Real Madrid (old thread)

[Metaphysical]

Buying Özil for next to nothing was a great piece of business from RM side, you can't argue with that.

oh it was a fantastic bit of business, without a doubt.

but at the time, it was a risk, and that's what I'm saying. that's why no one contested Madrid's efforts to get him. it wasn't that they had magnificent scouts no one else did, it was that they were willing to spend on a player one year away from being free. since then they did it again (Sahin) and other clubs have followed suit to (United with Young, City with Nasri).

 

[Abaddon]

if he's often right, then there is a massive conspiracy behind Barcelona's success in recent years and what not

Quote me on that you clown. There is a difference between the referee taking some bad decisions in your favor in the CL semis and a massive conspiracy behind all your trophies in recent years.

 

[estranged]

Quote me on that you clown. There is a difference between the referee taking some bad decisions in your favor in the CL semis and a massive conspiracy behind all your trophies in recent years.

i'm not gonna waste time digging up the ramblings of an emotionally unstable troll, but I remember how after the CL semi or even la copa you were running around the forum talking shit, by far the most annoying madridista on this forum. all you do is try to get a reaction, is your life that sad and mundane that your rival clubs football forum is where you go to fulfill your emotional needs?

 

[jamrock]

I have not been really keeping up with all the sayings on this forum, so I have to ask does a real madrid fan seriously believe their is a conspiracy behind barcelona's recent success or is it some sort of inside joke

 

[estranged]

I have not been really keeping up with all the sayings on this forum, so I have to ask does a real madrid fan seriously believe their is a conspiracy behind barcelona's recent success or is it some sort of inside joke

if their manager says so why would you be surprised that a few fans may think the same?

 

[soarq]

Valdes, Thiago, Fontas are nowhere near crucial parts of the Spanish NT. Neither is Pedro actually, if we're really taking the crucial part seriously. Puyol is not a barcelona youth product.

Pedro is. Some pundits claim so, at least:

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/11/14/del-bosque-spain-tactics-false-nine-euro-2012/

Puyol learned his adult football in Barcelona. Thiago always was and still is a star in youth NTs, many others are regulars in all youth categories. In last U21 Euro qualification game 6 La Masia boys started the game, and 7th was introduced in second half. No dry-out on the horizont.

The point stays. No-one made it so successful in both club and NT level with so many home raised players in modern football. Only Ajax come close.

 

[Metaphysical]

The point is that Barcelona spent, do spend, and will continue to spend large. With money or without money. Why? Because you are a big club. Your initial success came thanks to foreigners and spending well. The fact that you have brought players through, even at an insane number and quality, has not displaced your annual spending. It never will either. That was the point people were argued. Not what your academy has achieved which is indisputable.

I was arguing Nolan's point that La Masia's current success won't last and the evidence for this is seen in England & Ajax.

Whether your academy will dry up or not is for the future to decide, I personally don't doubt that talent will come through but to have such relentless winners all come through at this rate is quite fascinating and rare. You will also need the right mix of foreign players who will not only fit into the team but also be modest. Barcelona's success humbles many, but all it takes is a player or two during times of hardship to send this tightly knit team onto a tangent (especially with your history of mistreating your heroes). If history did repeat itself for you then Kudos, you have revolutionized football a period of time longer than I have ever read about and it will be sensational for football in general.

I don't know if we'll see another generation like this, but this isn't like the United situation where all the players were around the same age, we have a real staggered group. Xavi and Puyol belong to one group; 30+, Iniesta and Valdés to another late 20's, then we have Generation '87 along with Busi and Pedro who are 23-24, then there's Thiago who's 20. that core group of 23-24 year olds will be the backbone of the side for years to come, and give La Masia plenty of time to find new cracks. until then they only really have to produce high quality squaddies.

Madrid had a legendary group but failed to win the CL in the 80s, and had they did win it once or twice, who knows? Perhaps there would have been more than five? But you know what happens to us when we don't win the CL, we got nuts.

Success breads success my friend but its a very sensitive chain, all it needs is one weak link and that train of success goes of the track. The success Barcelona is happy with today is because of foreigners Barcelona spent for, and an AC Milan legend and his assistant.

the success Barcelona has today is also because of a Dutch coach and the ideals he implemented, and a Catalan youth coach who helped work with kids, and a Catalan player/scout who had the foresight to sign Messi up on a napkin, and a Brazilian fullback signed from Sevilla, etc. etc. etc.

everyone in the club's history has a part to play of the current era of success. and if you're going to credit just a small handful of people, then you have to go with Pep, Xavi, Messi, and Cruyff. but really, it belongs to everyone.

 

[Abaddon]

I have not been really keeping up with all the sayings on this forum, so I have to ask does a real madrid fan seriously believe their is a conspiracy behind barcelona's recent success or is it some sort of inside joke

I just practically literally said the opposite, but evidently that alone is not enough for you people to understand it. Tragic

 

[El Gato]

I have not been really keeping up with all the sayings on this forum, so I have to ask does a real madrid fan seriously believe their is a conspiracy behind barcelona's recent success or is it some sort of inside joke

Not really, it's probably just another anti-madridista crusade.

 

[Raed]

I was arguing Nolan's point that La Masia's current success won't last and the evidence for this is seen in England & Ajax.



I don't know if we'll see another generation like this, but this isn't like the United situation where all the players were around the same age, we have a real staggered group. Xavi and Puyol belong to one group; 30+, Iniesta and Valdés to another late 20's, then we have Generation '87 along with Busi and Pedro who are 23-24, then there's Thiago who's 20. that core group of 23-24 year olds will be the backbone of the side for years to come, and give La Masia plenty of time to find new cracks. until then they only really have to produce high quality squaddies.



the success Barcelona has today is also because of a Dutch coach and the ideals he implemented, and a Catalan youth coach who helped work with kids, and a Catalan player/scout who had the foresight to sign Messi up on a napkin, and a Brazilian fullback signed from Sevilla, etc. etc. etc.

everyone in the club's history has a part to play of the current era of success. and if you're going to credit just a small handful of people, then you have to go with Pep, Xavi, Messi, and Cruyff. but really, it belongs to everyone.

No, I am not crediting a small group of people, because that is unfair to everyone who worked at the club, from Laporta (and now Rosell) to the janitor. But at the end of the day you had players who you paid for top dollar and won jack shit, with the same type of football, and then you had players who you paid top dollar for and went all the way with the same type of football. Catalysts or Heroes? You name them however you like, that is dependent on you.

Funny how your entire history had it not been for Perez taking Beckham of your hands only for your to end up with Ronaldinho.

 

[Yugi]

you guys are forgetting The Observer, Francesc Satorra... he is crucial to our success too

 

[barcelonista]

The point is that Barcelona spent, do spend, and will continue to spend large. With money or without money. Why? Because you are a big club. Your initial success came thanks to foreigners and spending well. The fact that you have brought players through, even at an insane number and quality, has not displaced your annual spending. It never will either. That was the point people were argued. Not what your academy has achieved which is indisputable.

No, that was not the point argued. The point argued was this:

Ronaldo - € 94,000,000
Kaka - € 65,000,000
Alonso - € 35,000,000
Benzema - € 35,000,000
Albiol - € 15,000,000
Di Maria - € 33,000,000
Özil - € 17,000,000
Khedira - € 14,000,000
Coentrao - € 30,000,000
Sahin - € 10,000,000
--------------------------------------

~ € 350 million from summer 2009 to summer 2011 (I even left out the "dead rubber" that's not producing much, like Pedro Leon etc.).

And still rumours comming up Real wants to buy Neymar, Götze, Hazard, Wilshere, and for that matter: any other player in the world having an overall rating of > 80 in Fifa. It's the philosophy of your club: Figo, Zidane, Ronaldo, Beckham, buying all the biggest names in word football at the same time (even if they captained your bitter rivals once ...), building a complete starting XI and splashing half a billion Euro in it at one point, simply trying to buy trophies. This has nothing to do with getting foreign players. No one ever claimed Barcelona has always succeeded with youth products only. Yes, we have spent big. At some points, we've overspent. Ibrahimovic the most recent and obvious example. We've never turned into a circus though. Rivaldo and Ronaldinho that you've mentioned cost us around the same amount of money you spent on Di Maria and Coentrao. And the Brazilians became (multiple) Ballon d'Or winners at Barcelona, each one marking an era. While you've bought 2 Ballon d'Or winners for record breaking sums to try and mark an era (which miserably failed). Get the difference?

I'll ask again. What enjoyment does a Real Madrid fan actually feel if that lot wins something at the end? You've spent more money in your squad than Manchester City did in recent years. And the latter, for some reason, are labeled as the definition of a plastic club for their spendings. You just call it "Galacticos". You took a credit from a finance house to buy Ronaldo that is asking to get bailed out by the European Central Bank now. That's where you got your money from.

 

[Raed]

Bro, those prices don't mean jack shit, you know why? Because Madrid makes profits despite those seemingly crippling figures.

And to answer your question: the same joy every fan around the world win their team wins? LOL! Because it takes a lot more than just buying players to win, as previously demonstrated by Real Madrid and other clubs around the world, including Barcelona.

I mean buying players we can afford, even if at insane prices, to win is better than buying a Dutch circus and win nothing for 6 years.

No one is ever upset to buy players, we get upset when we don't keep players. So if Madrid wins the CL and/or the league I am going to be really really happy.

And, excuse me? I mean don't open pandora's box if you can't handle the truth son, don't tell me where we get our money because you will find a lot of inconvenient truths about all big clubs around Europe.

 

[Metaphysical]

No, I am not crediting a small group of people, because that is unfair to everyone who worked at the club, from Laporta (and now Rosell) to the janitor. But at the end of the day you had players who you paid for top dollar and won jack shit, with the same type of football, and then you had players who you paid top dollar for and went all the way with the same type of football. Catalysts or Heroes? You name them however you like, that is dependent on you.

it's not the same type of football. Pep took us back to basics and our play now is different to our play in 2006 at the height of Rijkaard's reign.

Funny how your entire history had it not been for Perez taking Beckham of your hands only for your to end up with Ronaldinho.

I always thought we were only going after Beckham as a decoy to get Real to spunk their summer budget on him so we could sign Ronaldinho uncontested.

 

[Banana-Rama]

it's not the same type of football. Pep took us back to basics and our play now is different to our play in 2006 at the height of Rijkaard's reign.



I always thought we were only going after Beckham as a decoy to get Real to spunk their summer budget on him so we could sign Ronaldinho uncontested.

i can't imagine a player less suited to barcelona then beckham, i agree that it was probably a decoy.............