Xavi Hernández

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serghei

Senior Member
What was the context? "I don't know the meaning of average."

For example.

Ten Hag is average compared to Pep and Klopp.

That's an example of average in comparison with... not being equal to average in general.

Like EV being an ok manager by normal standards, but for a top tier club he is an average option. See? That's context changing the meaning of something.
 

Birdy

Senior Member
For example.

Ten Hag is average compared to Pep and Klopp.

That's an example of average in comparison with... not being equal to average in general.

Like EV being an ok manager by normal standards, but for a top tier club he is an average option. See? That's context changing the meaning of something.

It's a bad thing also to 'cheat' and change the goalposts of the argument every time to save yourself.

No, you didn't claim that ETH is average compared to Pep and Klopp (BTW who the fuck ever claimed ETH is better than them already?)
you simply claimed that Poch and ETH are both AVERAGE, full stop.

You could have added that Xavi is not average but great to give the full picture of your view on coaches.
 

serghei

Senior Member
It's a bad thing also to 'cheat' and change the goalposts of the argument every time to save yourself.

No, you didn't claim that ETH is average compared to Pep and Klopp (BTW who the fuck ever claimed ETH is better than them already?)
you simply claimed that Poch and ETH are both AVERAGE, full stop.

You could have added that Xavi is not average but great to give the full picture of your view on coaches.

I sometimes do that like everyone else here (must be like one of the most common things on forums), but not usually. Put up the post you're talking about with me saying ETH is average and we can discuss it. Don't remember saying something like that the way you imply.
 

Birdy

Senior Member
I sometimes do that like everyone else here (must be like one of the most common things on forums), but not usually. Put up the post you're talking about with me saying ETH is average and we can discuss it. Don't remember saying something like that the way you imply.

I am wasting time from my work to find this.

But here it is:
Pochettino is average. So is Ten Hag, who has a team anyway.

Page 442 of Laporta thread

Don't go edit it now
 

Horatio

You're welcome
For example.

Ten Hag is average compared to Pep and Klopp.

That's an example of average in comparison with... not being equal to average in general.

Like EV being an ok manager by normal standards, but for a top tier club he is an average option. See? That's context changing the meaning of something.

very weird wording imo. Why not just say Pep and Klopp are superior coaches to Ten Hag?
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Serghie is lying as usual.

Have called him out numerous times for his mental gymnastics and 'this is what I really meant' nonsense.

He said ETH is average because United were not doing well and now trying to make out any coach bar Pep and Klopp are average compared to them.

Even more idiotic when he on the page before slates those who 'only want Pep or Klopp' yet now says he dismisses coaches who are not them as 'average' in comparison.

The mention of ETH had nothing to do with Pep or Klopp anyway it was in relation to a coach compared to Xavi.

Usual Serghie shite. Does it all the time.
 

mdenci

Member
I didn't scroll through this thread very much, but I have a need to say this:

I really believe in Xavi. I think he has a very rough time implementing some of his ideas due to the financial and structural catastrophe at the Club. About playing "his friend" Busi, I really believe that Busquets has a clause in his contract that strictly says how much play time he has to have during a season (again, this is my opinion, I haven't verified it anywhere, but is it really that hard to believe in it considering kinds of contracts players signed during the Bartomeu era?) and Xavi can't do much about that. And since Busi must play, best thing for Xavi is to boost his confidence through press conferences and hope for the best (but even he knows that Busi's time has long passed). We have seen some of Xavi's ideas when he had Dani for a couple of games, his idea is that one wing back players enters the midfield middle during possession thus creating an extra player there and free the line for some of our faster players (we trashed Real Madrid 0:4 with this tactics), and I trust he has many more up his sleeve, but he demands players of certain skill and ability to try them in action.

I love slow build ups, be that during a game, or during a rebuilding of a club. I'm somewhat disappointed that the Club didn't grasp the opportunity to slowly rebuild with it's own youth academy (although I do understand that Pedri, Gavi, Ansu and Araujo would probably look for another club if this were the case), but instead chose to go for an instant success which turned out to be a fluke. In my opinion, the press would understand what the Club is going through, the fans would accept that we are out of any major title battle for a couple of those rebuilding years and most importantly, Xavi could work without any sort of pressure during that period - that way we could have stabilized the Club's finances, and have a competitive team in which we could fill voids with some of the worlds finest talent.

But since that didn't happen, we should ease the pressure from the fans, be realistic about our team and our chances in certain competitions and BE PATIENT. If Sir Alex Ferguson met this kind of pressure and backlash when he started out, he would be remembered as a fluke, but instead he received trust and was given time to prove his worth and that made him one of the best coach in history. I'm not saying Xavi will some day be recognized in that category, but we must give him time and trust to see what he can do. Since this is a new age and time to get results is way shorter than when SAF started as a coach, I would give Xavi another two years fixed, because after we clear out our dressing room, I think we have wonderful things to look forward to.
 

Sailor Mars

Well-known member
Folks are being very aggressive in bringing out the pitchforks against Xavi already. Still half a season left to see how he does in the rest of the league campaign and Europa.

Barca have a good enough starting XI when healthy, minus RB and occasionally DM, but lacking in quality depth and that showed when 3 defenders got injured. There's still some rebuilding that has to happen due to the neglect from Bartomeu.

Early concerns about Xavi, in addition to his subpar European performances, are things like thinking FBs like Azpi and Alonso could be decent stop-gaps, unrelenting support of Busi in Barca's playstyle, and the lack of production from the forwards he has brought in like Torres and Raphinha.
 

Nazario1985

Senior Member
Folks are being very aggressive in bringing out the pitchforks against Xavi already. Still half a season left to see how he does in the rest of the league campaign and Europa.

Barca have a good enough starting XI when healthy, minus RB and occasionally DM, but lacking in quality depth and that showed when 3 defenders got injured. There's still some rebuilding that has to happen due to the neglect from Bartomeu.

Early concerns about Xavi, in addition to his subpar European performances, are things like thinking FBs like Azpi and Alonso could be decent stop-gaps, unrelenting support of Busi in Barca's playstyle, and the lack of production from the forwards he has brought in like Torres and Raphinha.

Why give him that benefit when other coaches were trashed even earlier??

Why get booted out of the group stage which fucks us financially? he was given the best summer it can be.

That should have been so easy with the current squad, yet he fucked up for reminder our squad is 5 times what Inter's is worth (and equal to RM)

Should we wait 2-3 years before judging and loosing hundreds of millions of $ and good players best years?

He's been here for a full year already.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Dont moan about the quality of the squad when Xavi has two wide players on bench who the club paid 120m+ for and yet have dross like Bellerin at RB and Alonso who has never been a good defenders at CB.

The 'sqaud depth' is due to how they spent the money they had on those forwards and not for better depth at FBs.

Dont take in Bellerin and Alonso and moan about them not being good enough when have to play them.
 

Sailor Mars

Well-known member
Why give him that benefit when other coaches were trashed even earlier??

Why get booted out of the group stage which fucks us financially? he was given the best summer it can be.

That should have been so easy with the current squad, yet he fucked up for reminder our squad is 5 times what Inter's is worth (and equal to RM)

Should we wait 2-3 years before judging and loosing hundreds of millions of $ and good players best years?

He's been here for a full year already.

Other coaches, besides Koeman which was down to board politics, were not trashed earlier for results. Setien and Martino lost the locker rooms which is why there were let go or mutually decided to resign.

Getting booted out of the group stage is something that Xavi has some blame in like the wingers being useless in almost every big game, but the team just isn't good enough defensively with injuries to the 3 CBs.

I wouldn't wait 2-3 years, but give him the rest of the season, and likely next season as well.
 

Sailor Mars

Well-known member
Dont moan about the quality of the squad when Xavi has two wide players on bench who the club paid 120m+ for and yet have dross like Bellerin at RB and Alonso who has never been a good defenders at CB.

The 'sqaud depth' is due to how they spent the money they had on those forwards and not for better depth at FBs.

Dont take in Bellerin and Alonso and moan about them not being good enough when have to play them.

The squad depth issue is primarily due to multiple failed transfers from the Barto era.

The money was pretty well spent this summer before the season began. A majority of fans were happy with bringing in winger like Raphinha, Lewandowski, and Kounde. Plus Christensen and Kessie on free contracts. Can't cover all deficiencies in one summer with limited funds.

Bellerin was a last minute signing to have a body in case there were injuries. Alonso was a free signing, but you could criticize Xavi for that one because from the rumors it seemed like he was pushing for Azpi and Alonso as the new FBs.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
No it isnt.

The squad depth issue is due to how they decided to spend money this year.

Time has passed to just blame everything on the past.

Usual shite.

Barca have 120m of players on the bench and playing players like Bellerin and Alonso is nothing to do with the past.

Bellerin being last minute is irrelevant and more than anything goes to show how poor the planning was.

They are lucky Balde has emerged in way they never expected really as could be even worse.
 

Nazario1985

Senior Member
Other coaches, besides Koeman which was down to board politics, were not trashed earlier for results. Setien and Martino lost the locker rooms which is why there were let go or mutually decided to resign.

Getting booted out of the group stage is something that Xavi has some blame in like the wingers being useless in almost every big game, but the team just isn't good enough defensively with injuries to the 3 CBs.

I wouldn't wait 2-3 years, but give him the rest of the season, and likely next season as well.

That's 2 years and a half :D

he has 100% the blame for CL elimination, this is the easiest shit to do when managing a squad like this.

Not being able to win a single game except against a less than pro team Pilzen something .. with a squad worth near 400 million $ ...

An out of shape Bayern & Inter one of the weakest defenses in Serie A, a team we used to trash with B squad ...
 

Sailor Mars

Well-known member
No it isnt.

The squad depth issue is due to how they decided to spend money this year.

Time has passed to just blame everything on the past.

Usual shite.

Barca have 120m of players on the bench and playing players like Bellerin and Alonso is nothing to do with the past.

Bellerin being last minute is irrelevant and more than anything goes to show how poor the planning was.

They are lucky Balde has emerged in way they never expected really as could be even worse.

How is poor planning, as you say, only Xavi's fault? He isn't a money printer that can procure funds for top class fullbacks. Barca were going to have to spend to bring in a few great players and then penny-pinch in certain areas. Better to spend big on some top players and pennypinch on others, instead of spreading out the money. Need ceiling-raisers, not floor raisers.

The Ferran signing looks bad, and Raphinha could join him too but the sporting department would have some blame in that as well.
 
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