Penal Madrid

[Luftstalag14]

I think that all of us are pessimistic to a certain degree but I have just noticed you being that fairly often when there is no need to be that. At times we need to remind ourselves of which club we are supporting. The most successful club in Europe based on trophies (domestic, European and international ones), number of Ballon d'Or winners, number of legendary players (arguably), dynasties, most impactful playing style, arguably the most talked about manager in Pep etc. in the past 30 years. With a booming economy and more young fans than any other club going by the data online from social media etc.

Now about to have a complete new stadium that remains the largest in Europe (slightly larger even than the current version) with likely a record naming rights deal. A new board no later than 2021 as well. BCN remaining the most visited city by tourists in Spain. A wage bill that will be reduced by over 50% when the seniors leave etc. Catalonia remaining the economic backbone of Spain. Lots of things to be positive about. Catalan businessmen are better at doing what they are doing and Catalans better at earning money than anyone else in Spain. RM is much more dependent on a 71 year old Pérez than we are on any person. They will have a really hard time replacing him and the network that he has built, believe me. Ever since his wife passed away he has been fully dedicated on RM more or less. They will have a really hard time finding such a person anytime soon.

Nah, it was just a few weeks ago. I will try to find it in order to show it to you. No, an even greater number.

The club claims that the Espai Project will cost €360 million. So quite a difference from €500 million.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-s...l-plans-for-espai-barca-project-idUKKCN1MU0GP

Hmmm, I swear I saw figures closed to 500m a couple of years ago when they first unveiled the project, hmmmmm.

Perhaps the New Camp Nou will cost around 360m and the rest (140m or so) will be for the new Palau Blaugrana, the new Mini Estadi/Estadi Cruyff and everything else in the project?

If not, I wonder why we are spending much less than Real Madrid is on their new stadium. I hope we are not being cheap and cutting corners. We need to have the best stadium, at least the best football stadium in the world.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Found it. The total cost of the Espai Project is estimated at €600m with the New Camp Nou costing around €360m.

For FC Barcelona this has meant a €360m (£318m) investment in Camp Nou, part of a larger €600m (£530m) project dubbed Espai Barça to ensure that the club equals, and even improves on, the world’s best football arenas.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/barcelona-camp-nou-new-stadium-renovations-redevelopment-experience

So I beg to ask, assuming we will get 200m from the stadium naming right deal, that means we will find another 400m for the rest of the whole project.

 

[Leo_Messi]

Found it. The total cost of the Espai Project is estimated at €600m with the New Camp Nou costing around €360m.




https://www.wired.co.uk/article/barcelona-camp-nou-new-stadium-renovations-redevelopment-experience

So I beg to ask, assuming we will get 200m from the stadium naming right deal, that means we will find another 400m for the rest of the whole project.

No offense to this "Wired" source (first time I hear about this news outlet) but I prefer a world renowned media like Reuters over that media. Your article is from March 2018 while my Reuters article is from late October 2018. More recent too.

Will quickly try to find what the club is actually saying. According to the Reuters article that €360 million is the club's own estimation.

Another source claiming the same (posting English sources deliberately).

https://gulfnews.com/sport/football/barcelona-reveal-plans-for-espai-barca-project-1.2291835

Quite sure that number is official and came to be after the General Assembly last autumn.

Found a Spanish source stating the same from October as well.

https://futbol.radioformula.com.mx/...-nou-remodelacion-estadio-liga-espanola-2018/

The price could fluctuate though mind you and it would not be a surprise if the final costs were slightly higher or even slightly lower. You never know. It is Spain after all. Today new elections were just announced due to failure of the budget being voted in by the majority of the parliament.

 

[Luftstalag14]

No offense to this "Wired" source (first time I hear about this news outlet) but I prefer a world renowned media like Reuters over that media. Your article is from March 2018 while my Reuters article is from late October 2018. More recent too.

Will quickly try to find what the club is actually saying. According to the Reuters article that €360 million is the club's own estimation.

Another source claiming the same (posting English sources deliberately).

https://gulfnews.com/sport/football/barcelona-reveal-plans-for-espai-barca-project-1.2291835

Quite sure that number is official and came to be after the General Assembly last autumn.

Found a Spanish source stating the same from October as well.

https://futbol.radioformula.com.mx/...-nou-remodelacion-estadio-liga-espanola-2018/

Take a look at this one: http://www.espn.com/soccer/barcelon...-not-meet-camp-nou-naming-rights-requirements

According to this ESPN article, our club's own spokeperson Josep Vives said the following when commenting on the rumor that we declined a 300m naming right deal from Mediapro:

"That's to say, the figure of €300 million was to be paid over the course of the 20-year deal with no interest. That would have mean €15m per year and the club would have had to finance the cost of the Espai Barca project [for the regeneration of Camp Nou and the surrounding area]. So, calculating annual interest of around 6.5 percent, the offer was only actually worth €165m.

"When club members approved the €600m Espai Barca project, they did so with the clause that [at least] €200m for the project has to come from the naming rights, another €200m from the club's revenue and €200m in credit."

If this is true this is quite significant. So not only do we need to make sure we get a naming right deal, we need to make sure they pay up in one big lump sum instead of an annual installment. Also I don't think we have 200m sitting around. Perhaps all remaining 400m will have to come in the form of credit/loans. Not looking good.

On retail stores, here is what I found:

According to Mundo Deportivo, FC Barcelona decided to not have cinemas or shops (except for FCBotiga with the club’s official products) in the Espai Barça due to the excessive complexity of the municipal permits required for this. The club is planning on having a number of restaurants, a hotel and maximizing the income from the spaces available in the new Camp Nou and the New Palau Blaugrana for all kinds of activities.

https://grup14.com/index.php/article/introducing-the-new-camp-nou-part-i

This is really disappointing. Just because it is complex to get the necessary permits they are going to forget about it, and thus losing potentially tens and millions of euros because of it? Most people go to the game at least 1 hour before the game starts and that's plenty of time to do some shopping around.

Fuck this shit.

 

[Leo_Messi]

Take a look at this one: http://www.espn.com/soccer/barcelon...-not-meet-camp-nou-naming-rights-requirements

According to this ESPN article, our club's own spokeperson Josep Vives said the following when commenting on the rumor that we declined a 300m naming right deal from Mediapro:



If this is true this is quite significant. So not only do we need to make sure we get a naming right deal, we need to make sure they pay up in one big lump sum instead of an annual installment. Also I don't think we have 200m sitting around. Perhaps all remaining 400m will have to come in the form of credit/loans. Not looking good.

On retail stores, here is what I found:



https://grup14.com/index.php/article/introducing-the-new-camp-nou-part-i

This is really disappointing. Just because it is complex to get the necessary permits they are going to forget about it, and thus losing potentially tens and millions of euros because of it? Most people go to the game at least 1 hour before the game starts and that's plenty of time to do some shopping around.

Fuck this shit.

Mediapro is not the only option. The Sport article that was posted recently was talking about a deal being worked out with Grifols and them offering more than Mediapro and it being a historical deal.

Some English news about this from late November last year.

http://www.sportspromedia.com/news/barcelona-grifols-nou-camp-naming-rights-deal

Strange with the different numbers floating around. Must be due to not looking at the deal in its entirety but dividing it into the Camp Nou remodelación part and the Espai project as a whole.

Cinemas? Good choice as they are very much outdated in Spain and most of Western Europe. Only declining. The FCBotiga (the most visited club shop in the world if I recall), restaurants, hotels and maximizing the income from the spaces available is more than enough and very promising on its own.

BTW, I don't think this is accurate as your article is from early 2016 and nothing is official. From what I recall there will be stores and it also makes sense given that this article claims that there will be restaurants, hotels and other income sources. Obviously stores would fit right in here and don't differ much from restaurants and hotels or the FCBotiga.

To be honest with you, I stopped following the Espai project closely a few years ago. I need to make myself familiar with this and find out what is reality and what is rumor. Frankly, had other things to focus on and worry about in regards to the club in the past 2-3 years.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Mediapro is not the only option. The Sport article that was posted recently was talking about a deal being worked out with Grifols and them offering more than Mediapro and it being a historical deal.

Some English news about this from late November last year.

http://www.sportspromedia.com/news/barcelona-grifols-nou-camp-naming-rights-deal

Strange with the different numbers floating around. Must be due to not looking at the deal in its entirety but dividing it into the Camp Nou remodelación part and the Espai project as a whole.

Cinemas? Good choice as they are very much outdated in Spain and most of Western Europe. Only declining. The FCBotiga (the most visited club shop in the world if I recall), restaurants, hotels and maximizing the income from the spaces available is more than enough and very promising on its own.

BTW, I don't think this is accurate as your article is from early 2016 and nothing is official. From what I recall there will be stores and it also makes sense given that this article claims that there will be restaurants, hotels and other income sources. Obviously stores would fit right in here and don't differ much from restaurants and hotels or the FCBotiga.

To be honest with you, I stopped following the Espai project closely a few years ago. I need to make myself familiar with this and find out what is reality and what is rumor. Frankly, had other things to focus on and worry about in regards to the club in the past 2-3 years.

Yeah I think from what I read in the last hour or so it is the New Camp Nou costing around 360m while the whole Espai Barca Project is estimated at 600m.

Let's hope we will find a naming right sponsor who is willing to chalk up that huge lump sum. Worst case scenario we will borrow more money and keep piling up our debt I suppose. Worst case scenario I suppose we will borrow 600m and keep piling up our debt I suppose.

And I hope you are right that the Grup14 article is outdated. I don't care about cinemas as I think they are pretty useless in that setting (who is going to Camp Nou to watch a 90-minute long movie when they paid much more money to watch a game there? Unless of course you decide to show up 2 to 3 hours before the game time), but I do believe having as many retail outlets including stores and restaurants would be the right way to go to maximize our revenues. I hope they change their mind. Real Madrid is doing it, why not us? Come on, hire a guy and pay him 100k just to get those permits and pay another 500k for the permits, it is well worth it.

 

[Leo_Messi]

Yeah I think from what I read in the last hour or so it is the New Camp Nou costing around 360m while the whole Espai Barca Project is estimated at 600m.

Let's hope we will find a naming right sponsor who is willing to chalk up that huge lump sum. Worst case scenario we will borrow more money and keep piling up our debt I suppose. Worst case scenario I suppose we will borrow 600m and keep piling up our debt I suppose.

And I hope you are right that the Grup14 article is outdated. I don't care about cinemas as I think they are pretty useless in that setting (who is going to Camp Nou to watch a 90-minute long movie when they paid much more money to watch a game there? Unless of course you decide to show up 2 to 3 hours before the game time), but I do believe having as many retail outlets including stores and restaurants would be the right way to go to maximize our revenues. I hope they change their mind. Real Madrid is doing it, why not us? Come on, hire a guy and pay him 100k just to get those permits and pay another 500k for the permits, it is well worth it.

Luft, even your 2.5 (almost 3 year old) link says that there will be hotels, restaurants and that every available space will be made use of for all kind of activities. Obviously stores here fit like fish in water. With the FCBotiga already being there as well. No doubt in my mind that there will be stores. It is a perfect location business wise. Tons of brands and stores will line up to be able to have their stores and boutiques in the Espai. So no need to worry about that part. I mean BCN as a city is famed for its stores already. Many of the most visited brands and stores in all of Spain are located in BCN. If not the most visited.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Luft, even your 2.5 (almost 3 year old) link says that there will be hotels, restaurants and that every available space will be made use of for all kind of activities. Obviously stores here fit like fish in water. With the FCBotiga already being there as well. No doubt in my mind that there will be stores. It is a perfect location business wise. Tons of brands and stores will line up to be able to have their stores and boutiques in the Espai. So no need to worry about that part. I mean BCN as a city is famed for its stores already. Many of the most visited brands and stores in all of Spain are located in BCN. If not the most visited.

Yes, I am all for making the Camp Nou neighborhood the Nou Passeig de Gràcia.

Seriously, it is a no-brainer and the club should not forgo this huge pot of gold just because of some complex processes to get the permits.

 

[Leo_Messi]

Yes, I am all for making the Camp Nou neighborhood the Nou Passeig de Gràcia.

Seriously, it is a no-brainer and the club should not forgo this huge pot of gold just because of some complex processes to get the permits.

Give me this weekend and I will try to read up on everything regarding the Espai project or at least what I can find online and on the club's homepage. Pretty sure that most of the important talking points have been addressed and explained during the last General Assembly last autumn.

As for the stores, I cannot imagine them not being there. Really can't.

What interests me the most currently is what kind of offer Grifols are offering. I have an old mate who works for them but not sure if he can spill the beans or even has any idea what kind of offer is being prepared.

BTW good to see Bayern trailing. Hope Augsburg can keep their result so Dortmund can extend their lead. Want another Bundesliga winner this time around.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Give me this weekend and I will try to read up on everything regarding the Espai project or at least what I can find online and on the club's homepage. Pretty sure that most of the important talking points have been addressed and explained during the last General Assembly last autumn.

As for the stores, I cannot imagine them not being there. Really can't.

What interests me the most currently is what kind of offer Grifols are offering. I have an old mate who works for them but not sure if he can spill the beans or even has any idea what kind of offer is being prepared.

BTW good to see Bayern trailing. Hope Augsburg can keep their result so Dortmund can extend their lead. Want another Bundesliga winner this time around.

Thanks, if you find something interesting please share.

With regard to Grifols and other potential naming rights partners, I think the hardest part is will they have enough cash to give us 200m up front in one installment. If we get 20 or 30m a year it defeats the purpose.

 

[Morten]

I hope this was simply stupid experimenting by Solari, and that he knows Marcelo and Bale simply cant be starting in CDR or CL, if we are to get anything out of this season.

 

[LMTR14]

leave it to real madrid to be worse than us. who would've expected that after yesterday's game, LOL

 

[El Gato]

I hope this was simply stupid experimenting by Solari, and that he knows Marcelo and Bale simply cant be starting in CDR or CL, if we are to get anything out of this season.

Hardly experimenting. He needs to try and recover his reserves. Marcelo was better than usual, though still partially at fault for the goal. Bale is useless, but we need someone to provide a goal other than Benzema-Vinicius duo. What would happen if Regui and Nacho got injured again? He needs to salvage something from Marcelo.

Really little wrong with personal choices on paper. He was let down in other ways.

 

[TrueCule]

I can't wait on Clasico that we expose this shitty team once again on their stadium. Real have never been a contender for La Liga this season. I mean, losing 3 times against Levante, Sociedad and Girona is a disgrace for such a club of this level and clearly indicates that such a team can't be a contender for the title.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Casemiro is one of those players I want to see some really bad things happening to, a fuck face