Messicam asked the same, I'll just reply here.
Ok, fine. So finally we agree that for current Dembele, he is not too useful in matches against Chelsea, AM and similar, AS LONG as we are defending and we don't need to win and as long as we are allowed to play it safe any rely on Messi's magic.
About smaller matches, like against Girona, he played there.
But, I have wrote about "levels" of different matches a few days ago.
Level1:
The easiest matches: CDR matches, and home La liga matches against midtable and bottomtable teams
Level 2:
Home La Liga matches against top 4 teams and ALL away La liga matches
Level 3:
Champions league, knockout round matches against Juve, AM, Bayern, Real, Chelsea, Psg
In matches at level 1, basically we can play with any formation and all out attacking.
Here you can play 433 with Messi-Suarez-Dembele in attack and with Coutinho/Iniesta behind them
Usually we won't suffer since opponents are very scared at Camp Nou.
In those matches all players look like world class players (Roberto as a midfielder, Bartra as a beast CB, Rafinha, even Denis).
Also, in matches like this, there is a higher chance that players like Denis/Dembele will shine more than Gomes/Paulinho, because in these matches=it is all about attack, attack, attack.
So, I don't mind playing Dembele instead of Gomes in these matches.
But.. then we are coming to a level 2 of matches. Away La Liga matches, home matches against Sevilla, Atletico and similar.
A current Dembele is NOT ready for those matches.
EV wants to play 442 and he doesn't like classic wingers.
EV would be the happiest to have 4 cloned Rakitics in midfield at LM, CM, CDM and RM and Messi and Suarez in attack.
4 Rakitics would regain possession all the time, pass the ball to Messi and out of 50 actions, Messi would score 2 goals, we would concede 0 because of 4 Rakitics in midfield and we would win majority of matches with 1:0 or 2:0.
Oh, wait. That is EXACTLY what is happening under Valverde.
So, you see, this is his gameplan: have strong midfield in terms of defense and physique and rely in attack on 2 players.
As seen this season, it works awesome in terms of results (La Liga, CDR, CL for now).
In these kind of matches, this will sound harsh, but a CURRENT Gomes/Paulinho can offer more (in EV's system) than a CURRENT, raw, rookie, lost kid Dembele.
On a level 3, Gomes and Paulinho are way ahead of a current Dembele.
So, again, I agree with you that Dembele should play and integrate in matches of level 1 and in some away easier matches of level 2.
But remember, playing vs Girona at home is not the same as playing vs Las Palmas away.
If I will just write my estimation in numbers about defending and physique, people will say that I am pulling numbers from my ass.
So, feel free to open any football game like FIFA, PES, Football Manager games etc.
A lot of people work on those games and their goal is to create players in those games whose skills will match the skills of real players.
So, if you look at skills from Paulinho, Gomes and Dembele in any of those video games or manager games, you will see that in EVERY game (programmed by neutral people, I guess), Paulinho and Gomes always have way better defensive skills than Dembele.
Some guys like Henias are constantly saying how Gomes and Paulinho are equally as bad in defense as Dembele.
I am still not sure if he is trolling or he is dead serious about that.
Dembele CAN'T DEFEND. His defending is worse than defending of Denis Suarez.
Anyway, some skills:
http://www.futhead.com/17/clubs/fc-barcelona/
And now, for example, defensive skills of our starters:
Suarez 60
Messi 45
Neymar 48
Iniesta 59-70
Rakitic 59
Busquets 83
Gomes 71-75
Roberto (as a midfielder) 67-75
And then, for example: Dembele:
http://www.futhead.com/17/clubs/borussia-dortmund/
His defending as a RM is 50-54-60
Or if you want to see defensive skills more in depth:
Gomes:
http://www.futhead.com/17/players/60086/andre-gomes/
Paulinho:
http://www.futhead.com/18/players/49803/paulinho/
Dembele:
http://www.futhead.com/17/players/61031/ousmane-dembele/
Interceptions:
Gomes 80
Paulinho 80
Dembele 48
Heading:
Pualinho 82
Gomes 72
Dembele 62
Marking:
Paulinho 79
Gomes 68
Dembele 65
Standing tackle:
Gomes 81
Paulinho 80
Dembele 57
Sliding tackle:
Paulinho 74
Gomes 67
Dembele 65
In all 5 defensive skills, Dembele is the weakest all the time.
Or, when I claim that Denis is horrible in defending, it seems that I am not alone and that creators of these games think the same:
http://www.futhead.com/17/players/27588/denis-suarez/
Interceptions 48
Heading 44
Marking 37
Standing tackle 46
Sliding tackle 42
Or, what EV also like, physical skills:
Strength:
Gomes 88
Paulinho 70
Dembele 66
Denis 55
Aggression:
Gomes 84
Paulinho 70
Dembele 70
Denis 47
So, again, my post will sound very weird since everyone hate Gomes and Paulinho, but they offer (according to creators of multiple popular videogames) way more than Dembele/Denis in terms of defending, tackling, marking, interceptions, physical strength and aggression.
And once again, since EV's tactics is to NOT CONCEDE, get a midfield balance and pass the ball to Messi and Suarez who will usually score 1-2 goals on each match (and we won't concede any) and that's it.
EV thinks that we have enough of an attacking power and that midfield and defensive balance brought by workhorses is more important than dribbles which Dembele is bringing.
But as said above, in matches of level 1 (La Liga Camp Nou matches), attack is more important than balance, so we will usually see both Coutinho-Dembele and Messi-Suarez on a field.
But from what we have seen till now from EV, in away La liga matches and in ALL tougher, physical matches, his preferred lineup will be: Iniesta-Busquets-Rakitic-Gomes/Paulinho, or now against Chelsea: Gomes-Busquets-Rakitic-Paulinho/Vidal.
** If I have wrote something wrong from this FIFA page, my bad.
I haven't played these games in the last 10 years, so maybe I posted something wrong.
But anyway, maybe we'll see less posts: Dembele/Denis are the same in defense as Paulinho/Gomes.
Gomes sucks in attack, but he CAN from time to time regain possession, intercept some passes and he brings some physical presence.
While, a current Dembele is ALL ABOUT attack, attack, attack.
Which was good in Dortmund when he was their Messi (free role). But in Barca, where Messi doesn't defend, where Suarez also isn't defending, and where Coutinho/Iniesta are weak in defense (Iniesta due to age, Coutinho due to his weak defensive skills and weaker physique), playing with these 3 plus Dembele is a huge risk against bigger opponents since then we would have 4 players who don't defend or who are weak in defending.
Gomes:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFx_EK8FeWs
I tried to look at Youtube, but couldn't find clips of Dembele defending.
I know, he is an attacker, but in EV's team he will need to learn to defend as long as Messi and Luis are in a team and as long as they aren't defending.
For the way how EV has set up his team, Paulinho and Gomes aren't as bad as people here are saying.
Results are proving that also.
(And no, it can't be ONLY because of Messi. We had MSN last season and we sucked horribly in the last 18 Months. EV and his style brought balance and way more points.)
Gomes-Busi-Raki-Paulinho
Or:
Gomes-Busi-Raki-Vidal
Or:
Paulinho-Busi-Raki-Vidal
That's it.
