Ronald Koeman

[khaled_a_d]

Just the biggest Amigo of them all and some of his disciples who are scared they will implode if they don't look for him all the time.

Why he would hate the current game plan if he is now playing number 10 that suits him?
We have very few players who actually benefit individually from going back to 433, from La Masia (which this lame reports imply) only Busquets and Puig fit the description.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Very few managers will turn us down if we present a good offer and opportunities, Germanic or not.

While I agree being from Germany won't hurt our option, I still think we can be turned down easily be many managers who loves their career long term.
Nagelsmann is younger than Pique and Messi, basically a no body in comparison to them, doesn't speak the language which is still huge issue for Barca
He will need so many promises to be sure he can do his magic here.
Basically something like Laporta did with Pep, not sure if a new president will want to this for Nagelsmann

 

[Luftstalag14]

While I agree being from Germany won't hurt our option, I still think we can be turned down easily be many managers who loves their career long term.
Nagelsmann is younger than Pique and Messi, basically a no body in comparison to them, doesn't speak the language which is still huge issue for Barca
He will need so many promises to be sure he can do his magic here.
Basically something like Laporta did with Pep, not sure if a new president will want to this for Nagelsmann

I agree not knowing Spanish would be a barrier for someone like Nagelsmann (whether he is from Germany or elsewhere) but his age and experience shouldn't be an issue, in the post-Messi Barca with only a few cantera veterans left (Pique, Busquets and Alba only should have a couple of years left at best), he should be able to establish his authority, with support from the president and the sporting director.

Of course, some managers, be them Spanish or foreign might still turn us down if they think managing us is too big of a daunting task, too much of a challenge and if they fail they are worried about the rest of their coaching career being damaged or adversely affected, then it is a different question.

 

[khaled_a_d]

I agree not knowing Spanish would be a barrier for someone like Nagelsmann (whether he is from Germany or elsewhere) but his age and experience shouldn't be an issue, in the post-Messi Barca with only a few cantera veterans left (Pique, Busquets and Alba only should have a couple of years left at best), he should be able to establish his authority, with support from the president and the sporting director.

Of course, some managers, be them Spanish or foreign might still turn us down if they think managing us is too big of a daunting task, too much of a challenge and if they fail they are worried about the rest of their coaching career being damaged or adversely affected, then it is a different question.

That is the key.
If I am a new manager, I want grantees from the club that I will get full support and basically do what I want.
Laporta did that with Pep, even to a degree that it wasn't right but he was simply worth it.
The question for me, is any president giving Nagelsmann that type of support? He doesn't have the accolades of Klopp, or the club connection like Pep

 

[Devils]

Brendan "Tiki Taka" Rodgers would be the GOAT manager for FC Barcelona.

Impossible to get him though.

 

[Luftstalag14]

That is the key.
If I am a new manager, I want grantees from the club that I will get full support and basically do what I want.
Laporta did that with Pep, even to a degree that it wasn't right but he was simply worth it.
The question for me, is any president giving Nagelsmann that type of support? He doesn't have the accolades of Klopp, or the club connection like Pep

But that is not an issue exclusively for Nagelsmann, is it? It would apply to any manager the new president hires and I'd argue that even for the more established ones like Klopp or Poch or Allegri we will have to ponder what degree of freedom they have to do what they want, both from the squad-building (buying players that the manager wants and likes, basically the manager will play a central role in transfers as opposed to the sporting director/board) and tactics and style of play etc. (let's say ditching possession and short pass-based play and go for counter-based, hoofing the balls over and making crosses to a tall No.9 etc.), deviating from what people recognize as Barca etc. It is a good question, I sometimes wonder how much freedom a manager has, even the most established ones.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

At the moment everyone would be better than Koewoman

 

[Luftstalag14]

At the moment everyone would be better than Koewoman

Come on, not true.

 

[khaled_a_d]

But that is not an issue exclusively for Nagelsmann, is it? It would apply to any manager the new president hires and I'd argue that even for the more established ones like Klopp or Poch or Allegri we will have to ponder what degree of freedom they have to do what they want, both from the squad-building (buying players that the manager wants and likes, basically the manager will play a central role in transfers as opposed to the sporting director/board) and tactics and style of play etc. (let's say ditching possession and short pass-based play and go for counter-based, hoofing the balls over and making crosses to a tall No.9 etc.), deviating from what people recognize as Barca etc. It is a good question, I sometimes wonder how much freedom a manager has, even the most established ones.

Two things:
1-It is true for every manager that isn't desperate to get a job in a big club. Nagelsmann is already in a CL side and a contender in Bundesliga, who knows that Bayern job is waiting for him one day.
He is beyond being a midtable coach who wants to challenge himself in big club, which is a rare opportunity

2-More established names will want more authority, but club presidents will be more willing to give them that.
Do you think if next president find the agent of Klopp or Pep calling, and saying my client will come if you do this and that, they would hesitate? But would they accept same thing from Nagelsmann?

 

[Luftstalag14]

Two things:
1-It is true for every manager that isn't desperate to get a job in a big club. Nagelsmann is already in a CL side and a contender in Bundesliga, who knows that Bayern job is waiting for him one day.
He is beyond being a midtable coach who wants to challenge himself in big club, which is a rare opportunity

2-More established names will want more authority, but club presidents will be more willing to give them that.
Do you think if next president find the agent of Klopp or Pep calling, and saying my client will come if you do this and that, they would hesitate? But would they accept same thing from Nagelsmann?

No, my point was not Nagelsmann or anybody is desperate to get this job and they are calling us to express their interests etc., I am saying if we make our move first and offer a job to them, very few would refuse in m opinion. As to Nagelsmann, I don't know if he is waiting for that Bayern job, just because he is German (he was a TSV 1860 product, the anti-Bayern side in Munich ).

Agreed that more established managers will probably be given more authority, freedom or leeway than those that come with a lesser pedigree. My thought was Nagelsmann would be a good candidate because he has what we need when we need to rebuild, especially when we need new blood and younger players to step up. Him leaving Hoffenheim for Leipzig showed that he was up to challenges and he took a newly promoted side with a lot of young players to the next level. Of course, one might say he will never get the same level of support he has at Leipzig here, oh well then. If we only go for those managers with so-called Barca DNA and never think outside the box, I have a bad feeling that it will take a long time for us to recover and get out of this rut.

 

[Birdy]

What we should do is move to a 4-3-3 right away with De Jong, Pedri and Puig midfield 3. Busi is done, Pjanic is never a player for a rebuild since he's slightly better than Busi but in the same boat really. So, just work with this front 3 which is the only one we have now looking at the future. Try to build some chemistry between them. They are all young and energetic and good with the ball, and 2 of 3 are fast as well.

When everyone is fit, I'd expect ideally De Jong - Puig - Pedri, Fati - Messi/Griezmann/Braithwaite - Dembele.

The point of that piece of news is that it's not players' position and authority to make such judgments and co-decide the system.
We can make the discussion, and I am sure Koeman makes it with his assistants and decides.

Now, about the discussion itself, I slightly disagree for the following reasons:
- De Jong has never played successfully as a single pivot, so there are many question-marks around that.
- Apart from Puig and Pedri (Alena maybe), our squad does not have any other players that can play as interiors. Unless there is a strategic planning to go out and buy quality there, there is no depth.
And I would say it's not wise to shift the entire system just to accommodate puig atm
- Then, another huge issue is that with 4-3-3 all of Coutinho, Griezman (and Messi, but I consider that he will be gone soon) do not have any place in the team. They cannot play as wingers (pay also attention to the fact that in the 4-3-3 the wingers should absolutely hugg the touchline so as not bump into the interior, whereas in the 4-2-3-1 they have more leeway to cut in), they cannot be forwards (none of them). Their only proper position is that of CAM or '10'

Koeman is right to say that the squad atm is better suited for 4-2-3-1, cz otherwise he would be condemning Messi, Griezman, Coutinho and at the same time take huge risks with Frenkie and the midfield.
On the top of that, the complacency and slow passing game that we played for years with the 4-3-3 should be shook away, and changing the system is a good stimulus to do so

Nagelsman is a coaching gem, but
1) He is not moving anytime soon. Not of the type that would jump ship, abandon the project at Leipzig midway just to fulfill the dream of coaching a big club just for a little bit. He is smart, he rejected Real Madrid already knowing it was not the right move for his career at the time.
2) I am sure Liverpool's analytic and scouting department has identified him already as Klopp's replacement in 3 years. Anyone would prefer to go to a perfectly functioning organization, than a mess
3) Language/culture barrier is a real issue unfortunately. I wish it gets overcome soon, but I currently do not see it. Chances of going for a Latin/Spanish-speaking coach are much higher than for a Germanic one
4) All potential presidents will give Xavi the chance before Nagelsman (mistakenly of course). I think we can all see that.

Finally, as I said a few posts before, many of you think rebuilding starts with a new young coach who works and develops young squad. Wrong!
We are not there yet. We need to 'clean the house' first, and this has only started, there is a long way to go.
Koeman has shown he is good for that job. Xavi or Nagelsman will be burnt immediately if thrown into that duty atm.

 

[Adversus]

Barca having 3 number 10s is exactly what Koeman bought for Everton and I see it is going just as well.

Brandon Rodgers would also be good.

That's a great shout. As an Everton fan I hate to say it but he's a fantastic manager.

 

[JamDav1982]

Rodgers has been learned Spanish and is fluent already partly with his ultimate aim of being Barca coach one day.

Be interesting appointment at some point if keeps doing well.

 

[serghei]

The point of that piece of news is that it's not players' position and authority to make such judgments and co-decide the system.
We can make the discussion, and I am sure Koeman makes it with his assistants and decides.

Now, about the discussion itself, I slightly disagree for the following reasons:
- De Jong has never played successfully as a single pivot, so there are many question-marks around that.
- Apart from Puig and Pedri (Alena maybe), our squad does not have any other players that can play as interiors. Unless there is a strategic planning to go out and buy quality there, there is no depth.
And I would say it's not wise to shift the entire system just to accommodate puig atm
- Then, another huge issue is that with 4-3-3 all of Coutinho, Griezman (and Messi, but I consider that he will be gone soon) do not have any place in the team. They cannot play as wingers (pay also attention to the fact that in the 4-3-3 the wingers should absolutely hang the touchline so as not bump into the interior, whereas in the 4-2-3-1 they have more leeway to cut in), they cannot be forwards (none of them). Their only proper position is that of CAM or '10'

Koeman is right to say that the squad atm is better suited for 4-2-3-1, cz otherwise he would be condemning Messi, Griezman, Coutinho and at the same time take huge risks with Frenkie and the midfield.
On the top of that, the complacency and slow passing game that we played for years with the 4-3-3 should be shook away, and changing the system is a good stimulus to do so

I would not approach it like that.

When you rebuild a team, you start with an idea for how to play and you shape the team around that. We set to play 4-3-3, and we shape the squad in this direction, based on what we need.

That's what I understand from rebuilding.

I set to play 4-3-3 (because of major benefits), discover the weak points of the system and correct them with new players.

In other words, the job in a rebuild is not to find the system that works best for what you currently have (that's by default thinking short-term as Valverde did with his ancient 4-4-2). It is to develop the team for what you want to play. And besides that, his 4-2-3-1 isn't even working. So, instead of implementing the 4-3-3 we're wasting time playing a 4-2-3-1 which brings us nothing. If anything, it brings us non-stop bench time for one of our most promising midfielders.

But anyway, Koeman is a short term solution. He'll be gone in the summer 90%.

 

[Gaudi]

Nagelsmann for the rebuild.

I would try Jesse Marsch