Andrés Iniesta

[BarçAFan10]

those fancy tricks Iniesta does very often result in no end product.

:smile222::smiley_scared::thumbsdown: O Know He didn't..

 

[el tren]

So Sir Alex and other have praised Iniesta. Well, Scolari and Mourinho both said that Lampard is the world's greatest.

I have actually watched quite a few Barcelona games and all Iniesta is a mere system player, not a difference maker If you took Messi and Xavi out of Barcelona and rely only on Iniesta, Iniesta will look average. I never see Iniesta drive the team forward and inspire the team like Fabregas, Gerrard or Lampard. So how can Iniesta be rated one of the best in the word??

People say that Iniesta is dynamic and the ball barely leaves his feet but that it all aesthetics and personal taste.

People say that statistics don't tell the whole story. This is true but they give a very good indication as to how much the player is contributing, else why would people bother collecting stats. Regarding Zidane's stats he didn't score that many goals, but I am sure he managed loads of assists.
So what's the reason why Xavi is getting 30 assists and Iniesta only 10 assists yet people Iniesta is more important.

With his 10 assists last season how can Iniesta be more creative than Fabregas who has 9 assists already this season and Fabregas is servicing inferior fowards as well. Take away Fabregas assists from corners and free-kicks and Fabregas still manages more defense splitting assist passes for inferior fowards. Fabregas superior awareness allows him to create goals where as those fancy tricks Iniesta does very often result in no end product. Iniesta only gets picked ahead of Fabregas because of team politics. Only when Fabregas came off the bench did Spain get the goals (semi-final against Russia)

I guess its not unusual that coaches (or teammates) vote their own players (collegues) as best in the world. Thats why quotes from Ferguson or Rooney for example are much mor convincing imo.

Anyway, you should perhaps really lay down the statistics there. Its just a very questionable data for comparing players that have different tasks, a different style and play in a different team and vs different opponents.

Like already mentioned, Iniesta never takes set pieces that could lead to goals/assists like Cesc or Lampard do. ANd yeah, one of Iniestas few flaws is his shooting. He sucks there, as not only his shot power is low - while his precision is pretty good his long shots are still picked out of the air with ease by opponents GKs. BUt well, im fairly sure we can agree on him having some unique strengths that the other two mentioned dont have, and that make up for that flaw.

About him assisting: note that Barca has a completly different passing style than esp. Arsenal has. While ARsenal is much more working with straight forward passes, Barca plays a possession game with a lot more width. Typical (and yet so different) scenarios for the two teams are: Cesc playing the straight pass into the box on the striker through the center, earning an assist there - Iniesta instead plays the killer through pass on a winger (mostly Henry) who then pass it along to another forward that scores. Now figure out why Iniesta typically has less assists and ask yourself if his contribution is actually lower.

 

[Lemmi]

Justin you are tool.

 

[Metaphysical]

iniesta's brilliance cannot be measured in stats. just like zidane's couldn't be. statistically neither were exceptional even though zidane took pens and free-kicks.

I mean, there's no concrete way to explain WHY the likes of iniesta, zidane and laudrup are/were so good. it's just, when you watch them, you understand it.

every football fan understands it.

except this guy, apparently.

 

[Gnegneri]

It's just sufficient to watch the Champions League Final of 2009. The biggest game in Europe against the biggest team (till that point) in Europe. That's as much evidence you can get. So yeah, watch it.

I can link you to an HD cap, just to make sure you see every detail of Iniesta's performance. While he was even injured actually.

 

[Beast]

Actually when you talk about system players only one thing pop to my head

ARSENAL

 

[VivaBarca]

Iniesta rules. He was pretty mediocre against Rubin but he is a seriously great player. he isn't better than Messi and at this moment I would say Xavi is better as well but he has a great talent.

 

[La Furia]

Actually when you talk about system players only one thing pop to my head

ARSENAL

:beer2::clap:arty00231:

 

[Vecellio]

I can link you to an HD cap, just to make sure you see every detail of Iniesta's performance. While he was even injured actually.

Any chance you could pm me that link please?

 

[IrvDizzle]

why are you guys humoring this dude? he's clearly trying to bring a knife to a gun fight ... if he wants to believe that the earth is flat then let him be. I'm pretty sure he believes that Lampard is the only person who could run to the horizon and not fall off. Just let him be. I for one always find it hilarious when someone tries to argue a futile point. it's like watching a comedian crash and burn on stage, except less awkward.

 

[maz]

He's bringing a pencil sharpener to a gun fight.

 

[justin]

Bringing a pencil sharpener to a gun fight.
So far you Iniesta supporters have have been totally owned and blown away by the statistics.
Iniesta last season: 10 assists
Xavi last season: 27 assists
And yet people say Iniesta is more creative than Xavi.

Actually when you talk about system players only one thing pop to my head

ARSENAL

Iniesta is just a system player. He's only looks good because he plays beside Xavi and has Messi, Henry, Eto/ibra ahead of him in Barcelona and Torres and Villa ahead of him in the Spain NT.

Iniesta can't carry a team like Fabregas can. 9 assists already for Fabregas this season almost the same number as Iniesta for the whole of last season. When Iniesta gets injured it has no effect on the team because Iniesta is a system player not a difference maker. Didn't Barcelona go on a winning streak around about Christmas last season when Iniesta got injured?

Now Iniesta supporters can answer these questions
1) If Arsenal replaced Fabregas with Iniesta will Arsenal be a better or worse team?
2) If Chelsea replaced Lampard with Iniesta will Chelsea be a better or worse team?
3) If Liverpool replaced Gerrard with Iniesta will Liverpool be a better or worse team?
4) If Iniesta was really that good could he carry Barcelona if Messi and Xavi got injured?

It's just sufficient to watch the Champions League Final of 2009. The biggest game in Europe against the biggest team (till that point) in Europe. That's as much evidence you can get. So yeah, watch it.

I can link you to an HD cap, just to make sure you see every detail of Iniesta's performance. While he was even injured actually.

Iniesta had a good game, but he only looked good because he was surrounded by great players like Messi, Xavi, Eto'o and Henry. Arteta for instance would also look world class if he was surrounded by great players like Messi, Xavi, Eto'o and Henry.

 

[Cule Angles]

Bringing a pencil sharpener to a gun fight.
So far you Iniesta supporters have have been totally owned and blown away by the statistics.
Iniesta last season: 10 assists
Xavi last season: 27 assists
And yet people say Iniesta is more creative than Xavi.



Iniesta is just a system player. He's only looks good because he plays beside Xavi and has Messi, Henry, Eto/ibra ahead of him in Barcelona and Torres and Villa ahead of him in the Spain NT.

Iniesta can't carry a team like Fabregas can. 9 assists already for Fabregas this season almost the same number as Iniesta for the whole of last season. When Iniesta gets injured it has no effect on the team because Iniesta is a system player not a difference maker. Didn't Barcelona go on a winning streak around about Christmas last season when Iniesta got injured?

Now Iniesta supporters can answer these questions
1) If Arsenal replaced Fabregas with Iniesta will Arsenal be a better or worse team?
2) If Chelsea replaced Lampard with Iniesta will Chelsea be a better or worse team?
3) If Liverpool replaced Gerrard with Iniesta will Liverpool be a better or worse team?
4) If Iniesta was really that good could he carry Barcelona if Messi and Xavi got injured?


Iniesta had a good game, but he only looked good because he was surrounded by great players like Messi, Xavi, Eto'o and Henry. Arteta for instance would also look world class if he was surrounded by great players like Messi, Xavi, Eto'o and Henry.

Nobody's been owned by any statistics, you've been told several times why the statistical argument you put forward is misleading and irrelevant.

Your comment about Barça going on a winning streak when Andres was injured has just seen you go down in flames, Iniesta's injury was in February and saw Barça suffer their worst form of the season. You've just proven that you know nothing aside from a few numbers.

I'm assuming that you would argue that any of the sides you mention would worsen if their cited midfielder was replaced with Iniesta. You totally ignore the fact that Lampard and Gerrard are totally different kinds of players and given that all the players you mention have consistently struggled with their national sides whilst Iniesta hasn't you really should be questioning who the "system players" are. Iniesta would improve any side in the world.

 

[Barcaman]

I thought about this and think Xavi is actually more of a system player than Iniesta (if there is such a thing as "system player"). Xavi works great to bring the tone to our play and keep possession. But it is Iniesta who has the speed, is able to produce that surge and penetrate opposition defenses. Last CL for example: He brought us in CL final with that spectacular goal and in the final it was him who made that run and provided a pass for Eto.

 

[sammy]

How old are you justin? with your pst as a reference, looks like you still young, so i assume you never conduct any scientific research. But let me tell you something, one of the biggest liar in this world is statistic. If you ever become a manager or a "big boss" someday, don't rely too much on statistics. That's my word for you.