10 - Lionel Messi - v3

[KingMessi]

He plays like that cuz our midfield is shit.

Our central midfield is nonexistent when Rakitic doesn't play. They're worse than shit without Rakitic.

 

[Leo_Messi]

I said Real Madrid cope better with Ronaldo poor than Barca do when Messi poor . Partly because Ronaldo is inferior player and partly because he is not given such importance to the overall system in Madrid as Messi is in Barca.

But they still play worse when Ronaldo is poor.

I get that you are saying you expect more from Neymar and Suarez when Messi is off but I dont think it is as simple as that.

What support attacking players in world football do you think play well every time their main man is off form?

You seem to think Madrids support is so much better for Ronaldo as they play better without him... what Madrid players step up every time?

Then why do you seem to disagree with my conclusion?

FCB struggles more when Messi has his rare off-day (s) than RM does whenever Ronaldo is absent or has his off-day (s).

Why should it not be simple? The club bought Neymar and Suárez for a combined transfer fee of 200 million euros. Let me repeat that number again. 200 million euros.

Great players are often the difference between failure and success. When Ronaldo was invincible in the CL-final Bale stepped up. When Ronaldo was absent in the CdR final he stepped up again.

I don't expect them to do this every time but in games today where nothing is working you would want to have individuals of a immense quality like Neymar and Suárez to step up and show their worth/abilities. Especially when Messi has an off-day.

This is not about RM but FCB. My comment and that of other users were just a side comment pointing out that our main rival is not as dependent on their best player like FCB is. Most of the time this is irrelevant but when it is not irrelevant you want your other stars to perform. Just like RM did last season whenever Ronaldo did not play or had a off-day.

Our central midfield is nonexistent when Rakitic doesn't play. They're worse than shit without Rakitic.

This, which is frightening really.

Notice that our best performances this season arrived when Rakitic played from the start.

 

[JamDav1982]

Then why do you seem to disagree with my conclusion?

FCB struggles more when Messi has his rare off-day (s) than RM does whenever Ronaldo is absent or has his off-day (s).

Why should it not be simple? The club bought Neymar and Suárez for a combined transfer fee of 200 million euros. Let me repeat that number again. 200 million euros.

Great players are often the difference between failure and success. When Ronaldo was invincible in the CL-final Bale stepped up. When Ronaldo was absent in the CdR final he stepped up again.

I don't expect them to do this every time but in games today where nothing is working you would want to have individuals of a immense quality like Neymar and Suárez to step up and show their worth/abilities. Especially when Messi has an off-day.

This is not about RM but FCB. My comment and that of other users were just a side comment pointing out that our main rival is not as dependent on their best player like FCB is. Most of the time this is irrelevant but when it is not irrelevant you want your other stars to perform. Just like RM did last season whenever Ronaldo did not play or had a off-day.



This, which is frightening really.

Notice that our best performances this season arrived when Rakitic played from the start.

You seem to be thinking that Suarez and Neymar only need to be judged when Messi doesnt play well.

Suarez and Neymar have been great signings but just like Messi cant play well every game.

Occasionally you will get the game all three dont play well. It will happen.

Again... what team in the world has better back up players to the main man than Suarez and Neymar?

 

[Gasgas]

He was playing way too far from the opposition's goal. A forward can't do shit like that. Even if he does get a good chance, he still needs to pass through too much space to get to the goal.

Thats why we have suarez

 

[linetty]

Everything at Barca comes through Messi and if he doesn;t play well it's obvious the whole team won't click. At Real Madrid Ronaldo isn't most important and they can still put up a good performance when he's off. This team is used to play all the balls to Messi, they've been doing that for many years so they're lost when he doesn't deliver. He's the focal point for obvious reasons and the ineptness with him missing is something natural for Barca these days so get used to it.

 

[Leo_Messi]

You seem to be thinking that Suarez and Neymar only need to be judged when Messi doesnt play well.

Suarez and Neymar have been great signings but just like Messi cant play well every game.

Occasionally you will get the game all three dont play well. It will happen.

Again... what team in the world has better back up players to the main man than Suarez and Neymar?

Where did I write that? That's your own strange conclusion.

What I am writing and have written on this topic is very clear and obvious for anyone that bothers to read it.

You are now talking about whether Neymar or Suárez were good signings or not. This is irrelevant and I have not commented on that.

Suárez and Neymar are not "back up players" nor should they even be that. They are key components of the team's attack. I don't buy that notion.

Anyway I think that you got what I meant with stepping up whenever the main man (Messi) has an off-day or is absent. As Bale did last season when Ronaldo was absent/had an off-day.

 

[Gasgas]

Then why do you seem to disagree with my conclusion?

FCB struggles more when Messi has his rare off-day (s) than RM does whenever Ronaldo is absent or has his off-day (s).

Why should it not be simple? The club bought Neymar and Suárez for a combined transfer fee of 200 million euros. Let me repeat that number again. 200 million euros.

Great players are often the difference between failure and success. When Ronaldo was invincible in the CL-final Bale stepped up. When Ronaldo was absent in the CdR final he stepped up again.

I don't expect them to do this every time but in games today where nothing is working you would want to have individuals of a immense quality like Neymar and Suárez to step up and show their worth/abilities. Especially when Messi has an off-day.

This is not about RM but FCB. My comment and that of other users were just a side comment pointing out that our main rival is not as dependent on their best player like FCB is. Most of the time this is irrelevant but when it is not irrelevant you want your other stars to perform. Just like RM did last season whenever Ronaldo did not play or had a off-day.



This, which is frightening really.

Notice that our best performances this season arrived when Rakitic played from the start.

How can they step up if they are not the focal pooint of the team? Every ball gooes through messi even when he has his bad days, hooow many times does suarez see the ball in a match? Atleast neymar sees more of the ball

 

[JamDav1982]

Where did I write that? That's your own strange conclusion.

What I am writing and have written on this topic is very clear and obvious for anyone that bothers to read it.

You are now talking about whether Neymar or Suárez were good signings or not. This is irrelevant and I have not commented on that.

Suárez and Neymar are not "back up players" nor should they even be that. They are key components of the team's attack.

Anyway I think that you got what I mean with stepping up whenever the main man (Messi) has an off-day or is absent. As Bale did last season when Ronaldo was absent/had an off-day.

You keep going on about how much Neymar and Suarez cost and for some reason linking this to them performing when Messi doesnt playe well. So what are you suggesting if not suggesting they should be doing more for '200m'?

Neymar and Suarez are clearly back up players to Messi as is every player in the team. He is completely the main man and for good reason.

So you think Bale stepped up for Real more than Suarez or Neymar has for Barca... that is way off.

 

[Leo_Messi]

How can they step up if they are not the focal pooint of the team? Every ball gooes through messi even when he has his bad days, hooow many times does suarez see the ball in a match? Atleast neymar sees more of the ball

In previous games Suárez could have stepped up by converting some of his many missed opportunities in front of goal into goals. Chances that Messi often created for him. I won't criticize Neymar much this season for not stepping up as he has had a very good l season so far.

If that is the case, which it is to some extend, then the team has a problem. I already discussed this earlier in the thread.

 

[JamDav1982]

In previous games Suárez could have stepped up by converting some of his many missed opportunities in front of goal into goals. Chances that Messi often created for him. I won't criticize Neymar much this season for not stepping up as he has had a very good l season so far.

If that is the case, which it is to some extend, then the team has a problem. I already discussed this earlier in the thread.

You just ignoring the chances Suarez sets up? More per minute than any other player in the team?

Suarez, Messi and Neymar have been the most devestating attack in europe this last couple of months and all played a part.

Messi is the best of the three but he has still missed chances the others have set up as well.

 

[Gasgas]

In previous games Suárez could have stepped up by converting some of his many missed opportunities in front of goal into goals. Chances that Messi often created for him. I won't criticize Neymar much this season for not stepping up as he has had a very good l season so far.

If that is the case, which it is to some extend, then the team has a problem. I already discussed this earlier in the thread.

Suarez is the kind of forward that gets cooomfoortable when he is fully involved in a game, getting the ball, teeing other forwards, that is what gets him the confidence to score,
Here at barca his involvement is very limited, he rarely gets touches of the balk and so he probably isnt very confident with his finishing as he used to be in liverpoool, because he is just a third ooption in attack behind messi and neymar

 

[Leo_Messi]

You keep going on about how much Neymar and Suarez cost and for some reason linking this to them performing when Messi doesnt playe well. So what are you suggesting if not suggesting they should be doing more for '200m'?

Neymar and Suarez are clearly back up players to Messi as is every player in the team. He is completely the main man and for good reason.

So you think Bale stepped up for Real more than Suarez or Neymar has for Barca... that is way off.

Yes for obvious reasons as we are talking about two players that the club bought for a combined transfer fee of 200 million euros. You expect those players to step up more often when the main man has an off-day. Not only when this occurs a few times a season but in general. If you don't expect them to perform according to their talent and worth you have a serious problem as a club, manager and team.

This does obviously not mean that I only expect Neymar and Suárez to perform whenever Messi has an off-day or that I believe that their transfers were wrong. I don't believe either.

Yes, they are obviously not as influential as Messi or as dominating but calling them back up players is a bit of an insult to them. They are our second and third most powerful weapons after Messi.

Of course he did unless you believe that scoring the deciding goal in the CdR final against your most imminent rivals when your best player (Ronaldo) is out injured or scoring the goal that brings your team ahead in the extra time of a CL-final against your city rivals and in general being the most dangerous player of your team, is not "stepping up" then I don't know what is.

Obviously neither Neymar or Suárez have shown anything like that. YET.

 

[JamDav1982]

Yes for obvious reasons as we are talking about two players that the club bought for a combined transfer fee of 200 million euros. You expect those players to step up more often when the main man has an off-day. Not only when this occurs a few times a season but in general. If you don't expect them to perform according to their talent and worth you have a serious problem as a club, manager and team.

This does obviously not mean that I only expect Neymar and Suárez to perform whenever Messi has an off-day or that I believe that their transfers were wrong. I don't believe either.

Yes, they are obviously not as influential as Messi or as dominating but calling them back up players is a bit of a insult to them. They are our second and third most powerful weapons after Messi.

Of course he did unless you believe that scoring the deciding goal in the CdR final against your most imminent rivals when your best man (Ronaldo) is out injured or scoring the goal that brings your team ahead in the extra time of a CL-final against your city rivals and in general being the most dangerous player of your team, is not "stepping up" then I don't know what is.

Obviously neither Neymar or Suárez have shown anything like that. YET.

Messi is such an integral part of the team him having an off day will affect everyone.

Bale as an example is poor - he was poor in loads of games last season when Ronaldo was off. Hence why they came third in the league.

You are setting totally unrealistic circumstances in which there should NEVER be a game the front three for Barca are poor.

That hasnt happened in any club ever and wont happen now for Barca.

 

[CatalinR10]

sell?

 

[Flavia]

This discussion is going in circles... you guys should just agree to disagree.