I understand the point you are trying to make, but I think you completely missed the ball. Football is not as simple as attacking a parked bus or counterattacking. Almost any fast and technical player will look spectacular in a counter with only 2-3 defenders in front of him. Hell, even the famous Ronaldinho Bernabeu goals came from a counter. If a player is at his best with acres of space in front of him, it doesn`t mean he can`t break down the opposition defence when it is set-up.
Also, the biggest problem in your analysis is that you completely disregard the most important thing in modern football - transition play.
Example : our first goal against Madrid in the last Clasico. Although it was practically 3 against 2, it wasn`t a counter-attack, it was fast transition play with Busquets sending Kroos back to kindergarten and a great run from Rakitic followed by Roberto and Suarez.
That is what Neymar does perfectly and that is what hopefully Dembele will do for us. Give us fast transition that we lost with Neymar`s departure.
A match against Rm at Bernabeu is one of the matches where Dembele could shine because RM is attacking a lot, there is a lot of space for counters, running and dribbling.
On the other hand, matches against Levante, Getafe and similar, that could be a problem.
Your comment about Ronaldinho, well, we haven't seen that much of Dembele for now, but if you want to compare them NOW, Ronaldinho was a player who was good BOTH in tight spaces and on counters.
Ronaldinho's goals against RM were in moments when we had tons of space.
But in 100s of matches when teams parked a bus against us, Ronnie was our key playmaker AROUND a box, who was able to play 1-2s, dribble in tight spaces and similar.
His close ball control was closer to Messi's than to Dembele's.
About your comment how we lost a transition with Neymar's departure. Even though Neymar was an awesome player, I never thought that he was a good fit for Barca.
And I don't rate Barcas pre-Neymar to be weaker than Neymar's Barca, nor do I think that a current, post-Neymar's Barca is weaker than Neymar's Barca.
Quite contrary, I believe that even EV's 442 without Dembele (when he was injured) had more chances to win a CL than "broken" MSN when we didn't play as a team.
So, to some extent, I personally DON'T want to return to things which we got rid off with Neymar's departure.
** One more thing, when you mentioned Ronaldinho, Rijkaard's Barcelona had some similarities with early Lucho's Barca.
We often gave a ball away to make deadly counters through speedy Ronnie, Etoo and Guily.
So, if you want to have counters, you have to "force" and invite the opponent into your half and then kill them on counters.
Which is quite hard to do in Pep's style of play (we had the ball all the time, and a lot of times we had an option to try a counter, Xavi and Busi slowed down our play so that we don't lose possession, instructed by Pep).
In Rijkaard's era, we didn't play THAT often around opponent's box, like today when we play that way in 90% of matches.
So, Etoo's, Ronnie's and Guily's speed made more sense in a tactics where we played deeper and played fast counters through these 3 guys.
But that is EXACTLY my point.
Barca's style has somewhat changed DURING and AFTER Pep.
Before Pep, we played "a normal" football. It was still a possession based, but it wasn't possession-obsessed as in the last 10 years.
And in that "normal" football, we had both faster attackers, some physically stronger midfielders etc.
Pep moved our play to around opponent's box, and turned our team into a team of shorter, technical players who are the best for that around-the-box style of play.
But THAT is exactly a problem:
You can't MIX both old (let's say Rijkaard's) Barcas who played "a normal" football with a lot of counters and who didn't sit around the opponent's box WITH Pep's style where we sit around the opponent's box and pass the ball 800 times per match in tight spaces, waiting for a tiny hole to open.
If we want players like Dembele, we will need to move back to Rijkaard's Barca and play deeper or like Lucho's early MSN.
An example, try to imagine Dembele in Pep's prime Barca. Imo, he wouldn't fit in that style. Someone like Pedro is way better for Pep's style.
And then, it doesn't mean that Dembele won't fit.
I AM SAYING though that we will need huge tweaks to make Dembele fit. And to some extent, I am pissed because of that, because there is NO longterm planning from our board and coaches.
In one season we play possession Tiki-Taka.
In other season (Lucho), we turn to direct football.
2-3 years later, EV starts to play some balanced football with an awesome defense.
But then Dembele returns and we need to go back to some 433 with counters or similar.
If you get my point?
It would be better if we could find one formation/tactics and THEN trying to buy/fit players for that system.
On the other hand, we are just buying random players (in a panic mode often) and then we are trying to fit them INTO our tactics, changing tactics each new season, or we are changing our tactics because of a player, which is imo a wrong approach.
What is worse, imagine a chaos if we really buy Griezmann.
In 6 Months, we will turn from EV's balanced and defensive football into a team which needs to field Griezz, Dembele, Coutinho, Messi (and probably Suarez) in the same time.
Also, Don Balon should be banned here. In Madrid are just bitter they didn't get Dembele (or Mbappe) and have to stick with injury prone Bale and declining Benzema and Ronaldo. And at the same time they are probably also realizing that Asensio is not on his way to become who they thought he will. I think he'll still become a very good player but he's overrated because of some great goals he scored.
I don't know.
I don't believe that they are jealous about every player whom we buy.
For example, even though Bale is an awesome player, he would never fit into our style.
The same about Pogba, probably.
Or Dybala.
Imagine if we bought Dybala, and they said that he won't fit well.
Is that a jealousy or something that most of us also think?
In the past we were linked with Rooney, Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard.
I never had an idea why do we want them and where would they play (and how) in our team.
1. I don't think his game vs. England is a very good sample. It's a friendly and he's basically the No.10. Of course his area will clash with Messi.
2. Suarez was the perfect core of a counter-attacking team (Liverpool) before he joined us. He was a much more established player.
3. One of Messi's greatest strength is his speed and explosiveness (while maintaining good ball control). It's integrated in our tiki-taka very well.
4. I think Neymar is a defense liability because he slows down our play. He's too much into dribbling and too confident about it. In many occasions he should pass first. Instead he shows off his technique, loses the ball and complains to the referee with zero intention to help the fullback, basically delivering chances of counter-attacks to our opponents.
5. Dembele on the other hand seems more like a European winger, exploiting the open space the moment it appears, and when it does not work, back-passing or fighting to win the ball back. Dembele's play is more direct. Less flashy but may be more effective.
6. One thing I'm worried about is Dembele's finishing. Neymar (in form) is lethal 1v1 against goalkeepers. Dembele now is just not a finisher. And sometimes Dembele gets frustrated and fires some wide wide long shots.
7. It remains to be seen whether he can appear in the right place to score in our tiki-taka play.
3. But Messi is BOTH (like Ronaldinho) good in tight spaces AND on counters.
Messi is short and he is awesome for around the box play where he needs to dribble past 2-3 opponents.
Also, the ball is always glued onto Messi's feet while he dribbles in tight spaces around the box.
On the other hand, Dembele looks like a winger.
He has insanely long legs, and the ball is not glued to his legs.
He has long legs, is quite taller and his tight space game isn't that good (my opinion for now).
Which, imo, again means that Dembele fits better EITHER to counterattacking teams like RM or Dortmund.
Or... to Lucho's MSN Barca or to older versions of Barca (Rijkaard) when we played way deeper than in the last 10 years.
Again, I don't see how Dembele will fit into any sort of Pep's Barcas or into some copy of Pep's Barca.
Which again means, if we want to integrate Dembele, we will need to change a lot. A LOT.
6. About his finishing, yes, that could be a problem.
We can't play him upfront without someone like Suarez, because Dembele just isn't a natural born killer in terms of scoring.
So, we will BOTH need to find a new formation and tactics where he will be able to run MORE with a ball and where he will have more space to run to (not like yesterday when he was glued to a line of our right side and when he was clashing with Roberto and Messi all the time).
We could use him that way also, but that way we will get 70-80% of his potential.
That is the same as using Messi as a CDM or a CM. He would be good there, but nowhere near as good as when he is close to the box.
I always want to see Countinho-Messi-Dembele upfront and switching positions. Messi false 9 again.
That is a possibility, and it sounds better than what we played yesterday.
But then, we are throwing away a tactic which has brought us +15 advantage over Real and 20 clean sheets in 4 Months.
I know, we need to integrate star players, but on the other hand, it sucks.
You have a system which works and then you need to change a winning system to fit a star player into it.
And too often everything goes to hell.
On the other hand, in your idea, you have already benched Suarez, which is one problem.
The other problem, imagine if we buy Griezmann.
What to do then?
Real Madrid won 3 CLs in 1998, 2000 and 2002, but then bought too many star players in the same time: Zidane, Figo, R9, Beckham, plus Raul, Morientes etc.
And a team which won 3 CLs turned into a total shit and lost all the balance.
RM's star team was one of the reasons why Rijkaard's Barca was successful.
We turned to younger players and to a teamplay.
So, I personally love Griezmann, but I would like to buy him ONLY if we'll get rid of 1 star player.
Messi, Coutinho, Dembele, Griezmann and Luis can't play together.
The "I told you so" type of comments based on total of 85 minutes of football, about a boy that just got back from 4 month injury. Pathetic.
You don't get it, with these type of replies.
It has nothing to do with whether he is fit or not.
It is about Dembele's style of play as a player.
It is as if saying: Paulinho isn't fit to our passing style because he had a flu last week.
No. Paulinho doesn't fit in terms of passing because he is not our classical type of a midfielder. He brings other things though.
Again:
1. either we will need to change Dembele's way of playing and turn him into a totally different player
2. or we will need to change our style to fit him and to create him more space to run and dribble
Somewhat similar to Bale, Dembele won't be too effective against parked buses and with playing around the box.
But put him into Lucho's MSN Barca, and Dembele will have 10 crazy (for youtube compilations) runs in every single match.
Put him around the box against buses and he will have 1-2 good actions per match probably.
His video against Levante:
Imo, his best 2 actions in the match where in minutes 25 and 66.
In the minute 25, he dropped deeper (on the right side) and run with the ball till the opponent's box.
That was very good, but we needed a counter and he dropped very deep.
In the 66th minute, he dropped deeper on the left, like Neymar and then had a nice action which could have ended in 1-2.
In other actions, when he was hogging the line as a RW, there wasn't too much for him to do.
There was one good action when he tried to dribble past 2 guys as a RW.
Before his injury, in his last match, vs Getafe, I have a feeling that EV also wasn't too happy with him as a RW, because Dembele wasn't too much involved and just played backpasses.
Even on that match, EV told him to play as LW after 20 minutes, but then Dembele got injured.
Getafe:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsL_fsII5Sg
If someone will ask why I haven't posted Juve's match.
Well, against Juve we had lots of space.
Unlike against bus teams: Getafe, Levante and similar, or like 80-90% of weaker La liga teams which we play for 12 Months.
So, imo:
1. if he plays as a RW or LW, he won't have that much open space infront of him
And he will often drop deeper to "create" space to run to, because without space, his game suffers.
2. now, if he plays as a RW, he CAN'T drop deeper because Roberto is there behind him and he is "killing" Roberto's attacking actions then.
Plus, Messi is there in a deeper role all the time.
3. if he plays as a LW, though, he can drop deeper, like Neymar, because he has only Jordi Alba there (Messi isn't there)
Even though, now when we'll have even Coutinho on the left, operating in that area, that might be another new problem.
Players operating in the same area again.
And as I have already said a few times, imagine having even Griezmann in these maths :/
So, yes, he was injured, he will be better, he will click better.
But still, his style of play ASKS for changes. EV will need to give away his winning 442 (with Messi and Suarez upfront) and we will change to some hybrid 433-442 with Messi-Suarez-Dembele, and we will lose one midfielder from 442 (without Dembele), which means that we will probably lose some of EV's famous balance in midfield and defensive stability.
We will again experience more counters again.
On the other hand, our attack (at least on paper) should be more dangerous.
Just let EV do his job and find Dembele a role that will fit him and the rest of the team the best. As you said he has insane potential but one advantage I think he has over Neymar is that he's more coachable and team oriented player.
