that. So he has this certain style of dribbling that attracts more hate towards him.

 

[Acer]

[MENTION=16494]Neymessi[/MENTION] Whether he has the most dribbles or not, most fouled or not, u cant just lose ur shit and not expect a yellow card. Footballers know attempting to dribble is definitely gonna draw alot of fouls and tackles, and this fouls will be ur advantage. You simply cant expect defenders to be ball watching while u dribble past them. Although in Ligue One, he probably is dribbling for fun, considering how atrocious the defenders are. And I dont think they even tried to break his legs, they just kinda tripped him alot, considering he's also a person who goes down very easily. That could also explain the huge number of fouls.

Messi had it worst against Madrid in 2011, I dont see him even close to losing his shit, he was just completely focused on the ball itself. He gets tripped he just stood up like nothing almost happen. And Messi has been top dribbler in La Liga for many years, yet has one of the cleanest discipline record.

And I dont think its a coincidence that he racks up 8 red cards and 138 yellow cards at the age of 25. It's simply not his first time that he has lost his shit and provoked opponents for the slightest reasons.

But what's even cringier is that you are a Neymar fan trying to hog the thread and justify his short temper and behaviour. I'm not a Neymar hater, but, pls, be realistic for once. It doesnt matter if you are the best or 3rd best player in the world, u dont just lose ur shit all the time.

Man you talk bullshit you have never seen a ligue 1 game.
Defense in Ligue 1 are more pschical than thats in la Liga.
Neymar is doing what he is doing because he has total freedome, he touch much more balls in Psg than in Barca.
Stats confirm that Lingue 1 and Serie A are the most defensive league, with Serie A being more tactical and Ligue 1 more pschical.
This is proved even by the fact that the average goal per game in La Liga last year was 2.9, in Ligue 1 2.6.

 

[Horatio]

This is proved even by the fact that the average goal per game in La Liga last year was 2.9, in Ligue 1 2.6.

This doesn't prove much. Could mean there is just a big disparity between the strong teams in La Liga and weaker teams and more teams have an easier time scoring against weaker ones.
Ligue 1 could have more teams that are closer to one another in level with fewer outliers.

So rather than Ligue 1 being more defensive, it could be that more defenders match the level of attacking players on opposing team.

 

[Nothanks]

why even compare Ligue 1 with La Liga lol..

leagues aren't comparable but if you really wanna compare why not base it on european success? you know.. the competition french and la liga teams face each other?

 

[Acer]

This doesn't prove much. Could mean there is just a big disparity between the strong teams in La Liga and weaker teams and more teams have an easier time scoring against weaker ones.
Ligue 1 could have more teams that are closer to one another in level with fewer outliers.

So rather than Ligue 1 being more defensive, it could be that more defenders match the level of attacking players on opposing team.

Is so, you don't belive beacuse you have preconceptions.
You can check stats about fauls, tackles, average barycentre of teams.
James Rodriguez has played in both leagues and he consider Ligue 1 more pschical league than la Liga

 

[Acer]

why even compare Ligue 1 with La Liga lol..

leagues aren't comparable but if you really wanna compare why not base it on european success? you know.. the competition french and la liga teams face each other?

I have never compared the leagues.
La Liga is much more techinical, but Ligue 1 is more pschical and difensive.
Has nothing to do with european success.
My english is not that good because i'm italian, you Just need to watch games to see that.

 

[Nothanks]

Physical =/= defensive capabilities

this reminds me back in 2010 when the EPL plebs kept saying Messi etc wouldn't cut it in English league because of their physicality and "grit and steel"