Arthur

[BBZ8800]

My man @BBZ8800 getting back into trolling shape lol.

I wouldn't mind if you said we trade Arthur for another young midfield talent with less injury issues.

But Pjanic. Dawg, he's almost as washed up as Raki at this point.

I am not for Pjanic.

It's about Arthur.
So much love towards him due to one world class skill (press resistance) is one of the biggest mysteries I have ever seen.

I guess the place with Barca's fans is the only place in the world where Arthur's skills and style of play can be considered as world class.

Some guys commented that he is too good for Italy.
No.
He is good only for Italy.

IF he will be sold by Barca one day, who will buy him?
English teams won't even consider him due to his slow pace, low stamina, weight problems and slow-possession-dwelling on the ball type of play.
Bayern? Why would they need a player like him?

He could only go to a weaker Spanish teams like Sevilla.
Maybe to Psg.
Or, his most likely destination: Milan, Roma, Lazio, Inter and similar=slow paced granny football without too much running, where you have a lot of time on the ball.

I am not commenting in any other topic.
This guy is just a mystery.

Also, I will add: if we bought Arthur in 2000 or 2005 (during Rijkaard), I don't think that people would rate him.
We would rate him as an ok-ish technical midfielder, but just meh overall.

But due to Pep, some other skills in players gained in importance for our fans.
And Arthur is especially good in those skills which Pep introduced.
And again, since majority of fans here started to watch football during Pep, that style of play and certain skills are hardwired in their footballing brains and judgements as the more important.
He embodies some traits from Pep's era and then you guys are blinded by the rest of his skills, which are quite average.

Football is moving away from Pep's days.
Teams are playing faster and more direct today.
Midfielders are more like allrounders who can pass, create, score and defend.
Out of these 4 skills, Arthur can do only one: pass.

No offense to anyone, but Arthur is a symbol of Barca fans living in the past.

Do I even need to bother with questions: after Messi we will lose like 50 goals per season.
No one will be ever to compensate for that.
Imagine if we will have average forwards, which is the most likely.
We will struggle insanely with scoring goals.

And then people will say: but but but, IT WORKED DURING PEP!
Well:
1. we had Xavi and Iniesta during Pep, who were miles better than Arthur and co
2. and we had Messi who was banging 50 goals per season and always saving our asses

In the era when you don't have Messi, like in Rijkaard's era, you need more players who can bang goals, like goalscoring midfielders like Deco (who still had Xavi behind his back).
Arthur is a perfect player if you want to play Pep's football 10 years too late, if you want to be slow in the transition and if you want to invite opponents to park the bus in every single action due to that slow transition.
And then when they park the bus, you won't be able to create too much:
1. since teams have learned how to park the bus
2. and with too many players like Frenkie and Arthur, how ill you break the bus when they are bad at passing?
So, if we want to win:
1. we need a faster transition and we need to avoid parked buses.
2. plus, we need more risks and shots (like in pre-Pep's days). As I bleed Blaugrana mentioned a few days ago.
He watched all matches and seen that players were taking way more risks with crosses, long balls, throughballs.
Arthur is a textbook examples of: calma, calma, slow down, don't risk, make a turn, keep, the ball, play it safe, we will have 90% of possession and 3 shots on goal.

People will again reply: but but but Anfield.
Lol.
Arthur could help in one game per season, like Anfield.
But then he will lower our chances for a win in 20 smaller matches where we will lack any attacking impact.

This is not about Pjanic or anyone.
I will repeat again: I have never seen a more sterile Barca's central midfielder in 25 years of watching Barca.
Arthur is a guy who is born without any attacking killer instincts.

 

[serghei]

My man @BBZ8800 getting back into trolling shape lol.

I wouldn't mind if you said we trade Arthur for another young midfield talent with less injury issues.

But Pjanic. Dawg, he's almost as washed up as Raki at this point.

Hell, even some who like Arthur would cope with that arrangement.

 

[BBZ8800]

Also, about Arthur, imo, there is a psychological problem with fans.

People always want something new, and often OPPOSITE than what we have currently.
An example:
When Semedo plays for 3 Months, people start to say: omg, he is so bad in attack. Give me Roberto.

Then Roberto starts to play and even though he is better in attack, he sucks in defense and people will soon change their story to: omg, Bob is so horrible. Bring back Semedo.

Then Semedo will start to play and after a few weeks, we will go back to: omg, I can't watch him anymore, give me Bob back, he can't be worse than Semedo.

So, my point: the new option always looks better than the current option.

And then:
We had Pep, we had possession based Barca's DNA players.
We stopped dominating and the board tried with different players like Rakitic, Paulinho, Gomes and similar.
And now people are tired of that type of players and the same as with Semedo/Roberto, we can hear: fuck this shit, give me Arthur, we have to go BACK to old days, he can't be worse than XX.

But as always, if Arthur would get one full season as a starter, I am quite sure that people would make another shift and start to say things: omg, this guy is so slow and weak in attack.
Give me Alena, Puig or a new CAM, I can't watch this anymore.

So, with Arthur, in a psychological way, you guys have:
1. a breath of romance since he has a shiny press resistance skill and he brings memory to Pep's football (with that skill)
2. and then you have that 2nd problem where he is still "a what if" player.
He never had a chance to play for 12 Months in a row to disappoint you.
Today, all we have are a few matches where he was good and a few matches where he was bad.
And just like with Dembele or any young player, people will stick to those good games, ignore the red flags and bad games and offer 100 alibies like: forwards aren't running, EV is stupid, we have no system, other midfielders are bad, he was injured, he was rusty, he is playing too wide.

Sorry dawgs, but there is almost 0% chance that Arthur's story will end as you are hoping for.
You are just tricked by your brains and emotions towards Pep and happier days.

Sorry.

** Btw, my brain is doing the same.
I am tricked towards Rabiot, Rakitic and similar because they remind me of successful football from Rijkaard's days or on Milan from 90s.
So, I am often also overrating those type of players due to my brain who is tricking me.

Don't be like me

 

[Batistuta9]

@BBZ. The reason why most users are willing to keep Arthur, myself included is because he has shown instances he can be very good for us. I remember watching his 1st clasico and he destroyed modric when we won 5-1 or something. Yes, he has been inconsistent and had injuries, but he is still young and can improve on those

 

[FinBarcelonafan]

@BBZ. The reason why most users are willing to keep Arthur, myself included is because he has shown instances he can be very good for us. I remember watching his 1st clasico and he destroyed modric when we won 5-1 or something. Yes, he has been inconsistent and had injuries, but he is still young and can improve on those

Exactly. He is one of the few players who have potential to improve. Almost everyone else is past it.

 

[Vilarrubi]

Also, about Arthur, imo, there is a psychological problem with fans.

People always want something new, and often OPPOSITE than what we have currently.
An example:
When Semedo plays for 3 Months, people start to say: omg, he is so bad in attack. Give me Roberto.

Then Roberto starts to play and even though he is better in attack, he sucks in defense and people will soon change their story to: omg, Bob is so horrible. Bring back Semedo.

Then Semedo will start to play and after a few weeks, we will go back to: omg, I can't watch him anymore, give me Bob back, he can't be worse than Semedo.

So, my point: the new option always looks better than the current option.

And then:
We had Pep, we had possession based Barca's DNA players.
We stopped dominating and the board tried with different players like Rakitic, Paulinho, Gomes and similar.
And now people are tired of that type of players and the same as with Semedo/Roberto, we can hear: fuck this shit, give me Arthur, we have to go BACK to old days, he can't be worse than XX.

But as always, if Arthur would get one full season as a starter, I am quite sure that people would make another shift and start to say things: omg, this guy is so slow and weak in attack.
Give me Alena, Puig or a new CAM, I can't watch this anymore.

So, with Arthur, in a psychological way, you guys have:
1. a breath of romance since he has a shiny press resistance skill and he brings memory to Pep's football (with that skill)
2. and then you have that 2nd problem where he is still "a what if" player.
He never had a chance to play for 12 Months in a row to disappoint you.
Today, all we have are a few matches where he was good and a few matches where he was bad.
And just like with Dembele or any young player, people will stick to those good games, ignore the red flags and bad games and offer 100 alibies like: forwards aren't running, EV is stupid, we have no system, other midfielders are bad, he was injured, he was rusty, he is playing too wide.

Sorry dawgs, but there is almost 0% chance that Arthur's story will end as you are hoping for.
You are just tricked by your brains and emotions towards Pep and happier days.

Sorry.

Not sure about the first part. I feel people are either one or the other most of the time. I’d rather have Semedo any day over Roberto for example even though he has obvious attacking problems. We’ve lost important games in the past few years with Roberto and because of bad defending, not because our full backs couldn’t attack. Much rather have a better defender RB in Semedo especially with Alba bombing up the left and Messi not covering the RW area.

As for Arthur, we’ve had a first season in Europe and half a season with injuries. No ones saying he’ll be the next Xavi. But the games he played well in, our midfield looked more fluid than it has done for a while. Also he grabbed a few goals and assists too, something that you complained about him not doing.

The problem is, which I think you are in agreement about is that Frenkie and Arthur are similar in a lot of ways. Like to play deep, start attacks from the back, good passers, unreal pressing resistance.

 

[MTL_Barca]

The midfield right now is a mess and will need a lot of work the coming years. Rakitic (32) is done and hopefully leaves, Vidal (33 soon) is ok for his role but won't stay much longer and very well could leave this summer as well, Busquets (32 soon) is way past his prime and won't get any better or faster with age.

That leaves us with just Frenkie and Arthur as midfielders that could play for Barca mid/longterm if we don't count unproven players like Puig or Alena and Roberto who still mainly plays RB and who is just average in midfield as well.

Last thing the team needs is another 30 year old midfielder, especially since he would probably be expensive as well.

 

[mc_lovin]

Also, about Arthur, imo, there is a psychological problem with fans.

The only psychological problem here is your tendency to think in extremes. Theres middle ground, you know? Noone thinks Arthur is perfect, but its really not the most outlandish opinion to give him more than 1.5 years.

 

[Rory]

Arthur to me has become one of those players you know probably won't be the success you hoped for him but would hate to see him succeed at another club. If everyone was sound in the knowledge he'd be as consistent for another team as he has been for us then we'd all be screaming at the club to sell him.

When fully fit he's been the outstanding midfielder in games for us over 2 years. How many games was that? I'd wager 5. Who was his competition? A heavily declined busquets/rakitic, technically average vidal, and de Jong who has consistently been played out of position. But then as the season ends you look back and say thank god we had busquets/rakitic and vidal because Arthur is injured half the time/out of form/fitness issues due to bad mentality.

Us relying on Arthur is actually stalling the future of our club because we haven't been able to get rid of senior midfielders.

I'd keep him one more year but I'd also sign a midfielder who can consistently start games, Arthur can either buck his ideas up and push himself to start or let a new guy take his spot. Maybe Thiago if cheap. He's basically an upgraded Arthur who has overcome his injury issues.

 

[vuji_31]

Our ideal siging would be Pogba.

Great strenght,height,tehnique...But he have some mental problems...If not he could be great CM.

 

[serghei]

Our ideal siging would be Pogba.

Great strenght,height,tehnique...But he have some mental problems...If not he could be great CM.

If we get Pogba and Neymar, I think we'd look more like a Pepsi commercial than a football club. It's time we cut this shit and bring in players who don't appear on soda cans, but get the job done in trainings and on the pitch.

 

[Andresito]

If we get Pogba and Neymar, I think we'd look more like a Pepsi commercial than a football club. It's time we cut this shit and bring in players who don't appear on soda cans, but get the job done in trainings and on the pitch.

God damn soda can merchant

 

[serghei]

Arthur to me has become one of those players you know probably won't be the success you hoped for him but would hate to see him succeed at another club. If everyone was sound in the knowledge he'd be as consistent for another team as he has been for us then we'd all be screaming at the club to sell him.

In the midfield business, as I said in the past, especially for a possession based player, movement and proper tactics are key.

It's like when you want to make a cake, and you have some great ingredients in the fridge, but others are completely crap. Let's say you have some eggs they are 6 months past their expiration date, and a pack of rancid butter. How the hell do you expect the cake to taste well? You can have the best sugar, if the eggs and the butter are crap, the cake will be crap, because they are too important in the mix. It's almost a guaranteed certainty.

You have people who have no idea how a cake is made, and they say man this can of sugar is crap. Can't you see how crap the cake turned up to be? They see the effect, but don't have the tactical knowledge to look at an effect and draw conclusions about the cause. And you tell these people, dude, it's not the sugar, it's the eggs. They're rotten. And they still don't understand, they will put up some stats and think this explains things. They believe if you change the brand of sugar, the cake will turn up great even if you make it using rotten eggs and rancid butter.

At this point you can only laugh...

Some criticism about Arthur is obviously valid, as he's not been without his fair share of faults so far. Criticism about him being crap offensively is mostly bullshit. All midfielders in this team are bad offensively by this parameter, because we're talking about the slowest, most immobile, old, past it and laziest top team out there.

We are on a quest to find the best sugar and the best flour in the world to pair them with rancid butter and expired eggs, to make a great cake. Good luck to us.

 

[Vilarrubi]

Not all teams out there are so poorly run as ours, not all teams have more days off than actual training session, not all teams rely on veteran players who stand around more and more.

In the midfield business, as I said in the past, especially for a possession based player, movement and proper tactics are key.

It's like when you want to make a cake, and you have some great ingredients in the fridge, but other are completely crap. Let's say you have some eggs they are 6 month past their expiration date, and the butter has turned into cheese almost. How the hell do you expect the cake to taste well. You can have the best sugar, if the eggs and the butter are crap, the cake will be crap. It's almost a guaranteed certainty. Unless we fix some of the ingredients, whatever we put into the cake will be altered by the taste of rotten eggs and cheesed up butter.

There you have people who have no idea how a cake is made, and they say man this can of sugar is crap. Can't you see how crap the cake turned up to be? And you tell these people, dude, it's not the sugar, it's the eggs. They're rotten. And they don't understand. They believe if you change the brand of sugar, and buy some other sugar, the cake will turn up great even if you make it using rotten eggs and cheesed up butter.

At this point you can only laugh...

Some criticism about Arthur is obviously valid, as he's not been without his fair share of faults so far. Criticism about him being crap offensively is mostly bullshit. All midfielders in this team are bad offensively by this parameter, because we're talking about the slowest, most immobile, old, past it and laziest top team out there.

Giving me BBZ vibes with the cake thing well said though

 

[serghei]

Best course of action is to make Messi the only slow and old player in the team. And I mean truly THE ONLY one. When we do that, my estimation is the compartments will be starting to click more and more, simply because the access level between each player goes up, due to more movement. With Semedo, and with Arthur as starters.