Real Madrid (old thread)

[Poor_Sunyol]

I think you are being unfair on Xabi. He had one slightly dodgy game but that is it. Lass gets out of position far too much which doesn't help Xabi's game.

 

[zanela]

Somehow i think the reason Michael Laudrup refused Atletico Madrid offer was due to a last minute call from Valdano

C'mon Beast, so if a manager of ur liking fails to come to an agreement with another club, its because of Valdano's last min call or Perez...Real Madrid is not the be all and end all of La Liga...Sorry, but the dane is not desperate to work for u or waiting to get a call from ur club for the job...He used ur club once to vent out his frustration & anger doesn't mean he'll refuse an offer for Real Madrid...a club he never loved.
I'm not saying it wont happen in the future coz no1 knows the future. And, if he did take it up, as much as i love him i hope he fails BIG TIME & his time at ur club be shorter than the 1 last time
He is still a culé at heart. :2145960713mundoemot
The reason he didn't accept the Atlético job was - 1) They were looking at him as a short-time solution(6/7 mnths) & wanted to assess his job at the end of the season before offering him a lengthy contract. While Michael wanted atleast a contract until 2011
2) He wanted to bring in players esp for the defense in winter. Something which the club couldn't guarantee due to their financial position.
3) He wanted his own staff which again was turned down due to monetary issues.
So, it WAS NOT a CALL FROM VALDANO that stopped him from taking up the offer.

http://www.sporten.dk/fodbold/spanien-primera-division-2009-2010/derfor-sagde-laudrup-nej

 

[Poor_Sunyol]

Maybe his sponsors couldn't come to an agreement?

 

[Nándor]

That's my line of thought CA, Michael has the ingredients Real require

1- attacking play
2- great experience as a player on a highest level and coached by some of the best.
3- SMART .. and i admired how he refused all offers from Spain and stayed for a year doing nothing but taking notes and watching the liga before taking over Getafe.
4- despite his short stay @ Real he know how it works on the inside (basically the same as his time in Barca ) .

Laudrup preferred formation is 4-2-3-1 and he & Blanc are my dream hiring ..have to say i'm deeply disappointed in Manu


this is what i wrote in Milan-Real game thread

Tactically there was many mistakes highlighted by a scene in the second half where Kaka was charging towards Milan goal and kept waving with his hand for Marcelo or someone to go to the left side .
all potential playmakers kept standing in/around the same area creating little off the ball movement mostly player standing waiting for the ball to arrive to their feet .
If this game wasn't what it is Manu could have left the club last night after a stormy meeting with Perez , i'm all for giving the coach time but i do need to feel a little difference tactically even gradually but so far it seems a whole lot of chaos and players don't really know what they are supposed to do
As an upgrade the players already upgraded compared to last year , tactically Ramos had more clear ideas ( even if it's one idea 4-4-2 ) for the players to understand or digest .

the 4-2-2-2 remains an abstract for our squad as long as no genuine effort is made for them to know their roles i said before relying on one players is very dangerous and i maintain the same stance whether his name is CR or Messi , u can't give free role to 2 players like this without showing them where to run or teach the other 8 outfield players where to go & what to do when Kaka has the ball .

I think Manuel Pellegerini need to step up for the role (last night result is irrelevant but i'm talking from a tactical aspect through out the month & half of official games ) otherwise we are relying on individuality not team/tactical side of the game which will still be boring to watch and easier to beat from other teams perspective.

I'm reading Laudrup could take over Atletico today.. sad to know since he was my man fr the job just in case Manuel can't pull his hand out of his ass in the next 3 month
he will be given enough time but seriously people need to see a little difference on the pitch cause so far we are not judging him fully which is good considering it's Perez regime



u make some valuable points and in general i agree but i personally hold Manu responsible for the choice of formation .
there is gazillion formation where he can use the "big signings " and still the team will have a shape considering Raul is expendable (a problem those before him didn't suffer ) .
in a heart beat 4-2-3-1 can fit the new players with Xab-Diarra behind CR-Kaka-Granero and Benzema upfront .. even Raul & Higuain can and did play on the wings under several managers before

however he did play this way(4-2-2-2 ) with Villarreal so it's actually his choice the problem is the players are finding it hard to understand what they are required to do and (according to Benzema ) there is a difference between what they do in training and what they do on the pitch

He is given good time and patience so far but he can't deliver a minimum improvement ..
i like & respect Pellegrini and i was so excited about the choice but so far it's another disappointment tactically .. i fear i was wrong in my opinion in him (like Ramos )
there is no shame in switching to a normal formation to utilize the best of the players but he is being stubborn sticking to his 4-2-2-2 which proved too hard for the squad to understand
the best games Real played in pre -season was 4-2-3-1 and he should take note and soon

first, sorry if i meantion things that had been meantioned before...i just no longer have the time to keep up entirely.

with regards to laudrup, the basic question i ask myself is, how come that coaches you are known for being tactical to a certain extend (like ramos & pellegrini) fail to deliver that tactical knowledge when taking over real madrid!!!??? all of a sudden ramos gets outsmarted by benitez and real raped by l'pool in the CL, pellegrini seems to have limited his tactical "ingeneering" skills to the already failed system of the 4-2-2-2 magic box and fails to provide this squad with a working system or any working tactical gameplan. that's got a fishy taste hasn't it???
never the less, so far, pellegrini is not up to the faith i had in him.

and on a sidenote, laudrup won't take over atleti...apperently it's all settled with quique (MARCA). laudrup refused to take over.

with regards to the analyse, i think we basically agree. i just think our attack is weak. take milan game 27 shots, 10 on goal and only 2 goals scored. milan had 11 shots, 4 on goal and 3 goals scored. the game should have been over before pirlos goal, but the attack, basically benzema since raul was trying at least, was unable to do so and lacked alternatives due to higuains & ruuds injuries.

well magic box (south american thingy ? ) or not it remains to be seen

Anyhow i forgot to add we have no LB problem... we have a midfield problem
we tried the "Defensive " lb in Heinze and still failed, Marcelo is an attacking full back like Evra and others and he do pretty well with Brazil without the weaknesses shown with Real so think about it is it Marcelo problem or the midfield who fail to provide cover for the attacking full back ..
All the other LB have the exact same tendencies (Evra,Clichy , Vargas ) ..

Xabi needs to step up or leave the job for Diarra-Lass

or that lack of cover is simply down to pellegrinis bad tactics??? or better said, his lack of tactical advice and the players understanding of his tactics???

i mean, it's not like ramos has way more cover on his side than marcelo is it??? yet the goals scored from the left side are mostly down to an error by marcelo/drenthe.

but i agree that xabi needs to step up...though i think he'll need another 2 months before he's really gonna kick it.

@ incognito...you do of course have a point, however do you think that players like negredo & parejo would really have made a big difference with all this tactical problems going on atm???!!!

 

[Beast]

C'mon Beast, so if a manager of ur liking fails to come to an agreement with another club, its because of Valdano's last min call or Perez...Real Madrid is not the be all and end all of La Liga...Sorry, but the dane is not desperate to work for u or waiting to get a call from ur club for the job...He used ur club once to vent out his frustration & anger doesn't mean he'll refuse an offer for Real Madrid...a club he never loved.
I'm not saying it wont happen in the future coz no1 knows the future. And, if he did take it up, as much as i love him i hope he fails BIG TIME & his time at ur club be shorter than the 1 last time
He is still a culé at heart. :2145960713mundoemot
The reason he didn't accept the Atlético job was - 1) They were looking at him as a short-time solution(6/7 mnths) & wanted to assess his job at the end of the season before offering him a lengthy contract. While Michael wanted atleast a contract until 2011
2) He wanted to bring in players esp for the defense in winter. Something which the club couldn't guarantee due to their financial position.
3) He wanted his own staff which again was turned down due to monetary issues.
So, it WAS NOT a CALL FROM VALDANO that stopped him from taking up the offer.

http://www.sporten.dk/fodbold/spanien-primera-division-2009-2010/derfor-sagde-laudrup-nej

I know you like the guy .. so do i, Laudrup was my fav Madrid player in the 90's but all this " a club he never loved " "used your club to vent frustration " is a bit far fetched if anything he felt bitter with Barca

Michael was always on the horizon for Real in the last 3 years from the last elections to even one of the names for Perez.. while he hardly featured in Barca plans.. nuff said

and differentiate between a feeling and a rumor or a certainty

 

[IrvDizzle]

so you don't believe any more, Gio?

 

[zanela]

I know you like the guy .. so do i, Laudrup was my fav Madrid player in the 90's but all this " a club he never loved " "used your club to vent frustration " is a bit far fetched if anything he felt bitter with Barca

There was only 1 club he ever loved in La Liga, Beast & that was :2145960713mundoemot
He was happy playing here, successful, won everything with us & would 've never moved to R.Madrid if it wasn't for his fall-out with Cruyff...He'd 've stayed here for a long time if not. He didn't feel bitter with Barca, he felt bitter with his Manager...It was to prove a point to him, which is y after he achieved his objective, he flopped in his second year...It was never about the money nor a desire to play for u..The only player i wish we had not let go of. I believe with him we'd 've won more titles...But his mind was truely f*cked up when he moved to u...Its like when ur angry & upset with ur loved ones, u do things to hurt them. But u NEVER stop loving them...So yes Beast he hurt us by moving to u but he still loves us like he did before & we love him(atleast i do )

Michael was always on the horizon for Real in the last 3 years from the last elections to even one of the names for Perez.. while he hardly featured in Barca plans.. nuff said

What do u mean he hardly featured in Barca plans? He was one of the names proposed to replace Rijkaard before we settled for Pep.

and differentiate between a feeling and a rumor or a certainty

I know it was ur feeling & u keep having these 'feelings' But i just wanted to tell u were wrong this time.

 

[Beast]

In what Irv ? i believe in Valdano fully (if that's what u meant ) and i'm having second thoughts about Manu.
It's not about the results but the improvement , it's minimum and i'm yet to see his works in the last month.
he was courted today from the press about his refusal to use side/wingers and he replied we played well vs Milan without wingers until we "lost concentration " ..etc
I don't like the manager to be living in denial , there is NO SHAME in admitting you were wrong and change your formation/tactics the same way Capello did 3 years ago with players & formation and he isn't bigger then Capello

@ Zanela , he did great for 2 years and he is much loved in Madrid & have fond memories of his time @ Real .. voted the best foreign player in our century celebration in the last 25 years .. lets see if he will move to us or Villarreal (according to La Sexta )

 

[zanela]

I already know about the rumours linking him to Villareal
If these rumours are true, i'm hoping he takes it & R.Madrid sign A.Resino

 

[IrvDizzle]

ok ... sooo ... which wingers would Manu be able to substitute in to his side, and who would he have to take out? You mentioned earlier that Kaka was waving Marcelo forward in the Milano game, but we spent a good three pages (well, I spent a good three pages) ripping Marcelo to shreds. I'm sure the press in Madrid have been worse. The poor kid is probably unsure of anything right now, confidence at an all time low (I'm hoping that this downward spiral continues and he cracks in the first Clasico), 2nd guessing himself all the time ... not exactly the best type of player to have on the pitch ... so who are you replacing with who? and once you've got that picture in your head of what the formation should be, what the players should be, ask yourself this question: Would Manuel be able to implement this formation on the pitch without Perez (not Valdano, cuz he doesn't run shit) telling him otherwise?

 

[Beast]

ok ... sooo ... which wingers would Manu be able to substitute in to his side, and who would he have to take out? You mentioned earlier that Kaka was waving Marcelo forward in the Milano game, but we spent a good three pages (well, I spent a good three pages) ripping Marcelo to shreds. I'm sure the press in Madrid have been worse. The poor kid is probably unsure of anything right now, confidence at an all time low (I'm hoping that this downward spiral continues and he cracks in the first Clasico), 2nd guessing himself all the time ... not exactly the best type of player to have on the pitch ... so who are you replacing with who? and once you've got that picture in your head of what the formation should be, what the players should be, ask yourself this question: Would Manuel be able to implement this formation on the pitch without Perez (not Valdano, cuz he doesn't run shit) telling him otherwise?

Players who could operate from the sides
CR,Granero,Marcelo,Drenthe..
then u have Higuain and lastly Raul

Marcelo is a tough kid and he learned the hard way .. every time he come under fire he respond on the pitch (After Seville he scored a nice goal last game ) his position isn't that much under fire as the press are trying to solve the puzzle of why the team isn't playing well till now or at least have a clear tactical plan .

Ask yourself does Manuel have better available players then the one he has now ?
It's really easy to implement a formation a clear formation .. he has the squad a very good one and probably the best squad in Europe (on paper ) after Barca if he can't make it function or have a clear tactical plan it's his problem not Perez and not anyone else.
the old galactico was slammed because they didn't have proper defensive players.. this team has Diarra-Lass-Xabi .. even Gago , the management got Albiol & Arbeloa instead of the 2 defenders everyone agreed is a liability above them there is also Garay.. so he quite honestly have no excuse of the old galactico regime that Real just buy forwards/attackers ..etc
and no Irv Perez runs nothing .. if this was a Perez team Pellegerini would be out by now

 

[veryfatchocobo]

If you guys really want to have a good sound defense, simply play Arbeloa at LB (if he's not injured anymore). He's not a natural there, but it's better having Marcelo and Drenthe there. From what I've seen, it's not the center or the right of defense that's the problem, it's the left. Marcelo should be pushed up if Granero and CR9 aren't playing. Keep Raul and re-obtain Negredo, but you'll have to lose Benzema in the process.

If I was an RM fan, I'd want to see the Madrid tradition of the '90s and early 2000s back, before Perez's first Reich (...).

 

[Beast]

Arbeloa will /should be first choice LB in the big games when he is fit to play ..
As for the third reich ..
As RM u need to do both @ the same time, be competitive now and setup the youth ..
It's a long list of accumulated mistakes but at least we are seeing a break in the pattern by De La Red a year ago and Granero now

 

[IrvDizzle]

Players who could operate from the sides
CR,Granero,Marcelo,Drenthe..
then u have Higuain and lastly Raul

Marcelo is a tough kid and he learned the hard way .. every time he come under fire he respond on the pitch (After Seville he scored a nice goal last game ) his position isn't that much under fire as the press are trying to solve the puzzle of why the team isn't playing well till now or at least have a clear tactical plan .

Ask yourself does Manuel have better available players then the one he has now ?
It's really easy to implement a formation a clear formation .. he has the squad a very good one and probably the best squad in Europe (on paper ) after Barca if he can't make it function or have a clear tactical plan it's his problem not Perez and not anyone else.
the old galactico was slammed because they didn't have proper defensive players.. this team has Diarra-Lass-Xabi .. even Gago , the management got Albiol & Arbeloa instead of the 2 defenders everyone agreed is a liability above them there is also Garay.. so he quite honestly have no excuse of the old galactico regime that Real just buy forwards/attackers ..etc
and no Irv Perez runs nothing .. if this was a Perez team Pellegerini would be out by now

who hired Manu in the first place?

 

[Beast]

who hired Manu in the first place?

Valdano , but so would anyone in his shoes..
u want a succesful manager who make his teams play very good football and have a good track record .. only select few could fit that bill and Pellegrini is high on that list don't you think ?