7 - Philippe Coutinho - V1

[BBZ8800]

I see that forum has decided that Malcom's entering as a LW has won us game, lol.
And he should earn all coins from today's match.

Ok.
My view:
1. Arthur-Busi-Raki were a crap. Arthur was especially crap in an advanced position. (But no one is writing a single bad word in his thread when he is one of the weakest players on a field. Hmm)
And since our midfield couldn't create anything, Messi needed to drop deep in the first half all the time, and his only passing options were: Suarez who struggles with a simple first touch and Coutinho who is extremely slow and physically weak in attack.
In the 2nd half, we had possession like 80% of time and in that moment, we needed more players who are willing to take the risk.
In one moment around a minute 55, we had this action:
1) Arthur has the ball and plays a long ball to Rakitic.
2) Rakitic gets the ball and plays a short pass to Semedo who was 2 meters near him.
3) Semedo received the ball, made a feint and passed the ball back to Rakitic
4) Rakitic gets the ball, looks around and passes the long ball to Arthur.
5) Arthur receives the ball, looks around and passes a long ball AGAIN to Rakitic who passed to Semedo, who, guess what, passed again to Rakitic.
In that moment, I yelled: omg, are 3 of you fucking retarded with these retarded passes from left to right in which absolutely nothing is happening and we are just keeping a possesion with zero intention to play a ball forward

Then, you know that I am not a fan of a too attacking approach, but 60th minute was a PERFECT moment to try either Coutinho, Alena or BOTH of them as midfielders since Arthur and Rakitic offered almost nothing in attack.
So, EV took the worst midfielder tonight (before someone will jump, my commentator also said: Arthur goes out. A quiet game from him, he was below his usual good level) and played a riskier option with 3 attackers AND COUTINHO.

In that moment, we got:
2. Malcom for Coutinho: more risk in attack
3. Coutinho for Arthur: more risk in midfield and attack
4. Roberto for Semedo: more risk at a right flank

And so, in the first half we had:
3 midfielders without any attacking attempts.
Semedo who mostly doesn't know what he is doing, except when he goes into a crazy solo run, but even then he is afraid to shoot.
Coutinho as a winger.
Messi dropping deep.

After changes we had:
3 attackers: Malcom, Suarez, Messi
An attacking midfielder: Coutinho
More attacking RB: Roberto
4-2-4 formation with Alba and Roberto pushing high all the time.

So, yes, Malcom deserves a few coins for tonight.
But, imo, so does:
Valverde for risking in the 60th minute.
Coutinho for a decent AM display where he was offering more threat than "play it safe duo" Arthur and Rakitic.
Roberto.

 

[raki]

tl:dr

 

[God Serena]

I see that forum has decided that Malcom's entering as a LW has won us game, lol.
And he should earn all coins from today's match.

Ok.
My view:
1. Arthur-Busi-Raki were a crap. Arthur was especially crap in an advanced position. (But no one is writing a single bad word in his thread when he is one of the weakest players on a field. Hmm)
And since our midfield couldn't create anything, Messi needed to drop deep in the first half all the time, and his only passing options were: Suarez who struggles with a simple first touch and Coutinho who is extremely slow and physically weak in attack.
In the 2nd half, we had possession like 80% of time and in that moment, we needed more players who are willing to take the risk.
In one moment around a minute 55, we had this action:
1) Arthur has the ball and plays a long ball to Rakitic.
2) Rakitic gets the ball and plays a short pass to Semedo who was 2 meters near him.
3) Semedo received the ball, made a feint and passed the ball back to Rakitic
4) Rakitic gets the ball, looks around and passes the long ball to Arthur.
5) Arthur receives the ball, looks around and passes a long ball AGAIN to Rakitic who passed to Semedo, who, guess what, passed again to Rakitic.
In that moment, I yelled: omg, are 3 of you fucking retarded with these retarded passes from left to right in which absolutely nothing is happening and we are just keeping a possesion with zero intention to play a ball forward

Then, you know that I am not a fan of a too attacking approach, but 60th minute was a PERFECT moment to try either Coutinho, Alena or BOTH of them as midfielders since Arthur and Rakitic offered almost nothing in attack.
So, EV took the worst midfielder tonight (before someone will jump, my commentator also said: Arthur goes out. A quiet game from him, he was below his usual good level) and played a riskier option with 3 attackers AND COUTINHO.

In that moment, we got:
2. Malcom for Coutinho: more risk in attack
3. Coutinho for Arthur: more risk in midfield and attack
4. Roberto for Semedo: more risk at a right flank

And so, in the first half we had:
3 midfielders without any attacking attempts.
Semedo who mostly doesn't know what he is doing, except when he goes into a crazy solo run, but even then he is afraid to shoot.
Coutinho as a winger.
Messi dropping deep.

After changes we had:
3 attackers: Malcom, Suarez, Messi
An attacking midfielder: Coutinho
More attacking RB: Roberto
4-2-4 formation with Alba and Roberto pushing high all the time.

So, yes, Malcom deserves a few coins for tonight.
But, imo, so does:
Valverde for risking in the 60th minute.
Coutinho for a decent AM display where he was offering more threat than "play it safe duo" Arthur and Rakitic.
Roberto.

You know what, I actually think you almost convinced me that Valverde made the right decisions, and I had typed out a lengthy paragraph agreeing with you, but then it struck me... Valverde has set subs no matter what the scenario is, and in this case he appears to have just gotten lucky.

What subs does Valverde usually make in every game?

Dembele ---> Coutinho
Arthur ---> Vidal
Semedo ---> Roberto

Two of those subs were actually made, as per usual. The only real difference comes in the fact that Coutinho started, due to Dembele being unavailable. Coutinho didn't drop back from LW because he was poor, he was moved because that is the sub Valverde MUST make. Arthur wasn't taken off because he was poor, that was just the sub he ALWAYS makes. Rakitic and Busi were also quite poor, but either one of them coming off is completely off the table. Hence why, when Vidal ultimately did come on (You know, because that is a sub that MUST happen), it wasn't Rakitic or Busquets who were pulled, it was Coutinho, who was actually playing much better from the midfield position. And Roberto being subbed on wasn't a decision that actually made any sense at all, he didn't do a single thing Semedo hadn't been doing. Semedo was doing well going forward, had created danger multiple times (Including a low cross that Coutinho only barely didn't manage to tap into goal), and got pulled anyways because, as is the case with Valverde, that is a sub that MUST happen.

Everything working out as a result of these subs is much more likely due to it just so happening to be noon when the clock is stuck showing that time, because these are the same subs we have and always will see from Valverde, who's ability to read a game and make subs based on what he sees is almost nonexistent.

 

[SeloBarca]

1. Arthur-Busi-Raki were a crap. Arthur was especially crap in an advanced position. (But no one is writing a single bad word in his thread when he is one of the weakest players on a field. Hmm)

Arthur was not good today. Didnt look as hungry to get the ball as he usually is.
But i couldnt figure out what was Valverdes tactics either.
Most of the time Arthur played as a DM, which doesnt stuit him to well, and Busi/Raki played as AMs?...really weird.
And since everyone on the planet except Valverde knows Busi and Raki are crap at making key passes and controlling the ball, Messi had to drop down.
I HOPE FDJ and Arthur gets more playtime together next year, not becouse they are much better, but becouse Busi and Rakis curve is going downward, while they have more potential for the future.
We cant let 30+ year olds keep hogging spots.

 

[Messigician]

You can't even score or assist against Espanyol with the best players in the world. Malcom gave Messi an assist and turned up against Madrid with barely any playing time abd chance to grt form Coutinho has had more than enough chances. I don't care about the transfer fee if I was manager this would have besn the end for coutinho he can go be overhyped at some EPL club

 

[Havesaks]

I see that forum has decided that Malcom's entering as a LW has won us game, lol.
And he should earn all coins from today's match.

Ok.
My view:
1. Arthur-Busi-Raki were a crap. Arthur was especially crap in an advanced position. (But no one is writing a single bad word in his thread when he is one of the weakest players on a field. Hmm)
And since our midfield couldn't create anything, Messi needed to drop deep in the first half all the time, and his only passing options were: Suarez who struggles with a simple first touch and Coutinho who is extremely slow and physically weak in attack.
In the 2nd half, we had possession like 80% of time and in that moment, we needed more players who are willing to take the risk.
In one moment around a minute 55, we had this action:
1) Arthur has the ball and plays a long ball to Rakitic.
2) Rakitic gets the ball and plays a short pass to Semedo who was 2 meters near him.
3) Semedo received the ball, made a feint and passed the ball back to Rakitic
4) Rakitic gets the ball, looks around and passes the long ball to Arthur.
5) Arthur receives the ball, looks around and passes a long ball AGAIN to Rakitic who passed to Semedo, who, guess what, passed again to Rakitic.
In that moment, I yelled: omg, are 3 of you fucking retarded with these retarded passes from left to right in which absolutely nothing is happening and we are just keeping a possesion with zero intention to play a ball forward

Then, you know that I am not a fan of a too attacking approach, but 60th minute was a PERFECT moment to try either Coutinho, Alena or BOTH of them as midfielders since Arthur and Rakitic offered almost nothing in attack.
So, EV took the worst midfielder tonight (before someone will jump, my commentator also said: Arthur goes out. A quiet game from him, he was below his usual good level) and played a riskier option with 3 attackers AND COUTINHO.

In that moment, we got:
2. Malcom for Coutinho: more risk in attack
3. Coutinho for Arthur: more risk in midfield and attack
4. Roberto for Semedo: more risk at a right flank

And so, in the first half we had:
3 midfielders without any attacking attempts.
Semedo who mostly doesn't know what he is doing, except when he goes into a crazy solo run, but even then he is afraid to shoot.
Coutinho as a winger.
Messi dropping deep.

After changes we had:
3 attackers: Malcom, Suarez, Messi
An attacking midfielder: Coutinho
More attacking RB: Roberto
4-2-4 formation with Alba and Roberto pushing high all the time.

So, yes, Malcom deserves a few coins for tonight.
But, imo, so does:
Valverde for risking in the 60th minute.
Coutinho for a decent AM display where he was offering more threat than "play it safe duo" Arthur and Rakitic.
Roberto.

quality post. Its spot on.

Malcom played good, but with the pre-sub midfield, he would probably have been average like coutinho was.

 

[Aryagorn]

I see that forum has decided that Malcom's entering as a LW has won us game, lol.
And he should earn all coins from today's match.

Ok.
My view:
1. Arthur-Busi-Raki were a crap. Arthur was especially crap in an advanced position. (But no one is writing a single bad word in his thread when he is one of the weakest players on a field. Hmm)
And since our midfield couldn't create anything, Messi needed to drop deep in the first half all the time, and his only passing options were: Suarez who struggles with a simple first touch and Coutinho who is extremely slow and physically weak in attack.
In the 2nd half, we had possession like 80% of time and in that moment, we needed more players who are willing to take the risk.
In one moment around a minute 55, we had this action:
1) Arthur has the ball and plays a long ball to Rakitic.
2) Rakitic gets the ball and plays a short pass to Semedo who was 2 meters near him.
3) Semedo received the ball, made a feint and passed the ball back to Rakitic
4) Rakitic gets the ball, looks around and passes the long ball to Arthur.
5) Arthur receives the ball, looks around and passes a long ball AGAIN to Rakitic who passed to Semedo, who, guess what, passed again to Rakitic.
In that moment, I yelled: omg, are 3 of you fucking retarded with these retarded passes from left to right in which absolutely nothing is happening and we are just keeping a possesion with zero intention to play a ball forward

Then, you know that I am not a fan of a too attacking approach, but 60th minute was a PERFECT moment to try either Coutinho, Alena or BOTH of them as midfielders since Arthur and Rakitic offered almost nothing in attack.
So, EV took the worst midfielder tonight (before someone will jump, my commentator also said: Arthur goes out. A quiet game from him, he was below his usual good level) and played a riskier option with 3 attackers AND COUTINHO.

In that moment, we got:
2. Malcom for Coutinho: more risk in attack
3. Coutinho for Arthur: more risk in midfield and attack
4. Roberto for Semedo: more risk at a right flank

And so, in the first half we had:
3 midfielders without any attacking attempts.
Semedo who mostly doesn't know what he is doing, except when he goes into a crazy solo run, but even then he is afraid to shoot.
Coutinho as a winger.
Messi dropping deep.

After changes we had:
3 attackers: Malcom, Suarez, Messi
An attacking midfielder: Coutinho
More attacking RB: Roberto
4-2-4 formation with Alba and Roberto pushing high all the time.

So, yes, Malcom deserves a few coins for tonight.
But, imo, so does:
Valverde for risking in the 60th minute.
Coutinho for a decent AM display where he was offering more threat than "play it safe duo" Arthur and Rakitic.
Roberto.

The thing that Valverde and you realized from not being able to score against a shitty Espanyol; in Camp Nou no less; is what all of us have been recommending for quite sometime


Kick Rakitic out and bring Cou to mid field - this is if Cou has to play no matter out; or else leave him the fuck out

 

[Messigician]

The thing that Valverde and you realized from not being able to score against a shitty Espanyol; in Camp Nou no less; is what all of us have been recommending for quite sometime


Kick Rakitic out and bring Cou to mid field - this is if Cou has to play no matter out; or else leave him the fuck out

WHY THE F@## Would we play Coutinho kn midfield for? We were dropping points like crazy at the start of the season

 

[Arizona Scott]

The thing that Valverde and you realized from not being able to score against a shitty Espanyol; in Camp Nou no less; is what all of us have been recommending for quite sometime

Kick Rakitic out and bring Cou to mid field - this is if Cou has to play no matter out; or else leave him the fuck out

Given Arthur can't (or is an injury risk) to play more than 2/3 of match it makes more sense for Coutinho to play for him when he is subbed off.

 

[Porque]

Valverde is trying really hard to get Coutinho to find his form/confidence. Yesterdays game could of easily seen Alena come on for Coutinho in midfield and provide that midfield-attack link. Valverde didn't go for it because for the close of this season, one of the keys to a treble will be having all our cracks performing (let's not forget than Coutinho is world class).

There's little things Coutinho is doing well, but he is just not being decisive. Not happy with how he is playing, but this was better than the past few months.

 

[BBZ8800]

You know what, I actually think you almost convinced me that Valverde made the right decisions, and I had typed out a lengthy paragraph agreeing with you, but then it struck me... Valverde has set subs no matter what the scenario is, and in this case he appears to have just gotten lucky.

What subs does Valverde usually make in every game?

Dembele ---> Coutinho
Arthur ---> Vidal
Semedo ---> Roberto

Two of those subs were actually made, as per usual. The only real difference comes in the fact that Coutinho started, due to Dembele being unavailable. Coutinho didn't drop back from LW because he was poor, he was moved because that is the sub Valverde MUST make. Arthur wasn't taken off because he was poor, that was just the sub he ALWAYS makes. Rakitic and Busi were also quite poor, but either one of them coming off is completely off the table. Hence why, when Vidal ultimately did come on (You know, because that is a sub that MUST happen), it wasn't Rakitic or Busquets who were pulled, it was Coutinho, who was actually playing much better from the midfield position. And Roberto being subbed on wasn't a decision that actually made any sense at all, he didn't do a single thing Semedo hadn't been doing. Semedo was doing well going forward, had created danger multiple times (Including a low cross that Coutinho only barely didn't manage to tap into goal), and got pulled anyways because, as is the case with Valverde, that is a sub that MUST happen.

Everything working out as a result of these subs is much more likely due to it just so happening to be noon when the clock is stuck showing that time, because these are the same subs we have and always will see from Valverde, who's ability to read a game and make subs based on what he sees is almost nonexistent.

I get your point about predecided subs.

But still, subs from EV in the last few matches:
Betis: 64, 88, 90th minute
Lyon: 70, 74, 83
Rayo: 46, 80, 85
Real: 71, 78, 91
Real: 75, 78, 86

The only time when EV had earlier subs were:
Valencia 2:2: when we were losing 1:2 at half time: 46, 66, 84
Levante 2:1, at 2:0 for Levante: 46, 58, 67
Sevilla 2:4, while we were losing 2:1 at half time: 46, 46, 79
Espanyol: 59, 60, 82

So, in the last few matches when we were winning, the first sub occurred at: 46, 64, 70, 71, 75=average 65th minute
In the last few matches, when we were losing or needed a win, a first sub happened: 46, 46, 46, 59=average 49th minute

Also, the second sub occurred when we were winning: 74, 78, 78, 80, 88=average 80th minute
A seconds sub when we were losing/needed a win: 46, 58, 60, 66=average 58th minute

So, do you still think that EV's subs and a TIMING of those from yesterday were a pure coincidence and an autopilot?
Because, it is quite interesting... Whenever a score is not good, EV is way, way faster on subs than when we are winning.

 

[Raketa10]

Valverde is trying really hard to get Coutinho to find his form/confidence. Yesterdays game could of easily seen Alena come on for Coutinho in midfield and provide that midfield-attack link. Valverde didn't go for it because for the close of this season, one of the keys to a treble will be having all our cracks performing (let's not forget than Coutinho is world class).

There's little things Coutinho is doing well, but he is just not being decisive. Not happy with how he is playing, but this was better than the past few months.

That's true, his form is improving but he is still far from his best version. I hope we'll see him more in front of Busi-Raki (or Arthur) in the reminder of this season. He has to play as AM, playing him on the wing is just wrong.

There is also another benefit from playing him in midfield. None of Rakitic, Busi or Arthur have that final pass magic like Iniesta had. Cou on the other hand can make the pass out of nothing so if he can perform there our midfield would definitely improve.

I can't remember when was the last time any of our midfielders produced anything special in the final third. In that part of the pitch we rely 100% on Messi's magic. De Jong will arrive this summer but he is also more CM/DM type while Cou is the only one who has some of that AM attributes Iniesta had.

While I can understand that Valverde is affraid to play him in midfield alongside Dembele, Messi and Suarez against top teams like ATM, United, Juve or Real I can't understand why the hell can't we try out that formation against Espanyol, Bilbao or Villareal? FFS that second half against Sevilla in 4-2-3-1 formation (with both Dembouz and Cou in the lineup) was probably the most beautiful football we have played this entire season.

 

[MTL_Barca]

I get your point about predecided subs.

But still, subs from EV in the last few matches:
Betis: 64, 88, 90th minute
Lyon: 70, 74, 83
Rayo: 46, 80, 85
Real: 71, 78, 91
Real: 75, 78, 86

The only time when EV had earlier subs were:
Valencia 2:2: when we were losing 1:2 at half time: 46, 66, 84
Levante 2:1, at 2:0 for Levante: 46, 58, 67
Sevilla 2:4, while we were losing 2:1 at half time: 46, 46, 79
Espanyol: 59, 60, 82

So, in the last few matches when we were winning, the first sub occurred at: 46, 64, 70, 71, 75=average 65th minute
In the last few matches, when we were losing or needed a win, a first sub happened: 46, 46, 46, 59=average 49th minute

Also, the second sub occurred when we were winning: 74, 78, 78, 80, 88=average 80th minute
A seconds sub when we were losing/needed a win: 46, 58, 60, 66=average 58th minute

So, do you still think that EV's subs and a TIMING of those from yesterday were a pure coincidence and an autopilot?
Because, it is quite interesting... Whenever a score is not good, EV is way, way faster on subs than when we are winning.

Well yes but then again....aren't you just describing some basic work of a football coach? I mean that's just part of the job, the fact that you have to write out a long ass paragraph about Valverde making a simple change adapting to the situation instead of doing scripted subs is telling enough about what kind of coach he is.

Ernie got us to a point where we are seriously surprised if our coach does something that wasn't already expected before the game even started. He isn't the complete moron some people here claim he is but that move really shouldn't be anything special at all but for Valverde it is.

 

[Ken_rosseneri]

WHY THE F@## Would we play Coutinho kn midfield for? We were dropping points like crazy at the start of the season

Because that’s his fucking natural position n he’s not a winger

 

[Ken_rosseneri]

We better not sell coutinho.. fucking get rid of that coach...he’s the dumbest coach in Barca’s history.. coutinho is not a winger for goodness sake. It’s very obvious.. for Liverpool he played in midfield 95% of the time.. he’s a midfielder.. jus because he performed well as a winger last year doesn’t mean that’s his position.. let him play Arthur as a winger n let’s see how our so called golden boy performs there? It doesn’t take a genius to know that Arthur won’t perform well as a winger. Why? Because that’s not his natural position.. but then why is Valverde doing that with Coutinho? I’m sick n tired of this..even for Brazil coutinho plays in midfield. Coutinho ain’t going no fucking where