Bayern München

[Iarwain]

It makes a clear difference wether Lahm is CDM or RB, Bayern is instantly a whole different and way more exciting team that way

They sure were exciting when Real blown them to pieces 0-4 or when City dominated them at Allianz Arena 2-3. Remember who got utterly dominated at RB in these games?

Lahm is way past it physically to perform in Guardiola's ridiculously high back line at RB.

He's solid in NT because Germany is a more balanced team and he's rarely left alone covering large portions of space. Even in the WC final he didn't impress offensively and his flank wasn't even seriously contested by Rojo and unfit Aguero.

 

[Yannik]

They sure were exciting when Real blown them to pieces 0-4 or when City dominated them at Allianz Arena 2-3. Remember who got utterly dominated at RB in these games?

Lahm is way past it physically to perform in Guardiola's ridiculously high back line at RB.

He's solid in NT because Germany is a more balanced team and he's rarely left alone covering large portions of space. Even in the WC final he didn't impress offensively and his flank wasn't even seriously contested by Rojo and unfit Aguero.

I said they werent exciting before and no, of coruse i DONT remember who "utterly dominated at RB", although i dont see what you are tryint to say. Bayern didnt play at high line against Valencia in this game and that is exactly how it should be.

 

[Yannik]

Yeah, Rafinha was the RB in that game. We all agree that Lahm is much more effective on the wing as opposed to being in the midfield.

was he? I didnt notice that, he was however on the wings, where he does that stuff he does best.
Lahm isnt midfield-sidepassing.
Lahm is the overlaping run, Lahm is the 60m diagonal pass to send the left winger through, Lahm is the faked cross from the goalline and the following shortpass to the striker on the penalty spot.
Thats why you play Lahm on the right, where he is simply sensational

 

[Iarwain]

I said they werent exciting before and no, of coruse i DONT remember who "utterly dominated at RB", although i dont see what you are tryint to say. Bayern didnt play at high line against Valencia in this game and that is exactly how it should be.

In both those games Lahm played at RB and his flank was totally ravaged by Real/City (add on that his lazy reaction on Milner's winning goal ). And on the offensive side, he did absolutely nothing, especially against Real. Bayern actually played a better game in the first leg when he was in midfield.

Two of the worst Bayern performances in 13-14 season were with Lahm at RB.

 

[Yannik]

In both those games Lahm played at RB and his flank was totally ravaged by Real/City (add on that his lazy reaction on Milner's winning goal ). And on the offensive side, he did absolutely nothing, especially against Real. Bayern actually played a better game in the first leg when he was in midfield.

Two of the worst Bayern performances in 13-14 season were with Lahm at RB.

That happens. I didnt say "Lahm at RB is the ultimative solution to never loose again", I said that he should better play at RB:
You singled out 2 games where it didnt work, I could single out entire seasons, compare them to those last 2 and say "it works".
There is not that much to debate in this regard.

 

[Iarwain]

That happens. I didnt say "Lahm at RB is the ultimative solution to never loose again", I said that he should better play at RB:
You singled out 2 games where it didnt work, I could single out entire seasons, compare them to those last 2 and say "it works".
There is not that much to debate in this regard.

Those are not just random games but two WORST performances by Bayern since Guardiola took over, both against big opponents and in both Lahm played at RB.

Lahm is obviously having difficulties catching up with what Guardiola's system demands out of its full back.

 

[Yannik]

Those are not just random games but two WORST performances by Bayern since Guardiola took over, both against big opponents and in both Lahm played at RB.

Lahm is obviously having difficulties catching up with what Guardiola's system demands out of its full back.

I honestly dont see anything obvious here.
Bayern played 2 very bad games and Lahm just happened to be a RB in those. He also played RB on numerous other occasions and these games turned out to be fantastic.
He was simply one of the 11 bad players there on a team that played in generally bad. You could find 100 right or wrong possible reasons why it went down like that, with Lahm playing RB being just one of them. You could also wonder if the scoreline would have been any different if Lahm wouldnt have been RB those days. I mean there are also examples for amtches where he was in the midfeild and it didnt work out. You could consider all of these aspects.
But the evidence that you came up with in thsoe 2 games is simply not strong enough for what looks like a pretty superficial assumption.

 

[Donauwelle]

You mean that ManCity match in which everybody fell to sleep and did not wake up anymore (last match of the group stage) after leading 5:1 on aggregate (3:1 first leg, 2:0 in this match). At the end of that match city won by 3:2 but did not win the group.

And the Real match that was sealed after two set-pieces lead to an aggregate score of 0:3...

That are matches I would not particulary blame anybody. That was just how matches run.

Lahm's problem lately was that after two injuries (one prior to the World Cup, one a broken leg end of 2014) had problems to get back into his old shape. In the match against Valencia he looked really fit again.

 

[Ryu Hayabusa]

Those are not just random games but two WORST performances by Bayern since Guardiola took over, both against big opponents and in both Lahm played at RB.

Lahm is obviously having difficulties catching up with what Guardiola's system demands out of its full back.

ffs. Against City, Bayern obliterated them within the first 20 minutes, then took the foot off the gas, which came back to bite them in the ass big time and they didn't recover from it.
Against Real, Lahm hadn't played as RB in ages. Of course he wasn't able to be at his best against one of the best LW on this planet.

Though I actually agree in that he is declining physically, which of course will/would have an impact on his performances as a RB. Doesn't mean he would be a bad RB now either tough.

 

[Iarwain]

I honestly dont see anything obvious here.
Bayern played 2 very bad games and Lahm just happened to be a RB in those. He also played RB on numerous other occasions and these games turned out to be fantastic.
He was simply one of the 11 bad players there on a team that played in generally bad. You could find 100 right or wrong possible reasons why it went down like that, with Lahm playing RB being just one of them. You could also wonder if the scoreline would have been any different if Lahm wouldnt have been RB those days. I mean there are also examples for amtches where he was in the midfeild and it didnt work out. You could consider all of these aspects.
But the evidence that you came up with in thsoe 2 games is simply not strong enough for what looks like a pretty superficial assumption.

I can find you other games (i.e. CSKA away, where a guy named Musa tormented him on the right flank, Lahm almost commited a penalty on him), but these two important games vs tough opponents are nice examples why Lahm isn't convincing on RB in current Bayern system. It's fairly obvious he's having trouble anticipating attacks and closing opponent wingers at 40-50m or even higher. For example, look at the beginning of Real's counter on 3rd goal and his terrible decision to follow up Isco or whoever that was.

The second part of this quote simply don't stand:

"It makes a clear difference wether Lahm is CDM or RB, Bayern is instantly a whole different and way more exciting team that way"

When you guys think about Lahm as a RB, you probably imagine him in his top physical shape and in a system that suits him, but that's not the case with Guardiola's Bayern. He's just not convincing in that high line and doesn't offer enough on offensive end to compensate that.

You mean that ManCity match in which everybody fell to sleep and did not wake up anymore (last match of the group stage) after leading 5:1 on aggregate (3:1 first leg, 2:0 in this match). At the end of that match city won by 3:2 but did not win the group

City was only one goal away from topping the group. You know what would that mean in R16.

 

[Egert]

Will play Supercup vs Wolfsburg tomorrow. Eurosport thank god shows that, finally can watch some matches from my TV

I say Bayern will lose it again, Wolfsburg is extremely strong at home and the game is played at their home I think. But still will be supporting Bayern because of Pep.

 

[ThwiX]

Robben from start. Nice! Going to be an interesting game. Too long since I've seen football that's a bit more serious than a friendly.

 

[ThwiX]

This Douglas Costa is looking very dangerous.

 

[Barcadub]

Ohhh boeteng hits the crossbar for Bayern

 

[Luftstalag14]

This Douglas Costa is looking very dangerous.

He has done really well in the pre-season and surprised a lot of folks.