Rafinha Alcantara

BBZ8800

BBZ8800

Senior Member
anguy said:
He never directly competed against any those guys, except Guardiola. Like I said Xavi was DM at the beginning of his career. All those guys except Guardiola were either pure midfielders or offensive midfielders. There's no way Enrique or De Boer would be able to play DM. And Guardiola was at the end of his career and after he went out of Barca he was forced to end his career, because nobody wanted him. The fact is Xavi never had real competition at DM position during his first years.

And while he was good (not great player) during those years, I believe one of the reasons why he played so much, was because he was home grown player and Catalan. For some people who started to follow Barca later it might seem strange, but Barcelona was pretty much a "mercenary club" back then. Van Gaal practically wiped out "old guard" when he was appointed a coach and brought all those Ajax players with him, so we had just one other significant homegrown player - Puyol. Club simply needed someone homegrown on pitch and Xavi was the best of all options. (Puyol was almost sold by LVG who preferred Reiziger).
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You are again defending current guys.
Xavi had it easier. He was a homegrown, he had no competition.

Here is a match from 1998, Barcelona were in Champions league group stage with Man. Utd, Bayern and Brondby.
Barcelona finished 3rd in that group (we played 3:3 and 3:3 twice against Man. Utd and lost two games against Bayern). Man. Utd and Bayern promoted from our group, and later they played in the final again (Man. Utd winning 2:1 in the last minutes).

Anyway, here is the match from the first round of that group stage, played in September 1998'.
Man. Utd versus Barcelona at Old Trafford:
http://www.worldfootball.net/report/champions-league-1998-1999-gruppe-d-manchester-united-fc-barcelona/

Our line up was Van Gaal's 343:
-- Gk Hesp
-- Dl Sergi
-- Dc Abelardo
-- Dr Reiziger

-- Ml Zenden
-- Mc Cocu
-- Mc Luis Enrique
-- Mr Figo

-- FcL Rivaldo
-- Fc Sonny Anderson
-- FcR Giovanni

-- Xavi entered in 68' minute for Giovanni, I guess that Figo or Zenden went to Fc position, and Luis Enrique or Cocu moved to a wing position, while Xavi occupied one of two MC positions.
(Or Enrique went to Fc, and Xavi played as a Mc)

Anyway, Xavi was still 18 years old in this match.
Our central midfielders in this match were Cocu and Luis Enrique.
If Lucho was Amc, then it means that Cocu was a Dmc-Mc.

So, Guardiola wasn't the only Dmc in that era.
We had Guardiola, Cocu (who played virtually all positions in our formation, Dc, Dl, Dr, Dmc, Mc, Ml, Mr)

Also, here is El Classico from 1999-00 Season:
http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/spieltag/aufstellung/spielbericht/1183762
-- in this match, we played 361 or 343
-- two Dmcs were Guardiola and Cocu again

I mean, everything what Xavi did was "easy" and he had a lot of things in his favor.
He had to earn a place against 29 year old Guardiola and 30 year old Cocu.

Also about posters who say that Xavi was just an average Dmc before Pep.
In Rijkaard's era, he was moved into a Mc position (Deco and Iniesta were more offensive Mcs, Xavi was less offensive).

Rijkaard's Dmc were:
-- Edgar Davids in 2003-04
-- and later it was Thiago Motta, but he had huge problems with knee injuries
-- 2nd option was Edmilson, but he also suffered serious knee injury
-- then, the 3rd option was Dc marquez who was moved from a Dc to Dmc

Rijkaard wanted a strong and tall Dmc (Motta, Edmilson, Marquez), and Xavi was mostly a Mc during Rijkaard's first 2-3 (glory) Seasons. (Mcs were Xavi, Iniesta, Deco and Gerard Lopez)
 
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Ustari

Ustari

Mou, res!
BBZ8800 said:
Xavi wasn't a God, ok.
But people are just talking about his years 1999-2007 like he was something like Keita or Pedro.

Look against whom 20 year old Xavi had to compete:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999–2000_FC_Barcelona_season
-- I have even seen some replies in other topics that "it was easier back then for a young player", lol
-- people will give any excuse to defend the current youngsters and to continue the hype about them
-- and about our real legends, "everything" was easier and different back then

-- anyway, 20 year old Xavi had to win a midfield place against:
-- against 29 years old Pep Guardiola, Barca's legend, and he was still on his prime
-- against 30 years old Luis Enrique (lol). Awesome Barca and Real Madrid midfielder
-- 30 year old extremely versatile Cocu
-- 30 year old extremely experienced Ronald De Boer
-- we could also add versatile players like Luis Figo, Zenden and Litmanen here

-- Cocu played 53+55 matches in 2000 and 2001
-- Ronny De Boer played 37 matches in 2000, and was sold
-- Guardiola played 25 and 36 matches in 2000 and 2001
-- Luis Enrique played 33 and 41 matches in 2000 and 2001
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xavi
-- young Xavi played 38 and 36 matches in 99/00 and 00/01, when he was aged 19, 20 and 21
= 74 matches
-- so, out of all our experienced and expensive midfielders, only Cocu played more matches
-- Xavi played more matches than Guardiola and Ronald De Boer, and the same number (74) as Lucho, our captain

-- today, current Xavi and Iniesta are something like Guardiola and Luis Enrique from those days
-- Rakitic is something like Ronny De Boer
-- can you imagine Rafinha or even Samper playing 40-ish matches per Season?

I know, people will have 1000s of excuses again:
-- it was easier in those days for a youngster
-- but if you look at our team from 2000, there weren't any youngsters in our team
-- slightly older (22-23 years old) Puyol played 37+24 matches and that's it
-- other La Masia products didn't play too much
-- only a winger Simao Sabrosa played, but he was bought as a future world-superstar. In those days, press, media and fans believed that he is the new Luis Figo, and that it is worth to play him, no matter how poorly he performed
-- but after 2-3 Seasons, people realized that he won't be a new Luis Figo (lol at the stupid hype again)

-- also, people will say that we were weak in those days, lol, even though the current team is equally as poor/bad as 2000s team (We were champions in 97-98 and 98-99 with the same players, and we had Van Gaal as a coach) and we have very decent chances to repeat 3-4-5 Seasons without major trophies with the current board, coach and a set of players

-- also, one interesting thing is that our coaches were:
-- Van Gaal 97-2000
-- Serra Ferrer 00-01
-- Rexach 01-02
-- Van Gaal 02-03
-- Antic 03
-- Rijkaard 03-08
-- Guardiola 08-12 etc
= and the thing is THAT EVERY SINGLE ONE of them played Xavi in the staring 11

For example, people are saying today: this coach is stupid, he doesn't play Deulofeu, Barta or XX player.
-- but on the other hand, no matter how good or bad our coaches were, EVERY SINGLE ONE of them played Xavi. Always.
-- so, some coaches hate Deulo or Bartra
-- but on the other hand, ALL of our coaches "loved" Xavi
-- a strange coincidence, or he was just a much bigger talent/better player from the day 1 than Deulo or Bartra?

People are saying that young Xavi was nothing special (even though he played more matches aged 21 than 30 yrs old Guardiola and Luis Enrique), and on the other hand people believe in Rafinha who touches the ball 25 times at home against Celta, or in Deulo's awesome skills when he scores one La Liga goal in 4 Months in Sevilla.

Everything what current youngsters do is good and hyped till death.
And true legends, like Xavi:
-- were nothing special till Pep (lol)
-- he was poor at Dmc
-- it was easier back then, our team was a crap
-- it was easier for a young player in general, the philosophy was different (but why all other young players turned out to be a crap or average, like Gabri, Saviola, Simao, Rochemback etc?). Xavi and Puyol were the only players from that 5 years era who turned into a starting 11 material. If those days were that easy for youngsters, then we would have much more starters from that era, isn't it?

People are extremely biased towards our current youngsters and are believing a hype too much.
As others have already said, we were extremely lucky with Xavi, Iniesta, Busi and Messi from our La Masia.
Something like that will probably never repeat. And it surely won't repeat today with "gems" like Deulo, Halilovic, Rafinha, Bartra and similar.

It is not like these guys are a total crap. But it is very questionable whether they are of Barca's quality.
And still, even if some of them are of Barca's quality, it is still quite easy to say that none of them will ever be nowhere near Xavi's level.

Even though Xavi was "nothing special" before Pep, as some say :rolleyes:
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:cuenca::yes:
 
I

instinct

Guest
Official: New tests in Barcelona have confiremd that Rafinha has a thigh muscle injury, not clear when he will be able to rejoin training

tumblr_ly9r0ympVv1qa9m5b.gif
 
M

Messi10

New member
La Furia said:
Could he be better than his brother? Scary thought.

Glad he's picking Brazil.
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Lot to still left to prove

USWAY said:
This guy has such a great combination of speed, strength, and skill. No doubt he'll make it. When he does break into the first team, his versatility is gonna help him see the pitch. Love him at CF.
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Hopefully he show it for the first team

Deco 20 said:
2 goals, earned a penalty (Espinosa didn't score) and assisted the final goal. Rises to the occasion, it seems! :)
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Hmm not rising to the occasion this season
 
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