10 - Lionel Messi - v5

vlad

New member
I honestly think when messi stops playing, barca will look more like a team in CL. Dont get wrong, barca will never have player like messi, im just sick of alba, suarez, roberto, rakitic, iniesta, search messi in every occasion, even when he is not in best position those guy will pass ball to him, stop it already, do something else, give more effort, they are on high wages, high skilled players, but i have a feeling they expect messi to earn salary for them, they will just pass ball to him, its embarressing when opponent close messi and those guys are absolutly clueless what to do.


Have a feeling for coaches also, they put to much weight on him, he is best ever, but give him a break, you have other players on the team which shouldnt just be on the pitch and wait for messi to save their asses
 

DonAK

President of FC Barcelona
I honestly think when messi stops playing, barca will look more like a team in CL. Dont get wrong, barca will never have player like messi, im just sick of alba, suarez, roberto, rakitic, iniesta, search messi in every occasion, even when he is not in best position those guy will pass ball to him, stop it already, do something else, give more effort, they are on high wages, high skilled players, but i have a feeling they expect messi to earn salary for them, they will just pass ball to him, its embarressing when opponent close messi and those guys are absolutly clueless what to do.


Have a feeling for coaches also, they put to much weight on him, he is best ever, but give him a break, you have other players on the team which shouldnt just be on the pitch and wait for messi to save their asses

I see what you're saying, but this can be solved with a manager that actually knows his stuff and plays importance on the team, constant movement and 1v1 to create situations and chances, constant fast-paced circulation of the ball.

But for that we also need the right players.

Alba got two moves - Cutback to Messi or run behind the defence to receive a pass from Messi. Apart from that he's average. Plain average. He cannot beat a player 1v1 regularly, he isn't very creative with his passing, he cannot cross to save his life.

Suarez - Cannot control the ball anymore and is slow and sluggish. I feel like you can either have Messi or Suarez playing at the same time now otherwise it's way too slow.

Roberto - Just average so no surprise he always looks out for Messi

Iniesta - Age caught up with him. Xavi got very conservative with his passing once he grew older too. Iniesta hardly tries any risky passes now which you need. You cannot pass, pass, pass and not try to through balls or anything like that if you want to create any chances. Too obsessed with keeping possession rather than creating something with it.

Rakitic - Simply not good enough to play in the midfield style we play. He runs and plays simple passes and that's it, so naturally he'll look for Messi. He's capable of playing better passes, but due to teams closing down and his inability to move faster than the speed of a turtle and inability to dribble past a player it just becomes too difficult for him

We need new players that are able to dribble players and create chances, that are willing to play risky passes, through balls, try crosses if there's an option for it, or long shots if there's space. Coutinho is already showing some of it, he doesn't try to find Messi all the time, he tries to play one-twos with other players, tries long shots or dribble through players to play a through ball.

We need someone alongside him in the middle that is able to do that and play deeper in the midfield. Don't need to be a dribbler, but have the press resistance and ability to skip past one player would be fine as long as he can create and play the pass where it should be played, actually use the player that's all alone on the flank after creating an overload.

You need both different players and a manager that puts emphasis on this for it to work. We need some goddamn pace in our midfield too so we can counter-attack as well. It's so freaking slow.

I think we eventually need to move Messi to False 9 again and sign a striker that's able to play out wide too and got rapid pace - He plays as an inside forward while Dembele plays a bit wider. Give Coutinho + the other midfielder creative freedom and tell Messi it's okay if he doesn't want to move a lot all the time, but stay more advanced forward, Coutinho and Midfielder 2 will get you the ball and Dembele + Striker X will create space for you and run behind the defence inviting through balls.
 

JerseyAddict

Well-known member
We need new players that are able to dribble players and create chances, that are willing to play risky passes, through balls, try crosses if there's an option for it, or long shots if there's space. Coutinho is already showing some of it, he doesn't try to find Messi all the time, he tries to play one-twos with other players, tries long shots or dribble through players to play a through ball.

We need someone alongside him in the middle that is able to do that and play deeper in the midfield. Don't need to be a dribbler, but have the press resistance and ability to skip past one player would be fine as long as he can create and play the pass where it should be played, actually use the player that's all alone on the flank after creating an overload.

You need both different players and a manager that puts emphasis on this for it to work. We need some goddamn pace in our midfield too so we can counter-attack as well. It's so freaking slow.

I think we eventually need to move Messi to False 9 again and sign a striker that's able to play out wide too and got rapid pace - He plays as an inside forward while Dembele plays a bit wider. Give Coutinho + the other midfielder creative freedom and tell Messi it's okay if he doesn't want to move a lot all the time, but stay more advanced forward, Coutinho and Midfielder 2 will get you the ball and Dembele + Striker X will create space for you and run behind the defence inviting through balls.

This. A+++
 

ManusXavi

New member
Messi is exempted from playing defense.
If Messi was just 'your average attacker' he would have been axed from a top European club a few years ago. He is entitled to do what he wants but if that is the case then Suarez needs to leave. Having Iniesta + Messi expect Suarez and Roberto to carry their weight defensively and aerobically (running) is not going to work as they are no where near as effective as Alba. Rakitic and Busquets are tied up defensively protecting a back 3 which would have been fine if we were scoring goals.
Line up should be
Alba(runner), Messi, Dembele (Runner)
Iniesta,
Busquets, Aleña
Left back (being a left back or interchanging with Alba like what Heynckes does with Bayern) center back, center back, right back
 

tacticvarium

New member
We need new players that are able to dribble players and create chances, that are willing to play risky passes, through balls, try crosses if there's an option for it, or long shots if there's space.

We need Aleñá to succeed to make things easier.
Hope he fulfills his expectations.
 

DAMNit

Member
I honestly think when messi stops playing, barca will look more like a team in CL. Dont get wrong, barca will never have player like messi, im just sick of alba, suarez, roberto, rakitic, iniesta, search messi in every occasion, even when he is not in best position those guy will pass ball to him, stop it already, do something else, give more effort, they are on high wages, high skilled players, but i have a feeling they expect messi to earn salary for them, they will just pass ball to him, its embarressing when opponent close messi and those guys are absolutly clueless what to do.


Have a feeling for coaches also, they put to much weight on him, he is best ever, but give him a break, you have other players on the team which shouldnt just be on the pitch and wait for messi to save their asses

Best honest post I have read in a while.
A TEAM should never become a one man show.
There should always be alternatives.
ManCity has : Sane, Aguero, De Bruyne, Silva, Sterling and any of them can get the ball at anytime.
Spur has : Kane, Son, Dele, Erikson,
RM: CR7, Asensio, Lucas,
Bayern: Ribery, Robben, Thiago,Muller, Lewa
Barcelona : Messi
That's a problem if you ask me. As soon as Neymar left everything fell on Messi. I don't know if I am wrong, but to the best of my knowledge, and if memory serves me well, Barcelona has never been in this situation, even when Ronaldinho had an almost godlike figure in the team.
I watched the Sevilla game and the first leg when we beat Roma and i knew it was just a matter of time, I even stated it on Youtube.
Roma managed to completely neutralize Messi, and the team became bland and ordinary.
We needed 2 own goals and some tap ins to beat them at home.
Truth be told Messi is the best player ever to walk the earth, but we need to allow every player express themself. Everything doesn't have to go through Messi.
It's making us predictable and killing the club.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Messi is not a playmaker and needs to get back in final third with occasional drops into midfield.

In games like yesterday Barca need a midfield of variety and work rate that just wont get if Messi is the go to man in the build up.

Doesnt move enough to constantly get on ball, dictate tempo and probe opposition. He plays it more like a second striker.

His best position would be RW again and on ball less but in better situations in final third more but jusr cant see him willing to do it.

Messi moving back to false nine just makes team too one dimensional for me.
 

Aryagorn

Improvin' Perfection!!
Established once and for all that CR7 has had a better career than Leo - Stupid board let him down big time! Why the fuck can't they get a team that would use his abilities to the best and elevate his performance instead of relying on his magic time & again!? Why the fuck can't they get a decent manager!?

It's just a pity that his reign end right where it began - Rome! Yes, he was already a great player but the CL goal in Rome is when he announced to the world that he was here to stay!!
 

El Guaje

Member
We need Aleñá to succeed to make things easier.
Hope he fulfills his expectations.

No, what we need is impact right now. What we most definitely dont need is to wait and pray to God Alena makes it. Sell the scrubs (Vidal, Rafinha, Paulinho and most of all Andre fucking Gomes) and bring in some proven WC players.
 

Arnaez

Member
lol the gap between Messi and Ronaldo has never been larger. Difference is Ronaldo is now a cog in a very talented team. And fuck that "big game player" shit. Ronaldo poaches goals, if Madrid wasn't opening teams up to create these chances he wouldn't be able to do anything.

Not that Messi is devoid of blame, the midfield is a joke but Messi's lethargic playstyle doesn't help.
 

tacticvarium

New member
No, what we need is impact right now. What we most definitely dont need is to wait and pray to God Alena makes it. Sell the scrubs (Vidal, Rafinha, Paulinho and most of all Andre fucking Gomes) and bring in some proven WC players.

Things won't change dramastically like that in reality.
And I was talking long-term wise.
 

Judoman

Senior Member
Established once and for all that CR7 has had a better career than Leo - Stupid board let him down big time! Why the fuck can't they get a team that would use his abilities to the best and elevate his performance instead of relying on his magic time & again!? Why the fuck can't they get a decent manager!?

How is that established? Messi won more domestic titles and cups and they are tied in CL wins. He is also 2(3?) years younger. So how is that established? This after loss histeria is ridiculous.

I agree, that Messi wasn t used as he should have been. The bigest mistake, that managment made, was that they didn t provide Xavi-Iniesta replacements. That s it. Real s recent sucess is based
on Kroos-Modric midfield. Without them, they are at least level weaker, so is Barca without Xavi-Iniesta. Valverde has shown to be a solid coach and 1 disastrous loss doesn t change that. This is 2nd
loss in the whole fucking season for fuck sake. True, it came in the worst possible time, but this shit happens in sport and in life.
 

El Guaje

Member
Things won't change dramastically like that in reality.
And I was talking long-term wise.

Again, we need impact right now. We must take advantage of Messi now while he is still around. He is getting older and wont be as good as he is for much longer and we sure as hell wont be as good as we are with him when he finally does leave. Who knows how we will look by then, but what i can tell you now is that even today we are shit when he is not on the field or seems to have an off day.

Long term wise though, yeah Alena making it would be very good but we need to take action right now.
 

El Guaje

Member
How is that established? Messi won more domestic titles and cups and they are tied in CL wins. He is also 2(3?) years younger. So how is that established? This after loss histeria is ridiculous.

I agree, that Messi wasn t used as he should have been. The bigest mistake, that managment made, was that they didn t provide Xavi-Iniesta replacements. That s it. Real s recent sucess is based
on Kroos-Modric midfield. Without them, they are at least level weaker, so is Barca without Xavi-Iniesta. Valverde has shown to be a solid coach and 1 disastrous loss doesn t change that. This is 2nd
loss in the whole fucking season for fuck sake. True, it came in the worst possible time, but this shit happens in sport and in life.

Its not just about the loss god fucking damnit. The reality is that we have been this shit on the field since the beginning, but because we managed to keep grinding the 3 points people saw through how we actually played and stared themselves blind on numbers and your 2nd last sentence proves it. This was bound to happen sooner or later and it eould have happened even sooner had it not been for some individual heroics by Messi and a bunch of late game winners or ties.
 
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Flavius

Member
I see what you're saying, but this can be solved with a manager that actually knows his stuff and plays importance on the team, constant movement and 1v1 to create situations and chances, constant fast-paced circulation of the ball.

But for that we also need the right players.

Alba got two moves - Cutback to Messi or run behind the defence to receive a pass from Messi. Apart from that he's average. Plain average. He cannot beat a player 1v1 regularly, he isn't very creative with his passing, he cannot cross to save his life.

Suarez - Cannot control the ball anymore and is slow and sluggish. I feel like you can either have Messi or Suarez playing at the same time now otherwise it's way too slow.

Roberto - Just average so no surprise he always looks out for Messi

Iniesta - Age caught up with him. Xavi got very conservative with his passing once he grew older too. Iniesta hardly tries any risky passes now which you need. You cannot pass, pass, pass and not try to through balls or anything like that if you want to create any chances. Too obsessed with keeping possession rather than creating something with it.

Rakitic - Simply not good enough to play in the midfield style we play. He runs and plays simple passes and that's it, so naturally he'll look for Messi. He's capable of playing better passes, but due to teams closing down and his inability to move faster than the speed of a turtle and inability to dribble past a player it just becomes too difficult for him

We need new players that are able to dribble players and create chances, that are willing to play risky passes, through balls, try crosses if there's an option for it, or long shots if there's space. Coutinho is already showing some of it, he doesn't try to find Messi all the time, he tries to play one-twos with other players, tries long shots or dribble through players to play a through ball.

We need someone alongside him in the middle that is able to do that and play deeper in the midfield. Don't need to be a dribbler, but have the press resistance and ability to skip past one player would be fine as long as he can create and play the pass where it should be played, actually use the player that's all alone on the flank after creating an overload.

You need both different players and a manager that puts emphasis on this for it to work. We need some goddamn pace in our midfield too so we can counter-attack as well. It's so freaking slow.

I think we eventually need to move Messi to False 9 again and sign a striker that's able to play out wide too and got rapid pace - He plays as an inside forward while Dembele plays a bit wider. Give Coutinho + the other midfielder creative freedom and tell Messi it's okay if he doesn't want to move a lot all the time, but stay more advanced forward, Coutinho and Midfielder 2 will get you the ball and Dembele + Striker X will create space for you and run behind the defence inviting through balls.

Great post
 

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