10 - Lionel Messi - v2

[Papabeef]

3 ended in goal, another 3 didn't because of the "pass the ball to Messi every time" factor. Plus, Messi's second goal was pretty much perfect, because he could have failed it easily. Passing the ball to Messi on that one wasn't the best call, but it ended up being the best call because of Messi's awesomeness.

Yeah thats the thing jtmx12, the players and staff are kind of on the attitude of "if its not broken, dont fix it" which is ok when you have a historic start to La Liga in terms of points. I'm sure any Cule like you and me would in the end be happy to see anyone score at the end of the day, whether more of a fan for one player or another, priority to Barca. :barca scarf:

 

[Stric]

3 ended in goal, another 3 didn't because of the "pass the ball to Messi every time" factor. Plus, Messi's second goal was pretty much perfect, because he could have failed it easily. Passing the ball to Messi on that one wasn't the best call, but it ended up being the best call because of Messi's awesomeness. As for first goal, he scored yep, but Villa could have scored it instead as well. Villa ended up alone because of his awesome run, and Messi also ended up alone because of Villa's awesome run that dragged like 4 defenders out of Messi's way.

All the hard work that Pedro & Villa provide to the team that not everyone can see should be awarded with goals, they don't deserve to watch Messi score every single goal, because they are strikers and they need goals. You need to see their faces, specially Villa, they aint happy.

Yes, and even with the "pass the ball to Messi every time" factor you're talking about, the team still won all but 3 games this season. I'm not saying that it's the only and best way to do things, but rather that all the "lost chances" that were a result of the pass-the-ball-only-to-Messi factor aren't really harming the team much, as they are still incredibly successful. So apart from the personal happiness of our other forwards (which is a silly thing to discuss, in the first place), there's really no other reason why this should be negative. Besides, reducing Messi's involvement in the attack (and consequently the chances of scoring) just to fulfill this notion of "awarding someone's hard work with goals" is a pretty absurd proposition, to me.

They passed the ball to Messi. He scored. End of story. I don't see how anyone can find a problem there. If Messi hadn't scored, and the team had lost the game (or several games) due to this factor, then it would be a problem. Luckily, it's not a problem now.

 

[CatalinR10]

Well.....when a player has 3 Ballon D'or , scores 82 goals goals in a season and he is at the point of breaking a 85 goals / year record , it is understandable why almost all the balls are searching for him . When Messi has the ball , the team has bigger chances of scoring a goal rather than with Villa or any other player .

 

[Stric]

And you say "Villa could have scored instead". Seriously, though? What if he was given the ball and he missed? What would your argument be, then? These things are not so black and white.

And no one "deserves to be rewarded" for their hard work by being given opportunities to score. The team's success is the top priority. How are centrebacks being rewarded for entire careers of saving their teams' asses on a regular basis? By scoring a handful or no goals in their entire careers. Every player's job is to do their part and help the team win. If that means passing the ball to Messi and letting him take a shot, so be it.

 

[mitkoa7x]

everyone is passing to Leo so he breaks the rec, things will be back to normal in January. Chill out guys.

 

[footyfan]

As long as the team is winning, it shouldn't matter. When Messi is getting shut out however, the team should start looking for alternate options after a reasonable amount of time. I've noticed they don't do things different until the last 10 minutes or so. They should show more directness earlier. It was nice to see Messi on RW as something different against Celtic, hopefully that's the start of a new (old) tactic. I also liked the 4-2-4 against Osasuna. That could be useful when teams press the hell out of us.

 

[jtmx12]

everyone is passing to Leo so he breaks the rec, things will be back to normal in January. Chill out guys.

That's what I thought for one moment. I hope it gets better after that xD.

But anyways I'm not going to make a comment about this again. I already did, and I already gave my cool picks that took me like 15 mins to make. Just wanted to show Villa's work, that's it I guess, hence why those pics r in Villa's thread.

It's hard to talk bad things or try to make Messi look bad anyways. First because I don't wan to, second because he's in Barca, and last because he's the best. Period

 

[Leo10]

With English subs

 

[raskolnikov]

This is ridiculous, its this simple, the ball should go to the player that has the best chance to score, villa and pedro move in front of messi so alba/alves/iniesta/xavi can pass it back to messi to score, similair thing messi did with song.
Why should we as barca fans look for problems when marca says so? Surely Villa and Pedro will get plenty of chances to score more goals this season.
Just be happy to team is winning almost every game regardless of who is scoring.

 

[jiopi]

In La Liga, Messi has scored only 2+ goals in this season, no 1 goal games. 7 brace's/1 hat trick.

Then again, the opposition has scored at least once in every one of those games except one.

 

[Papabeef]

That's what I thought for one moment. I hope it gets better after that xD.

But anyways I'm not going to make a comment about this again. I already did, and I already gave my cool picks that took me like 15 mins to make. Just wanted to show Villa's work, that's it I guess, hence why those pics r in Villa's thread.

It's hard to talk bad things or try to make Messi look bad anyways. First because I don't wan to, second because he's in Barca, and last because he's the best. Period

Another reason i would add there is that Messi does not suck the ball off others feet, they always had a choice, like yesterday with Alba or Montoya.

 

[footyfan]

Don Leo
Tito Hagen

Crackovia

 

[messi_xavi_iniesta]

Messi scored 22 of barça´s 54 goals this season. 41%. So other players are scoring

 

[exneo]

Who's talking about passing or dribbling? in the 6 images I gave, Villa just had to shoot the ball to the net, that's it. And according to stats, Villa is as good as Messi at finishing this season (actually, better). Villa, 5 goals, 8 shoots aka 63%. Messi, 17 goals, 63 shoots, aka 26%. So when it comes to passing the ball to one of them where they just have to shoot it, the thing needs to be simple: the one who has the best position gets the assist, not Messi every time.

See (a) below


As for the thing in red, are you freaking serious? Actually, Teams can shut down Messi, and they have done it a few times. Inter won the "Treble" and the Champions League against Messi's Barca, Real Madrid won the Copa del Rey, La Liga, Spanish Supercup against Messi's Barca. Chelsea won the last Champions against Barca, because Messi couldn't score against them and failed a penalty.

See (b) below

Spain won everything without Messi. There's life after Messi. If Villa had 63 shoots, and Messi 8 shoots instead, who would have more goals? Villa, clearly. Saying that, Messi is clearly the best, and the reason why he scores so much is because he's awesome and great, but also because the whole team plays for him, even the strikers, which causes the Messi Dependency so much.

See (c) below

Messi clearly deserves to get the ball a bit more often than everyone else, but last match Villa was completely ignored because of Messi, and the same thing happened to Pedro & Tello and it's not the first time. That's the only thing I'm complaining.

See (d) below

Do you think if Messi didn't play yesterday we would have lost only because he scored 2 goals and gave one assist? Clearly not. If he wasn't playing, another guy would take his role, like Pedro or Villa, as they did last match with Spain scoring 3 goals without Messi.

See (e) below

(a) Your statistics are misleading, irrelevant, and biased towards your argument. Those aren't basketball free throw percentages, which are done from the same spot. You cannot use statistics like that to make a claim that A > B; you can only say Messi takes more shots and a fewer percentage went in. That is the same reason why you cannot say "Valdes is a better passer than Mesu Ozil" because he may have had more completed passes and a greater pass completion percentage in a match (which I think was the case in a couple Clasicos, due to our tiki taka back-passing).

(b) What I mean by "teams cannot shut down Messi" is that they cannot do so without using at least 2 men, which always creates an overlap somewhere on the field; whereas teams can shut down tiki taka with tight lines and discipline. Messi is the best play-maker in world football. He is "desequilibrante". Iniesta is this, too, but not as often as Messi. Messi is MOTM nearly every match, every 3 days.

And "ouch", Chelsea won the Champions League because of Messi missing a PK? Not because our defenders slipped?, not because Valdes was poor?, not because of the numerable missed chances from our other players? I thought football matches were played with 11 men per side for 90 minutes.

(c) What came first, the chicken or the egg? Have you ever thought that the team needs to depend on Messi to win? See item (b), above. I agree with you in a sense: If Messi suddenly disappeared, we would see more "wonder" performances from our other stars--Iniesta, Villa, etc. Sure, someone would step up--sometimes. But the net position of the team would be far worse. Nobody on the team brings to the table what Messi does--total offense. Iniesta comes the closest.

(d) Then complain about Tito.

(e) And how many times have they not shown up? How many frustrated games did we need to see from Villa last season? And Pedro? They were both off form / on bad form for a very long time.

 

[jtmx12]

a) misleading ? irrelevant? lol?. They are stats, that are the truth and everyone have seen that this season Villa scores as soon as he gets a small chance to do so. Plus, I was comparing a striker vs another striker. You, in other hand, come with some random crap comparing a goalkeeper vs midfielder... lol.

b) Use your words properly next time. Don't confuse ppl with (as you would say) "misleading" words that mean something else. So, you need 2 guys to shutdown Messi, but you need a WHOLE team to shutdown tiki taka. ...?

You pretty much said before that Messi is a "god" that needs to gets all the balls because he's the best, period. So yeah, if the whole team plays for this guy, and put all their trust on him (like on the penalty) and he doesn't win us the game, isn't it, mostly, his fault?

c) chicken? egg? what? Real Madrid managed to get more points and goals than us in the last league without Messi. Like I said, there's life after Messi, believe it or not.

d) Complaint about what? that Messi plays? why would I. I was just making a comment saying the obvious thing.

e) Last season Pedro was pretty much injured the whole season. Villa - as Pep said himself, was having problems already on his leg, but since he kept playing it ended up in a big injury. As you said, they were both "off form", so it makes sense not to trust them when they are playing bad. However, are they off form now? are they playing bad? last time I check they were playing pretty good. Oh right, Last time I checked it was a Spain match, with Barca however they suddenly become "bad" because they can't score.