11 - Neymar Jr. - v4

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serghei

Senior Member
What is actually wrong with him though? Saying he played a few bad games is putting it lightly, he's been pretty much consistently poor since January/February.

To me, it makes no sense. You can't be as a good as he was at the start of last season and then just drop without having something significant change whether it be physical or mental.

Over the course of 10 months he's been in the best players in the world class to straight up atrocious.

It isn't normal.

That's false. You just have to look at his last game vs Sevilla. Who got Banega sent off? He did. There were 3 key moments in that game for us, offensively. The Banega red card, the Messi-Alba connection for 1-0, and the deciding goal, Messi - Neymar for 2-0. Neymar played a big part in two of them. He was instrumental in both the Liga and Copa wins from last season.
 
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Devils

Senior Member
That's false. You just have to look at his last game vs Sevilla. Who got Banega sent off? He did. There were 3 key moments in that game for us, offensively. The Banega red card, the Messi-Alba connection for 1-0, and the deciding goal, Messi - Neymar for 2-0. Neymar played a big part in two of them. He was instrumental in both the Liga and Copa wins from last season.

I don't think it's false at all really. You named one match over the course of 8 months, or 5 if we are just taking into account last season and not the summer, either way that's still consistently poor in theory.

My point is that in 2015, aside from a minor off-form period in January-February, Neymar was incredible and in red hot form consistently putting in great performances.

2016 has been the complete opposite, where he has been consistently poor and occasionally putting in a decent performance.
 

serghei

Senior Member
I don't think it's false at all really. You named one match over the course of 8 months, or 5 if we are just taking into account last season and not the summer, either way that's still consistently poor in theory.

My point is that in 2015, aside from a minor off-form period in January-February, Neymar was incredible and in red hot form consistently putting in great performances.

2016 has been the complete opposite, where he has been consistently poor and occasionally putting in a decent performance.

I didn't name one match. I named a key match. OK, but let's forget about the Copa final. Let's take the QF against Bilbao. Goal from Neymar for 2-0 on San Mames, which ended the tie basically, golazo in the return leg. Or the semifinal, backheel assist for Messi, assist for Suarez at the first goal in the demolition job against Valencia.

So, it's not actually only the final. He was great in Copa del Rey against Espanyol, Bilbao two times, Valencia and Sevilla. That's ALL of the ties we played, excepting the ones against teams from segunda.

About the bolded part, it's actually the opposite. He was stellar in the first part of the season, consistently good in the 2nd part, white some bad games at times (quite few still), which pretty much happened at the time the whole team started to slow down.

Even in the game against Atletico on Camp Nou, Neymar was the most consistently threatening player for Atletico. With some luck he could've scored 2 golazos. Let's not forget that beautiful curved shot that smashed the bar at 1-1 I think.
 
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BBZ8800

Senior Member
Romário played well until he retired. You named a few and forgot a lot of other players. Robinho was never that good, he just had hype. That happens a bit too much too. Players are hailed the next big thing when they are not. On the other hand you "forgot" Dani Alves, Cafu, Rivaldo, Ronaldo, Roberto Carlos, Lúcio, edmilson, belletti, kaka, juninho pernambucano, from the top of my head.

How did I forgot them?

I said that Brasilian players more often (than players from other countries) end their career too soon or stay on their peak for too short period and disappear very fast.

That doesn't mean that ALL Brasilian players are like that.

For example, in numbers (not actual numbers, but an example):
Brasil will have 3 superstars out of 10 who will end their career/peak too soon.
Germany will have 1 superstars out of 10 who will do the same.

It means that Brasil will still have 7 out of 10 superstars who will play awesome, without any problems, for 10-12-15 years, like Rivaldo, Cafu, Alves etc.

Rivaldo is that 7 out 10 part, where their careers aren't ruined by their poor families and backgrounds, inability to resist to fame, money, women, alcohol and similar. (and the other players you are mentioning now)

One more time, try to name Spanish or German players who ruined their careers too soon because of alcohol, fame, women, money and similar.
In the way that Ronnie, Adriano, Robinho and other guys did.

One more time, NOT all Brasilians are like that, but it seems that it happens way more often among Brasilian players than among players from other countries.

My theory is that the answer is something like (quotes from other forums):
"I've read several times that it's a cultural thing.

For many young kids growing up in poverty football is their ticket to escape and wealth. Once they have achieved that they are satisfied. In comparison European players have different drivers - glory, awards, plaudits etc

I have no knowledge or strong opinion on this theory but I think there is some truth in it. And I don't think it's a bad thing either - it seems a healthier outlook than those driven by a narcissistic craving for status, recognition, awards and shiny trinkets.

I would speculate that these days it's the Brazilians that come from wealthy backgrounds that are more likely to reach the top of the game than those from the poorer areas."

"Many of the Brazilian players come from a poor background. They spend their entire youth honing their skills in order to attract a top club. Once they sign with a big club, their night life and other stuff takes over, and their career goes backwards. Fat Ronaldo can be excused for some of his injuries, but players like Ronaldinho should never have declined so quickly. Way too many players to list here, but it's the same story when you look into it a little bit more."

My point is that in 2015, aside from a minor off-form period in January-February, Neymar was incredible and in red hot form consistently putting in great performances.

2016 has been the complete opposite, where he has been consistently poor and occasionally putting in a decent performance.

In 2013/14, he was weaker in spring than in the first part of the season.
In 2014/15, he was awesome in a CL, but his form (or motivation?) dropped insanely in La Liga in March-April-May.
Remember those posts: Neymar with 500-600 minutes in la liga without a goal from an open play.
Not only that he didn't manage to score suddenly, but he played similarly to how he played this spring (2016).
That poor La liga form was soon forgotten since we won a treble.
But 2015/16 season suddenly raised questions again since he AGAIN had a huge drop in spring.

My opinion is that he is already showing signs of complacent with his "success" and that he doesn't possess a mental strength to play on the same level for too long.
He has mood swings like:
He plays like a BallonDOr for a few Months.
Then he gets praises.
Then he gets complacent.
Then he plays like a crap for 2-3 Months.
Then it's a wake up call and he raises his form again for a few Months.
Then he gets praises again.
Then he gets complacent again for 2-3 Months.

I personally don't believe that he will play this poorly for too long.
He will play like a crap for some time, and then he will wake up again.
Then we will see a world class Neymar again for some time, and then he will disappear again.
My concern is always that he will again disappear in CL quarters and semis, like in 2016.
(This is not A FACT, lol, just my opinion and concern).
Also, my concern is how we should build our team around a guy who plays as hot and cold as he does.
(Someone will say: but he played awesome when Messi was injured.
Well, he was on a hot form back then.
Imagine a world/Barca without Messi, and where Ney is our leader and where he plays the way how he played in spring 2016 or currently on Olympics.
That doesn't sound like a too promising world/Barca.)

When you add to this story that he:
1. already is showing hot and cold swings
2. that he is a Brasilian, and lot of them (mentioned earlier) had similar career endings
3. he is coming from a poorer surroundings (right?), and his dad is an idiot obsessed with money
4. Ney isn't mentally too strong or too calm
5. he loves to party. A lot.

It is too soon to predict now what will happen with him, but he is surely showing some early signs of a Brasilian's disease.

He is our player and we paid tons of Millions for him, so it would be better if he regains his form.
But honestly, it won't be the biggest surprise in the world if he'll follow the footsteps of Ronnie, Adriano, Robihno... and end as a player who achieved a lot, but who could have achieved way, way more than he has actually achieved.
 
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F

Flavia

Guest
How did I forgot them?

I said that Brasilian players more often (than players from other countries) end their career too soon or stay on their peak for too short period and disappear very fast.

That doesn't mean that ALL Brasilian players are like that.

Your point is not real. There's a handful of players like that. The majority doesn't end like Dinho or Adriano. The sample size for br players will always be bigger, because it's a bigger country with a bigger population than germany, or spain.
 

RMU ReBorn

New member
Kaka And R9, faded away due to their injury's . Dinho all know went the wrong way off -field , Roninho was never a world class player , just was hyped like any other Rm player . Rivaldo & Cafu had Longevity . Alves had 10 world class season's with Sevilla and Barca and didn't fade away like their pal's . So it's not like every Brazilian will follow Dinho way .
 

Trickykid

Active member
giphy.gif


Yeah, haven't seen the Olympics games, but judging by the reactions here, I think I'll just steer clear of this topic for the foreseeable future...
 

El Flaco

Active member
Yellow card called against Iraq defender vs Neymar in Rio Olympics.

[gfy]ScholarlyFancyCaecilian[/gfy]

[gfy]ColorfulDangerousFlyingfox[/gfy]
 

Total-Football

Senior Member
disgraceful .. almost as bad as that gilardinho one .. last season he reduced the diving big time .. no need to pull that shit out again
 
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