Xavi Hernández

[ajnotkeith]

Yes, Xavi AND the players. You never get it do you?

There is no logic in the world that would let you blame the manager and not the players for results for a club in Barca's situation.

Your logic would've worked if these Barca players would have made some top results in CL and La Liga before Xavi, and now Xavi is ruinning then, but when Xavi signed on they were like 9th in La Liga. And now under Xavi they are La Liga winners. It's obviously a natural, and great progress in the timeframe at hand.

However great you think these players are, I can assure you they are not and it's still some long way to go.

Almost none of the current XI were involved in us being 9th before he was appointed.
Christensen, Kounde, Aubameyang, Ferran, Dembele, Pedri, Lewandowski, Raphinha, Kessie did not play during that time period. The team was completely different due to injuries and new signings coming after.


So no, they did not 'go from 9th to LaLiga winners', they weren't even there when that happened.

 

[serghei]

Yes and the point is the coach is the one expected to get the best out of their players.

That is their job. They live and die by their players peformances and the position they put them in to succeed.

Simple.

Barca should be doing a lot better with squad have than did last season and end of previous one in Europe.

Likewise it is pointed out when teams have better players overall than Barca such as City currently.

Yes, manager has to improve the team. And Xavi did. From 9th place in La Liga, to winning it is some serious improvement by all reasonable and logical metrics. If that is not improvement, nothing is.

Of course in CL it's gonna take longer and you're gonna need more money to do it. That's assumed and expected.

 

[JamDav1982]

Cant even compare the circumstances Barca were under to be 9th in table at that point to what Xavi has had at Barca..

Ridiculous.

 

[serghei]

Cant even compare the circumstances Barca were under to be 9th in table at that point to what Xavi has had at Barca..

Ridiculous.

Of course not. Dominating the league vs Madrid last season is still impressive result, and surpassing expectations. Expectations before the season was competing for the title, not dominating the league and winning it in clear fashion.

 

[JamDav1982]

Yes, manager has to improve the team. And Xavi did. From 9th place in La Liga, to winning it is some serious improvement by all reasonable and logical metrics. If that is not improvement, nothing is.

Of course in CL it's gonna take longer and you're gonna need more money to do it. That's assumed and expected.

Team improved but were never 9th level. They were a few points off top 4 with Koeman being undermined and dealing with Messi hangover and Pedri/Dembele injured.

The team have improved in league...that happens when players get back fit, younger players gets more ecperience, Balde etc emerge and then spend hundreds of millions.

There is no reason at all why should be beating Real then making out 'takes longer' to not only beat Plzn in ten games in Europe.

Makes no sense whatsoever.

 

[JamDav1982]

Of course not. Dominating the league vs Madrid last season is still impressive result, and surpassing expectations. Expectations before the season was competing for the title, not dominating the league and winning it in clear fashion.

Well no..some of us knew Barca would compete and absolutely had squad to beat Real to title. Even putting Barca slight favs.

Others argued Xavi and squad not up to it and 'years plus hundreds of millions away'.

 

[Iniesta Ultra]

ruined Bristol chart this shit

 

[jamrock]

Almost none of the current XI were involved in us being 9th before he was appointed.
Christensen, Kounde, Aubameyang, Ferran, Dembele, Pedri, Lewandowski, Raphinha, Kessie did not play during that time period. The team was completely different due to injuries and new signings coming after.


So no, they did not 'go from 9th to LaLiga winners', they weren't even there when that happened.

My that logic you could say klopp didn't win take Liverpool from X position to Winning the league, because the team he won it with, was improved over the one he started with.

Or if ETH wins anything this season

Or I could keep naming names.

That logic doesn't add up TBH.

The team was as a matter of fact 9th when he took over and with his work & the executive team, they assembled a team and worked their way to winning the league


Something many managers have been given credit for, so why not him?.

The Xavi dislike goes a bit too far sometimes.

 

[ajnotkeith]

My that logic you could say klopp didn't win take Liverpool from X position to Winning the league, because the team he won it with, was improved over the one he started with.

Or if ETH wins anything this season

Or I could keep naming names.

That logic doesn't add up TBH.

The team was as a matter of fact 9th when he took over and with his work & the executive team, they assembled a team and worked their way to winning the league


Something many managers have been given credit for, so why not him?.

The Xavi dislike goes a bit too far sometimes.

Different argument. He was saying, the same players which were in 9th before, became LaLiga winners due to Xavi's coaching, and the fact they were in 9th shows they aren't that good.
But they weren't the same players in 9th. The team is totally different.

Winning LaLiga is a big accomplishment, but trying to play down the squads quality because 'they were in 9th' when it is completely different to what it was then doesn't wash.

 

[JamDav1982]

Team were 9th and a few points off top four having had injuries, undermined coach and hangover of Messi being taken away at last minute as well as injuries to Pedri/Dembele etc.

Ignore all that and wont get full picture of where team really were and why and under conditions Xavi did not have to deal with.

Had Barca finished 9th season before and that looked their level then different argument but never the case.

 

[jamrock]

Different argument. He was saying, the same players which were in 9th before, became LaLiga winners due to Xavi's coaching, and the fact they were in 9th shows they aren't that good.
But they weren't the same players in 9th. The team is totally different.

Winning LaLiga is a big accomplishment, but trying to play down the squads quality because 'they were in 9th' when it is completely different to what it was then doesn't wash.

Nah he said xavi took the club FC Barcelona 9th and won them the league, first in 4 years might add.

You're just following Jamdav argue for the sake of argument line with the it's different players, to muddy the water.

Everyone knows the squad got better, he was apart of why the squad got better.

Like I said no ever points out that X coach, had better players when they won something, because that's goes without say, bringing that up is just an attempt to muddy the waters.

You're better than that.

They quality of the players he/we had at our disposal even due to injuries, simply serves to highlight how far the club is coming from.

And that fans should use some prospective when being overly critical.

Every other top team has/had injuries, no put on a team as bad as the one we had to field.

 

[ajnotkeith]

Team were 9th and a few points off top four having had injuries, undermined coach and hangover of Messi being taken away at last minute as well as injuries to Pedri/Dembele etc.

Ignore all that and wont get full picture of where team really were and why and under conditions Xavi did not have to deal with.

The team was just different.

LaLiga winning lineup was


Gavi (raphinha) Lewandowski Dembele (raphinha)
Pedri-Busquets-De Jong
Balde-Christensen-Araujo-Kounde
MATS

During the '9th place run' the only player who was regularly playing was MATS and De Jong for a bit. The rest are newly signed or were injured during that period.

Him making arguments that the team isn't that good because they were in 9th makes no sense, none of them were even playing during that period.

 

[ajnotkeith]

Nah he said xavi took the club FC Barcelona 9th and won them the league, first in 4 years might add.

You're just following Jamdav argue for the sake of argument line with the it's different players, to muddy the water.

Everyone knows the squad got better, he was apart of why the squad got better.

Like I said no ever points out that X coach, had better players when they won something, because that's goes without say, bringing that up is just an attempt to muddy the waters.

You're better than that.

They quality of the players he/we had at our disposal even due to injuries, simply serves to highlight how far the club is coming from.

And that fans should use some prospective when being overly critical.

Every other top team has/had injuries, no put on a team as bad as the one we had to field.

Yes, Xavi AND the players. You never get it do you?

There is no logic in the world that would let you blame the manager and not the players for results for a club in Barca's situation.

Your logic would've worked if these Barca players would have made some top results in CL and La Liga before Xavi, and now Xavi is ruinning then, but when Xavi signed on they were like 9th in La Liga. And now under Xavi they are La Liga winners. It's obviously a natural, and great progress in the timeframe at hand.

However great you think these players are, I can assure you they are not and it's still some long way to go.

'If these Barca players were top in CL and LaLiga before Xavi, you'd have a point, but they were 9th before he signed'.

They just weren't. It's not the same group of players so how can they be 9th before he signed.

I'm not saying winning the league meant nothing because he got signings, but it wasnt the point being made, he is saying the squad is not that good because they were 9th before Xavi (they weren't, as most of them weren't even playing at that period).

 

[JamDav1982]

To just point to 9th is not to understand where Barca really were at that point and why.

Barca were still favs for 2nd place and heavy odds on for top four for good reason.

 

[jamrock]

'If these Barca players were top in CL and LaLiga before Xavi, you'd have a point, but they were 9th before he signed'.

They just weren't. It's not the same group of players so how can they be 9th before he signed.

These Barcelona players, present continuous tense.