9 - Robert Lewandowski

[FinBarcelonafan]

It's more about Laporta, Alemany and Jordi Cruyff along with Xavi than moving on from Messi. The squad right now is not even comparable to what we had 2-3 years ago.

If we had let Messi walk with Bartomeu in charge I'm confident we'd be a EL team right now lol. Instead of signing players like Kounde, Raphinha and Lewandowski we'd probably have signed Darwin Nunez for 120m, Oyarzabal and Pau Torres.

Spot on.

 

[Joan]

20/21 season: Barca were on 79 points being 7 points away from league leaders
21/22 season: Barca were on 73 points being 13 points away from league leaders

but yes, let's put everything on Messi's fault

6 points further away from a CL winning Real carried by a Ballon d'Or worthy showing from Benzema and a WC season by Vini than mighty Atletico the season before. Big loss, right? Paramount. With our starting wingers being Dest, Gavi, Abde and Ilias for half a season.

Messi was still a great player when he left, as I already pointed out, but his influence and importance were comically exaggerated. He left and we barely felt it with a half baked rebuild we did last winter when we brought in Auba and Torres. Not to mention this summer when we have truly WC players in Lewa and Dembele, very good Raphinha and Fati. Not yet so confident Torres.

You really think getting rid of Messi is better than getting rid of Bartomeu? fyi, I think Messi leaving was a good decision as he does not fit in Xavi's current system.

I wouldn't dare to compare them. Now that you did...

Edit: Getting rid of Bartomeu was more important, obviously. But it was obvious it was going to happen. People still mourn losing Messi. Yet, it was also important.

 

[vuji_31]

We will demolish Bayern in Munich with Lewa, Dembele and Rapinha.

Bayern can't control game with 2 midfielders against our passing machine, and their defenders can't get battle with those 3.

Also Sane and Mane needs 10 chances to score goal.

Easy win for us.

 

[jamrock]

It's more about Laporta, Alemany and Jordi Cruyff along with Xavi than moving on from Messi. The squad right now is not even comparable to what we had 2-3 years ago.

If we had let Messi walk with Bartomeu in charge I'm confident we'd be a EL team right now lol. Instead of signing players like Kounde, Raphinha and Lewandowski we'd probably have signed Darwin Nunez for 120m, Oyarzabal and Pau Torres.

Exactly

 

[KingLeo10]

20/21 season with Messi: 3rd place
21/22 season without Messi: 2nd place
22/23 season with Lewa: ?

I bet you it won't be third

Getting rid of Messi is the best thing to have happened to Barca in the last few years. Even if he was a great player at the time of his departure. Huge burden unloaded.

Just hope they don't try to get him back.

Here's a retort for your idiotic take (I know you're partly or fully trolling but still, there needs to be a retort)

2009: LL, CL
2010: LL
2011: LL, CL
2012: No major trophies
2013: LL
2014: No major trophies
2015: LL, CL
2016: LL
2017: No major trophies
2018: LL
2019: LL

8 LL in 11 years, 3 CL in 11 years - I guarantee Lewa wouldn't produce the same over those years, competing with a 90 point RM team (keeping them to 2 LL in that time span) and a team that won 4 CLs in those 11 years. How do I know this? Because Lewa played for a comparably strong Bayern Munich for 8 years and delivered all but 1 CL in COVID format during that time frame.

But now you will say that success wasn't all down to Messi...

Well no shit...neither was our lack of success during 19/20 and 20/21 down to Messi either

According to you, we should have gotten rid of Messi few years ago...well just 2 years before we got rid of him, he was averaging 70 G + A a season, for 11 seasons straight. The president who sold a La Masia product that had given us 770 G + A between 08 and 19 in the summer of 19 would have been HANGED.

Messi has only 2 main faults: He was grossly overpaid in his last contract, and in his last 2 seasons, his decline wasn't helping our cause for big trophies.

But against those 2 faults, he has absolutely major contributions to Barcelona's legacy and standing around the world as a football club. Again, Barca was an elite club before Messi, and we are an elite club after Messi. But he was the best player in the greatest Barca sides of all time, which are among the greatest European sides of all time.

Quite shameful how you stan for tangential players/coaches to Barca history like EV while continuing to promote a non-reasonable and reductionist "logic" (which I know you are sufficiently intelligent to realize is reductionist).

Also, nearly all Messi fans agree Messi shouldn't be brought back, except for a testimonial/send-off game.

 

[Joan]

Here's a retort for your idiotic take (I know you're partly or fully trolling but still, there needs to be a retort)

8 LL in 11 years, 3 CL in 11 years - I guarantee Lewa wouldn't produce the same over those years, competing with a 90 point RM team (keeping them to 2 LL in that time span) and a team that won 4 CLs in those 11 years. How do I know this? Because Lewa played for a comparably strong Bayern Munich for 8 years and delivered all but 1 CL in COVID format during that time frame.

Of course he wouldn't. Messi is a goat tier player, an undisputed goat for me. Lewa isn't on the same level and he wouldn't have the same impact over the years. No argument there.

I was obviously trolling with listing places in the league as that's not a serious indicator. But I'm at least half serious about the rest.

But now you will say that success wasn't all down to Messi...

Well no shit...neither was our lack of success during 19/20 and 20/21 down to Messi either

No argument there either. Messi was the main part of our successes over the years.

And our lack of success in 19/20 and 20/21 was barely on him. He was still the best and most influential player in the team at the time of his departure.

According to you, we should have gotten rid of Messi few years ago...well just 2 years before we got rid of him, he was averaging 70 G + A a season, for 11 seasons straight. The president who sold a La Masia product that had given us 770 G + A between 08 and 19 in the summer of 19 would have been HANGED.

Messi has only 2 main faults: He was grossly overpaid in his last contract, and in his last 2 seasons, his decline wasn't helping our cause for big trophies.

But against those 2 faults, he has absolutely major contributions to Barcelona's legacy and standing around the world as a football club. Again, Barca was an elite club before Messi, and we are an elite club after Messi. But he was the best player in the greatest Barca sides of all time, which are among the greatest European sides of all time.

Quite shameful how you stan for tangential players/coaches to Barca history like EV while continuing to promote a non-reasonable and reductionist "logic" (which I know you are sufficiently intelligent to realize is reductionist).

Also, nearly all Messi fans agree Messi shouldn't be brought back, except for a testimonial/send-off game.

Now this warrants a more thorough retort. You might've mistaken me with someone else or you're prone to grouping me with Messi haters who might've argued we should've got rid of him years ago. I don't agree. Getting rid of Messi alone was not a solution and wouldn't leave us in a better place, I was fully aware of that. Some members argued we'd look better off without him and then disappeared when we didn't. I won't mention names.

My main point is that Messi didn't have a place in a rebuilding squad. Having Messi in the team and attempting a serious rebuild would've been futile and ultimately self-defeating. That doesn't mean we wouldn't look better than before if Messi was surrounded with fresher, better players. That part is trivial.

Messi didn't have only two flaws. He was a player that came with a price in later stages. You had to tweak the team for him, suppress other players, and burden them with some of his responsibilities. You lost shape, you lost some advantages more functional teams had. The gains were obvious. For a few years, that price was worth paying even if too much in the CL. Now, Lewa is also of age and despite him having aged better than Messi, it might present a problem in a similar way. To a lesser extent, I believe, but that remains to be seen. I'm not crazy about Lewa or trying to promote an image that we'd be better with him than with Messi over the years, if that's what you're implying.

I agree with the bold. My main sentiment is that losing Messi when we lost him was a blessing in disguise. I think that was the best time for him to leave, second best at worst due to our poor start of the season. Due to the flaws both you and I listed.

I don't have to come clean on EV too now, do I? Elaborating on my Messi stance is enough for today.

 

[soul24rage]

6 points further away from a CL winning Real carried by a Ballon d'Or worthy showing from Benzema and a WC season by Vini than mighty Atletico the season before. Big loss, right? Paramount. With our starting wingers being Dest, Gavi, Abde and Ilias for half a season.

Difference was that we were fighting for the league title in 20/21 while we were fighting for top 4 in 20/22.

Messi was still a great player when he left, as I already pointed out, but his influence and importance were comically exaggerated. He left and we barely felt it with a half baked rebuild we did last winter when we brought in Auba and Torres. Not to mention this summer when we have truly WC players in Lewa and Dembele, very good Raphinha and Fati. Not yet so confident Torres.

Thank Laporta and Alemany for that and we were also lucky that Aubameyang was available for free. This also brings me to my next point.

I wouldn't dare to compare them. Now that you did...

Edit: Getting rid of Bartomeu was more important, obviously. But it was obvious it was going to happen. People still mourn losing Messi. Yet, it was also important.

Of course, I compared them because you were the one who said that it was the best decision, to which I disagreed with. Bartomeu's buddy Freixa was running for president at the time and the soci's are not the brightest. The 8-2 did not change anything much and Messi sending the burofax woke the soci's up. Who knows if Laporta would have ran for presidency if the motion of no confidence didn't happened. If Laporta didn't run, maybe Font would have won, but wouldn't have been too sure of that.

 

[pers]

BTW to all who were so concern about Lewy age. Messi is 35 now and way better than 34 one If we look at Messi and Lewy it is obvious physically Lewy is on different level so 36yo should be still top imo.

 

[soul24rage]

BTW to all who were so concern about Lewy age. Messi is 35 now and way better than 34 one If we look at Messi and Lewy it is obvious physically Lewy is on different level so 36yo should be still top imo.

Let's hope that is true cuz we'll need him to be.

 

[KingLeo10]

BTW to all who were so concern about Lewy age. Messi is 35 now and way better than 34 one If we look at Messi and Lewy it is obvious physically Lewy is on different level so 36yo should be still top imo.

It's not so much physical level. Players like Messi and CR7 have played way more games at age 34 than Lewa at age 34.

That's why Lewa is fresher. At a certain point, the legs of a player simply go. CR7 is possibly the greatest physical specimen in football history (in terms of his conditioning; Lewa is close but I don't believe he's CR7 level) and his legs have looked heavy since 34ish (after that 18/19 season with Juve).

 

[Temptation]

Let's hope that is true cuz we'll need him to be.

You won't.

After 2 seasons of RL9 mania, you'll buy Haaland and sell him.

RL9 will probably play in Italy after this.

 

[KingLeo10]

First division and international games played by age 34 (approx):

CR7: 980 games
Messi: 960 games
Lewa: 830 games

So Lewa has played about 2 to 2.5 years less football at age 34 compared to Messi and CR7. Now, keep in mind Messi and CR7 also played in the two best leagues over the last two decades; and Messi on top of that played with butchers in South America for all those Copas and Qualifiers.

Lewa will not decline till he hits around 950-1000 games, which will be in 2 years. Laporta and co. prolly know this and that's why he was an excellent signing. We gonna get 120 goals over this and next 2 seasons from this guy before he declines.

 

[Joan]

Thank Laporta and Alemany for that and we were also lucky that Aubameyang was available for free. This also brings me to my next point.

Let's keep it real here. It's not like we brought in Mbappe and Haaland. We brought in Auba who wasn't wanted at Arsenal for free. I summed it all up in a response to KL.

Messi wasn't some disaster we should've gotten rid of years ago to compare him to Bartomeu, but him leaving was a blessing in disguise.

Of course, I compared them because you were the one who said that it was the best decision, to which I disagreed with. Bartomeu's buddy Freixa was running for president at the time and the soci's are not the brightest. The 8-2 did not change anything much and Messi sending the burofax woke the soci's up. Who knows if Laporta would have ran for presidency if the motion of no confidence didn't happened. If Laporta didn't run, maybe Font would have won, but wouldn't have been too sure of that.

All this would be due to Messi if not for a butterfly who flapped its wings in China several weeks earlier.

 

[Temptation]

Ronaldo played in 4 leagues out of which 1 is extremely physically taxing.

Messi played all his life in 1 league which is not physically taxing whatsoever.

The Bundesliga is way more physical and faster than the La Liga. Anyone who says otherwise is trolling.

 

[Temptation]

RL9 will never be a Barca legend. You don't become a club legend in 2/3 years.

If RL9 is a success in Barca, he'll be a Cult Hero. Nothing more.

He's a Football Legend and a Bayern Legend and Dortmund Hero maybe.