Raphael Varane

[khaled_a_d]

...won a world cup and a second position in the next, 4 champions league,several league titles, numerous club world cups, a few eurpoean super cups, some spanish super copas, Copa del reys and various individual awards......while playing for top clubs....

bro, we need to redefine "waste" again.

there are so many examples of "unwasted" accomplishers who will drool at his achievements.

It is wasted relative to what could have been.

Varane could have been the undisputed best CB of his generation for a full decade. His talent and immense physical tools and a start at top club and golden generation with France. He had the perfect combination to do that. He didn't come close to it.

Bro, I don't even rate him so highly but to label his career as "wasted" with all he accomplished,

His career isn't wasted, hence I said he is accomplished too, but his potential was wasted.
Wasted career and wasted potential are two very different things.

 

[iniestaGOAT]

It is wasted relative to what could have been.

Varane could have been the undisputed best CB of his generation for a full decade. His talent and immense physical tools and a start at top club and golden generation with France. He had the perfect combination to do that. He didn't come close to it.



His career isn't wasted, hence I said he is accomplished too, but his potential was wasted.
Wasted career and wasted potential are two very different things.

Nothing was wasted. He was injury prone CB.
Still managed to have one of the GOAT careers.
Def overachieved.

 

[Gazzznigga]

It is wasted relative to what could have been.

Varane could have been the undisputed best CB of his generation for a full decade. His talent and immense physical tools and a start at top club and golden generation with France. He had the perfect combination to do that. He didn't come close to it.



His career isn't wasted, hence I said he is accomplished too, but his potential was wasted.
Wasted career and wasted potential are two very different things.

Still, I wouldn't mind my potentials wasted while I acommplished all there is in football like he did.

 

[Maradona37]

Varane could have been the undisputed best CB of his generation for a full decade. His talent and immense physical tools and a start at top club and golden generation with France. He had the perfect combination to do that. He didn't come close to it.

He probably didn't come close to it (despite the advantages of the club and NT he played for) because (for me) you are vastly overrating his talent in the first place. That's really the most obvious explanation. Good player sure but I never swallowed his hype. Van Dijk as one example is way more talented than him. Ramos is only 6 years older and carried him for years.

But it's a game of opinions and you clearly disagree with me.

Gazznigga suggested nobody would take Cannavaro over him (Fabio is an ATG level defender) which shows the hype surrounding Varane. He couldn't lace Cannavaro's boots. Or those of any of the other Italian defenders he named. No matter what he 'won'.

 

[Maradona37]

Also, I am sure Steven Gerrard or Matt Le Tissier or Alan Shearer would love to have won or 'accomplished' (code for trophies) what the Neville brothers or Darren Fletcher or John O'Shea or Nacho won. It means absolutely nothing when evaluating how good a player is. Especially when Varane was one of Real's less important players.

Loads of people are far better at football than other people who win more than them in the game. It's football logic 101 you learn when you first get into the game - don't judge by trophies. It's obvious that in a team sport, sometimes the better players in an unsuccessful team will be more talented than the lesser players in a successful one.

Ederson has won far more league titles than Alisson but I would take Alisson every day of the week. Ederson just played with a bit better players in general and had a bit of a better coach.

So it really means fuck all that Varane has more World Cups or CLs (and if you are gonna go down the trophies avenue then let's not overlook that his league title record is very poor, there's more trophies in club football than just the CL, though I know a lot of modern football fans don't understand that) than some Italian defenders from the past, as nobody with half a brain would think he comes close to Maldini, Baresi, Bergomi, Scirea or Nesta, to name just a few. Only people who would think that are the Gen Z kids who think everything now is the best thing ever and everything from the past sucks.

Edit; also I have just looked up his page, and apparently the only time he won the 'individual' awards claimed he gathered in an earlier post was in 2018.

This isn't even a dig at Varane - just sick of people saying 'he won this' or 'he played for X, Y and Z' in evaluating players. What happened to - you know - talking about their attributes as footballers on the pitch?

 

[Windhook]

Haha, reading Le Tissier name brought a smile on my face. A player from a different era.

I'm not a fan of comparing eras, because if I go down that road, Cannavaro the owner of Varane, would lick Paolo Maldini and Franco Baresi's boots. You see the iceberg.

Varane was one of the top defenders at his prime and I don't know where this "unreached potential" comes from. The guy won back to back CLs and the World Cup playing full time.

If this is another episode of Manchester sucks and Liverpool never walks alone, I understand. Otherwise I don't.

 

[Gazzznigga]

Still dont see how all these you have written made Varane a "wasted" talent. As stated, he is a player i do not rate so much but you can't deny his accomplishments and label it "luck". Thats too simplistic. Luck is someone like Oleguer winning the champions league with Barca and disappeared or an Arbeloa winning a world cup....and disappeared afterwards...not a serial champion like Varane. Something must have warranted him being there again and again to win those championships and awards including 3 times appearance in the team of the season in La liga. And it was neither luck nor just having capable teamates.

Mentioning Baresi, Maldini and co was to put thing in proper persoective with respect to accomplishments. I watched a RAI interview some years back where Maldini stated that he would have given all his accomplishments in Serie A and Chamions league for a gold medal at the world cup. Labelling someone who consistently achieved that despite being a lower tiered talent "wasted" is what was concerning for me. You also got my point on Cannavarro wrong.

In my view, Cannavaro and Nesta were budding monsters who were billed to take over from the retiring generation(Costarcuta,Baresi,Gentile,Maldini, etc) and i started tracking Cannavaro from the national team appearance against England as a teenager under Cesare Maldini. He had so much promise but in my view, aside from the 2006 world cup performances , he really underachieved compared to the level of talent and promise when he broke out then in the late 90s. Even at that,i wouldn't dare label him "wasted"

I respect the differences in opinion though.

 

[ZenI]

Happy Retirement

Fatass

 

[Maradona37]

Haha, reading Le Tissier name brought a smile on my face. A player from a different era.

I'm not a fan of comparing eras, because if I go down that road, Cannavaro the owner of Varane, would lick Paolo Maldini and Franco Baresi's boots. You see the iceberg.

Varane was one of the top defenders at his prime and I don't know where this "unreached potential" comes from. The guy won back to back CLs and the World Cup playing full time.

If this is another episode of Manchester sucks and Liverpool never walks alone, I understand. Otherwise I don't.

I don't even like Liverpool. I don't like any of the top English teams. But it's obvious than Van Dijk was better than Varane. Forget what they have won and WATCH THEM over the last 10 years. Van Dijk was so much more dominant and the main defender for Liverpool. Varane was always Ramos's supplement.

As for Cannavaro, yes he's not on Maldini or Baresi's level. The same way Varane wasn't on his level. Indeed.

Also, you're doing exactly what i said - saying what he won, when (apart from France) he was never close to one of the most important players in the team. I'd rather you discussed his qualities as a player, as I said before.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

Had his peak in 12/13

 

[Maradona37]

Still dont see how all these you have written made Varane a "wasted" talent. As stated, he is a player i do not rate so much but you can't deny his accomplishments and label it "luck". Thats too simplistic. Luck is someone like Oleguer winning the champions league with Barca and disappeared or an Arbeloa winning a world cup....and disappeared afterwards...not a serial champion like Varane. Something must have warranted him being there again and again to win those championships and awards including 3 times appearance in the team of the season in La liga. And it was neither luck nor just having capable teamates.

Mentioning Baresi, Maldini and co was to put thing in proper persoective with respect to accomplishments. I watched a RAI interview some years back where Maldini stated that he would have given all his accomplishments in Serie A and Chamions league for a gold medal at the world cup. Labelling someone who consistently achieved that despite being a lower tiered talent "wasted" is what was concerning for me. You also got my point on Cannavarro wrong.

In my view, Cannavaro and Nesta were budding monsters who were billed to take over from the retiring generation(Costarcuta,Baresi,Gentile,Maldini, etc) and i started tracking Cannavaro from the national team appearance against England as a teenager under Cesare Maldini. He had so much promise but in my view, aside from the 2006 world cup performances , he really underachieved compared to the level of talent and promise when he broke out then in the late 90s. Even at that,i wouldn't dare label him "wasted"

I respect the differences in opinion though.

Fair enough. I also never said he was lucky - I said he wasn't as talented as other defenders playing at the same time and was a contributor but not one of the most important players at Real Madrid. Which I stand by.

 

[Maradona37]

Anyway, it doesn't really matter to me who won what, who played for who etc. It's just obvious to me as a long-time football fan and player and from watching them, that Van Dijk or Ramos or even Pique have more ability than Varane. It's just something that's very obvious to me - even if Varane won every World Cup, every CL, the Mr Universe competition and was on the cover of GQ every month.

 

[soul24rage]

Had his peak in 12/13

His peak was in the World Cup final 2022, similar to Dembele.

 

[Catta]

I would love it if Cubarsi and all our other youngsters waste their careers like Varane.

4 CLs and a WC. What a wasted career.

 

[Windhook]

Still dont see how all these you have written made Varane a "wasted" talent. As stated, he is a player i do not rate so much but you can't deny his accomplishments and label it "luck". Thats too simplistic. Luck is someone like Oleguer winning the champions league with Barca and disappeared or an Arbeloa winning a world cup....and disappeared afterwards...not a serial champion like Varane. Something must have warranted him being there again and again to win those championships and awards including 3 times appearance in the team of the season in La liga.

I don't consider him lucky. Varane was signed by Mourinho as prospect and was utilized by Ancelotti, Zidane and Deschamps as solid defender for years. This is nowhere near the Oleguer arc. He was what Rudiger is nowadays for Real Madrid.

The fact Varane wasn't flamboyant as the Val Kilmer double, doesn't take away anything from his contributions.