Yaya Toure

[diegomessi]

a poorer unrestanding of the gamE? u gotta be kidding me sergi can pass the ball and find gaps and links very very well yaya game is based on size and atleticism... there is a reason why sergi plays for Spain quite often yaya is tougher and a better in defense... but sergi is a better all around player

he just in a bad patch of form making some silly mistakes we have seen him play very well against Inter and manchester United in his career i think he will become a world class player and will play in the WOrld Cup

 

[adil_909]

the big man's best moments are individualistic runs, he's not produced anything like the passing skills that busquets displays on a regular basis. that's why busquets can play with keita and yaya can't.

if we are starting with Xavi and Iniesta in midfield, then toure is a much better choice than Busquets.

if we are starting with Keita + one of xavi or iniesta, then we should play busquets.

I believe this would be a fair system. But busquets + xavi + iniesta in midfield doesn't work as well, as we saw vs. madrid.

 

[Metaphysical]

what does a DM for barca have to do? he needs protect the backline when alves flies up the pitch, he needs to be strong and powerful to make up for the smallness of iniesta, xavi, messi and co, and he needs to win the ball back and just give it to xavi and iniesta who will do the rest. toure wins in all 3 departments hands down. busquets is more aggressive, but gives away more free kicks and has a poorer understanding of the game. is that inexperience, yeah probably, but that doesn't change the fact that toure is better in that regard.

okay, do you understand what barca's philosophy is?

do you understand why pep is always about compressing the space between the lines and playing as one unit rather than three?

do you understand why pep wants attackers to defend?

do you understand why pep wants defenders to attack?

if you do, then you DO understand barca's philosophy, and should understand and know that while it's good to have a pure DM option in the squad, at barcelona the ideal is that everyone is able to play and create.

and then you will understand why pep is so fond of busquets in the DM position.

an in-form toure is a way better fit for barca than an in-form busquets. for me it's as simple as that.

an in-form ronaldinho is better than an in-form messi, zlatan and henry combined. does that mean we shouldn't have got rid of him when he stopped performing and started being a disruptive influence? fuckin' hell son, your argument is weak.

 

[adil_909]

a poorer unrestanding of the gamE? u gotta be kidding me sergi can pass the ball and find gaps and links very very well yaya game is based on size and atleticism... there is a reason why sergi plays for Spain quite often yaya is tougher and a better in defense... but sergi is a better all around player

yes my friend, this is what i am trying to say. sergi passes the ball better and finds those tough through balls, but too often that is not what barca needs!! we have xavi and iniesta to do that, and the job of the DM at barca is to win the ball back and give it to xavi and iniesta. for me, toure is acres ahead of busquets in this act.

you are right, busquets might be a more complete player, but that is not what is required at that position. this is my point. FOR BARCA, toure is a better fit!

 

[Metaphysical]

if we are starting with Xavi and Iniesta in midfield, then toure is a much better choice than Busquets.

if we are starting with Keita + one of xavi or iniesta, then we should play busquets.

I believe this would be a fair system. But busquets + xavi + iniesta in midfield doesn't work as well, as we saw vs. madrid.

yup.

didn't work in the CL final either did it?

oh...

wait...

 

[diegomessi]

we have seen sergi shut down the likes of inter and man united... he def has the capability to be a great DM.. once again i am stressing he is just making little dumb mistakes that go away with experience

 

[adil_909]

okay, do you understand what barca's philosophy is?

do you understand why pep is always about compressing the space between the lines and playing as one unit rather than three?

do you understand why pep wants attackers to defend?

do you understand why pep wants defenders to attack?

if you do, then you DO understand barca's philosophy, and should understand and know that while it's good to have a pure DM option in the squad, at barcelona the ideal is that everyone is able to play and create.

and then you will understand why pep is so fond of busquets in the DM position.

don't patronize me asshole, i am well aware of the barca philosophy.

we would not have won the treble last season without toure because his prescence allowed the likes of xavi, iniesta, and messi to shine. he won the ball back and let the more creative players do what they do best. his selfless, no-nonsense play was fundamental to our success. if you think that busquets is ready to fill those big shoes, then fine, let's get rid of toure and see what happens. i think it would be a phenomenal mistake.

and that ronaldinho comparision is awful. you think toure is playing as poorly as ronaldinho was during his last year at barca? toure is just minorly out of form because of injuries, sickness, and lack of game time. it's a long way before you can compare his form to ronaldinho's in his lat days.

yup.

didn't work in the CL final either did it?

oh...

wait...

oh wait, why did busquets play? maybe it's cuz toure was sitting in CB. there's no way in hell pep would have played busquets in that game if toure didn't have to play CB.

again, toure adds more to the squad than busquets does. our DM doesn't need to be sending killer through balls into the area so our strikers can score. barca's DM needs to win the ball back and let the creaters create and the attackers finish. toure >>> busquets in this regard.

 

[Cule Angles]

don't patronize me asshole, i am well aware of the barca philosophy.

we would not have won the treble last season without toure because his prescence allowed the likes of xavi, iniesta, and messi to shine. he won the ball back and let the more creative players do what they do best. his selfless, no-nonsense play was fundamental to our success. if you think that busquets is ready to fill those big shoes, then fine, let's get rid of toure and see what happens. i think it would be a phenomenal mistake.

and that ronaldinho comparision is awful. you think toure is playing as poorly as ronaldinho was during his last year at barca? toure is just minorly out of form because of injuries, sickness, and lack of game time. it's a long way before you can compare his form to ronaldinho's in his lat days.

Meta's comparison is actually spot on because it successfully highlights the fact that your entire argument is based on the past , just as the Ronaldinhistas' argument was towards the end of his time. It also underlines Touré's obvious lack of form and the superfluous nature of arguing about form when a player is quite patently not in form.

 

[adil_909]

we have seen sergi shut down the likes of inter and man united... he def has the capability to be a great DM.. once again i am stressing he is just making little dumb mistakes that go away with experience

yes, he has the capability to be a great DM. but why do you want to get a great DM to create one? what if he doesn't live up to that capability? what if he wants to move? there are a million variables about what busquets will be like in 5 years.

 

[Cule Angles]

oh wait, why did busquets play? maybe it's cuz toure was sitting in CB. there's no way in hell pep would have played busquets in that game if toure didn't have to play CB.

again, toure adds more to the squad than busquets does. our DM doesn't need to be sending killer through balls into the area so our strikers can score. barca's DM needs to win the ball back and let the creaters create and the attackers finish. toure >>> busquets in this regard.

The reasons why Busi played are irrelevant, what's important is the fact that he did play as a DM and was fantastic.

 

[diegomessi]

yes, he has the capability to be a great DM. but why do you want to get a great DM to create one? what if he doesn't live up to that capability? what if he wants to move? there are a million variables about what busquets will be like in 5 years.

and as of right now we have no idea what yaya is capable of this season....

and the thing that really urks me is how he said stuff in public complaining and that....

 

[Metaphysical]

don't patronize me asshole, i am well aware of the barca I philosophy.

I'm not sure about that, sunshine.

we would not have won the treble last season without toure because his prescence allowed the likes of xavi, iniesta, and messi to shine. he won the ball back and let the more creative players do what they do best. his selfless, no-nonsense play was fundamental to our success. if you think that busquets is ready to fill those big shoes, then fine, let's get rid of toure and see what happens. i think it would be a phenomenal mistake.

we wouldn't have won the triplete last season without any of the players we had in our squad, even caceres. everything that happened, happened, and could not have happened any other way.

yaya was very important to the triplete, there is no doubt about that, but he's not indispensable and can be replaced. not only by busquets, but by a new player, such as mascherano (who pep wanted to sign in the summer I do believe).

and that ronaldinho comparision is awful. you think toure is playing as poorly as ronaldinho was during his last year at barca? toure is just minorly out of form because of injuries, sickness, and lack of game time. it's a long way before you can compare his form to ronaldinho's in his lat days.

the principle is the same.

you're advocating that yaya should stay because in form he's better than busquets. despite four prominent facts:

1. there is no guarantee yaya will return to top-form. he sure didn't do it against xerez.
2. his agent is money-grubbing attention-whoring disruptive scum.
3. yaya and his agent are currently disruptive influences on the squad.
4. if yaya does go, pep intends to replace him with mascherano, who is a better DM than yaya, so... yeah.

 

[Cule Angles]

yes, he has the capability to be a great DM. but why do you want to get a great DM to create one? what if he doesn't live up to that capability? what if he wants to move? there are a million variables about what busquets will be like in 5 years.

And if we don't play him he'll never fulfill his potential here, his potential is obvious which is why he gets game time. If we left him benched as some would have it we'd end up with a scenario so familiar to madrid canteranos who have bags of potential but no minutes to be able to fulfill the potential. Arguing that we shouldn't play a youngster because he may not make it is your worst argument yet

 

[adil_909]

Meta's comparison is actually spot on because it successfully highlights the fact that your entire argument is based on the past , just as the Ronaldinhistas' argument was towards the end of his time. It also underlines Touré's obvious lack of form and the superfluous nature of arguing about form when a player is quite patently not in form.

what about my analysis of what a DM needs to do at barca?

and if you think toure is not in form so we should get rid of him, then why don't we get rid of every player that drifts out of form and replace him with a permanent youth team player. henry's form has been much worse than toure's. toure has suffered injuries, he has suffered swine flu, and he has suffered the mental stress associated with being replaced in the first team by a nobody just weeks after signing a new long term contract. let's give toure a fair chance to prove himself and prove that he is not finished. because that has not happened, nowhere near happened, and until he's given a fair chance - a run of 3 or 4 games uninterrupted - then this argument is pointless.

hard to beleive you guys are calling for one of our most consistent player last year to head out the door based on a few short stressful weeks. if this was the end of the season and he still hadn't played well then fine, maybe. but this is unbelievable. i can't wait to see what you guys say when messi suffers a dip in form 2 to 3 years from now.

 

[Barcaman]

No need to talk down at people (Meta) nor reply in an insult (adil) here.
Home grown status is a big thing working for Sergio, no doubt.