11 - Ousmane Dembélé - V1

[KingLeo10]

The only problem is that we have spent 150million on a potential, not a well cooked player. It's a very expensive gamble made to counteract Neymar's departure and so calm down socios/supporters. Now, all we can do is hope he will become big.

Correct me if I'm wrong. Bele + Coutinho + Messi = 140M + 160M + 120M ~ 420M. Just these 3, almost 1/2 of a billion. Not to mention incoming Grizman project and stadium renovation. Where the heck are we getting that money from? Do we have hidden oil field?

freeing up neymar probably saves us another 100 M a year in donations to his charity.

 

[Maxim4]

Club press release regarding Inesta and Dembélé's injuries
https://www.fcbarcelona.fr/football...18/communiques-medicaux-de-dembele-et-iniesta

 

[Chainsaw]

What a brilliant transfer!

 

[bismp]

Ok, it is offtopic, but please, enlighten me, how do we measure a success of a certain player?
For me, personally, a player has improved a team if you can see a difference in results, trophies. Or in worst case, in displays on a field, but that is very subjective, since, you see, some thinks that Dembele is our 2nd best player already (because he has nice dribbling skills, while others will keep him on the bench and play EV's 442).

In 4 years BEFORE Neymar:
Before Neymar: 3 La Liga titles in 4 years
With Neymar: 2 La Liga titles in 4 years

Champions league:
Before Neymar: 1 title in 4 years
With Neymar: 1 title in 4 years

CDR:
Before Neymar: 3 titles in 4 years
With Neymar: 3 titles in 4 years

I could add: after Neymar.
This team, with Messi, will win at least 2 La ligas in 4 years, and there is a nice chance that we will win 1 CL in 4 years.
So, we will be again be THE SAME without Neymar, or who knows, maybe even more successful than with him.

Now, if you compare a team, BEFORE a player, DURING his time here, and AFTER his departure, and if results are more or less the same all the time (or even better when he is not here), can you explain to me: what to think then?
I know that there are 100s of variables.
But still, Barca wasn't weaker BEFORE Neymar than with him, and we aren't weaker TODAY without him, than with him.

So, instead of saying: Neymar wasn't a success here, I will say:
He didn't raise our game to a higher level, as we expected when we bought him.
And Barca is more or less, equally as successfull, with or without him in our team.
I mean, when we bought him, the idea wasn't: to stay equally as good or to turn into a weaker team, but to improve our team, right?

On the other hand, remove Messi from our team, and you'll see a huge drop in results.

And please don't reply: we sucked during Neymar because of Lucho.
If you reply this, I surely won't reply to that kind of replies.

During Neymar we sucked, well, because of Neymar.

BBZ you truly are clueless.You write huge paragraphs with scenarios,stats etc,but the core of your arguments is almost always flawed.Neymar didn't have an ideal career with us and he made many dumb decisions on field,but he is certainly not responsible for what you are accusing him of.

When Neymar came to Barca,we were under a huge crisis (losing 7-0 to Bayern) and it was evident that the Pep's team cycle was over.Puyol left,Xavi was old,Iniesta and Alves on decline etc.Thus,the focus of the team gradually changed from the tiki-taka style to MSN.

You posted Barca's record before and after Neymar(btw thee CDR record is wrong,we won only 1 before Neymar) and all i can see is that we won similar amount of trophies before and during his Barca career.You think that this is his fault.On the contrary,this only shows that Neymar contributed to his team matching the success of the great Xavi/Pep era.

You'll say "Well,Messi and Suarez were responsible for the titles,not Neymar".True they were better than him,but Messi has always been the focal point of the team.If we had Pedro or Alexis at Ney's place during those years,we wouldn't have been nearly as successful.

You frequently accuse Neymar of Real winning 3/4 CLs during his career.THIS IS THE DUMBEST SHIT I'VE READ IN THESE FORUMS.Neymar or any player is not responsible for Real or Atletico strengthening themselves,being lucky with the draws,scoring late goals etc.

At the end of the day,during Neymar's tenure we won almost as many trophies as the years before him,despite some major changes in the team.That's a compliment.

 

[Egert]

Came home after a long day and opened my computer just to read these crap news.... At least next season will be his season to shine I hope.

 

[Ousmane Dembélé]

One single player is not responsible for the shortcomings nor successes of an entire team, keep in mind football is a team sport.

The argument that Real Madrid won 3 out of 4 CLs while Neymar was here, thus Neymar was a failure is one of the most shortsighted, simplistic, biased arguments I have ever heard. I had my issues with Neymar, but he was a great player who helped us to our second treble in history after not having won the CL in 4 years.

Some of the shit I'm reading here about Dembele is nothing short of disgusting, so much knee-jerk and reactive vitriol.

We are about to win our 7th La Liga title in 10 years, just think about that, that's unprecedented in the modern era in such a difficult league. I have done my fair share of complaining and whining on this forum, but some of you make it seem as if the sky is falling when we're doing pretty well at the moment and have been spoiled silly over the last decade or so.

 

[Kohe321]

It sucks that he's injured, but it can be dealt with. We seem to be handling this season quite well with the squad we have right now, and Coutinho is coming in soon as well.

I don't get why these two injuries have prompted some people to start doubting his talent or discussing his intelligence, though. He might be dumb as a rock, but he undoubtedly has a big talent for football. No one has ever been under the illusion that great footballers necessarily are geniuses in other fields of life, and regardless the whole thing is painfully irrellevant. Seems to be stirred up just to create a negative atmosphere around him and his whole transfer, which honestly is the last thing we need. With such a price tag we just have to hope that he doesn't buckle under pressure and can fulfill his potential here, and starting to doubt him as a player because of injuries doesn't help. He hasn't gotten a chance to show anything yet.

 

[KingLeo10]

dembele and coutinho are only really luxury players for la liga + copa at this point. valverde's 4-4-2 can do the damage at the bernabeu and not concede in turin. That's good enough to compete in the CL for now, we'll take it by storm next year when our 2 superstar signings are flying on all cylinders.

 

[Maxim4]

Dembélé had informed the medical group of his discomfort
https://twitter.com/JorgeCarrilloS/status/952951088726110209

 

[MessiCam]

Well this injury takes the pressure off Valverde regarding a system change because from now until the end of the season I don’t see Dembélé making the starting lineup.

 

[DonAK]

He didn't change the system anyway.

Played a 4-4-2 even with Dembélé and will do the same when Coutinho can play too.

 

[Aryagorn]

Messi is one of rare examples of a guy who doesn't look like the brightest as a person, and yet is Einstein on a field.
But he is Messi, so let's not compare humans with him.

With majority of other guys, if he is dumb outside of a field, he will surely prove the same IQ skills on a field also.
Also, regarding creative players for a team like Barca, you need a very high IQ and ability to "predict" future and movements of your opponents and teammates.
Like Ronaldinho, Henry, Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets etc.
Not an IQ of a surgeon, programmer or an engineer, but a nice IQ compared to other footballers.

"A brain" of a team like Barca which relies on extremely complicated tactics and movements, will never make it without extremely smart leader.

Feel free to quote me on Dembele's IQ in 6 Months.



Also, feel free to quote me on Dembele's IQ in 6 Months time.
If you have followed my posts, I have never wrote on this forum that Luis, Xavi, Iniesta, Rafinha, Busquets, Rakitic, Pique, Roberto are dumb.

I have write though that Alexis, Halil, Adama, Alba lack in that department.

I can't explain yet, but something in Dembele's eyes, body language, interviews and now decisions on a field is raising huge red flags in my brain.
I am not saying that he is on a level of Halil or Alexis.
But it seems that he surely won't be on Ronnie's or Xavi/Iniesta's level either.

But hey, if my estimations are true, we will come back to this topic 100s of times in upcoming months and years after Barca's matches.

IQ is a relative concept and different people have different types of IQ. A doctor, a pretty darn talented one at that, can't do basic math - can NOT say that their IQ is poor! Similarly, a footballer's IQ is related to football and somebody with brightest football IQ could be thick as a brick in general life! We have our own Messi as an example! And Xavi, who can envision the toughest of the passes, speaks like a retard that can get confused to remember his own name!! Ramos, the dumb fuck, is one of the most successful football defenders of all time

 

[cro-man]

Dembélé had informed the medical group of his discomfort
https://twitter.com/JorgeCarrilloS/status/952951088726110209

Dont know if this is reliable but i dont believe the club that they didnt know about his discomfort and i do believe this did affect the operated area and he could miss much much more than 3-4 weeks. They just dont want do admit that that they fucked up by rushing him back....

 

[evilhita666]

There is time for him to come good, but these injuries are definitely a set back... Especially considering how much was paid to sign him...

 

[BBZ8800]

BBZ would have sold Messi to Juventus back in 2005.

I actually liked Messi from his first minutes here and never for a second questioned anything about him.
In 2005, I wanted 18 years old Messi to play instead of experienced Guily.

But, but, but... Young Messi wasn't disrupting our tactics back then.
He was fitting from the day1 and more or less played like an alien from the day1.
I never had problems with Xavi or Valdes either.
Or Ronaldinho. Ok, he was 23, but everything sbout him felt right.
Skills, how he fits, a leader, Iq, bravery.

Anyway, I am not hating on all young players.
But if you think that I am doubting Dembele only because in general I don't like younger players, no problem.