Ernesto Valverde - V1

[MessiCam]

I haven't read all posts, there is too much posts on all threads.
Anyway, some guys will say this match is a proof how workhorses don't work.

I am a fan of workhorses, but this lineup is a shit.
Roberto-Semedo is a new thing.
Paulinho didn't play, Gomes didn't play.

This was a nice workhorses' lineup:
https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1222139/Preview/Spain-La-Liga-2017-2018-Real-Madrid-Barcelona

In this lineup we had 4 classical CMs.
Paulinho is a central player, Raki is a central player, Busi is a central player, Iniesta is a central player.

Today, with Bob, he hogged a touchline.
We basically played 433 with Roberto being some RM-RW hybrid.

I am not saying that tactics with workhorses is a perfect one.
But please, don't take this match as an example of tactics with workhorses.
This was a total shit where EV tried to close down their wings (and not allow too many crosses for Dzeko) and he left a middle totally exposed and we were outrun and outplayed in the middle where we had only 3 players, all of them old, slow turtles in granny Iniesta, Raki and Busi.

Not to mention of a lack of stamina, lack of rotation, lack of a mental strength.
With rotations and with playing "a true workhorses" tactics, things would probably ended differently.

Anyway, this is on EV and his rookie mistakes.
He has never managed a team fighting for a CL.
He has never managed a team fighting for 3 trophies.
He has never managed Messi and similar players who don't want to get rotated.

We paid the price tonight.

Maybe the next time we will be wiser with our next coach.
It doesn't mean that ALL rookie coaches will mess things up.
But majority of them eventually will mess things up.

No it’s not proof that workhorses don’t work but It wasn’t a hybrid 4-3-3... It was about as 4-4-2 or 4-2-3-1 as Can be reasonably expected from a Valverde team. Valverde consciously gave up on running in behind the obvious space left by Roma to focus on defensive shape by leaving Dembélé on the bench until the tie was lost and then he has the audacity to say we tried it with Suárez isolated upfront. That’s crazy talk when you have a lightning fast dribbler rotting on the bench.

The double pivot has once again been overrun by mediocre opposition.

 

[Neymessi]

Haha where have I said Barca 'were always in control vs Chelsea and Sevilla'.

Making things up again...

Lay low if you are going to make such things up and are getting a bit giddy about Barca being eliminated.

Stop trying to debate semantically. You know exactly what I am talking about. You were dead sure EV was doing everything right or at least most things right and that there seemed nothing too wrong with us. And for those of us who thought there was a lot of shit wrong with us and it was just matter of time when we got exposed you called us hypocritical and spoilt and all. You are one of the biggest psuedo intellectcs over here who tried to school us all crticisers by making up shitty excuses for EV all the time when it was clear the team is in trouble.

 

[serghei]

EV was one step behind tactically. 3 at the back + a flood of midfielders in the middle is exactly how Chelsea managed to contain and outplay/outpress us in the first leg.

The 4-4-2 encourages the opposition team to settle into lines. It keeps Iniesta and Busi out of the zones where they're most effective, breaking the press and breaking the defensive lines. Busi from We had no 1v1 dribbling threat out wide, no pace, we weren't even building up the wings at all which is what the main point of a 4-4-2 is offensively.

The game changed so much when we brought Dembele in and changed the emphasis. For a minute there it looked like we were gonna score. It's the shape that we've played with for years and the shape that was best for us in many games this season as well.

The silver lining in all this is that we should have some significant squad upgrades for the CL next season, and the tactical issues that need fixing are pretty rudimentary. Don't think EV is the one to do it though, seeing as how the players have given up on his 4-4-2 philosophy and he's hardly shown any tactical intelligence over the season.

But the question is who else is there?? Can't think of any available manager who'd be an ideal fit for us at the moment.

Sarri plays 4-3-3. Insigne - Mertens - Callejon.

We could line-up Coutinho - Messi - Dembele/Griezmann. But we need one more midfield signing besides Arthur. Arhtur should do well in a 3 midfield. This still leaves us a LCM short if Coutinho is to be played more advanced.

 

[JamDav1982]

Stop trying to debate semantically. You know exactly what I am talking about. You were dead sure EV was doing everything right or at least most things right and that there seemed nothing too wrong with us. And for those of us who thought there was a lot of shit wrong with us and it was just matter of time when we got exposed you called us hypocritical and spoilt and all. You are one of the biggest psuedo intellectcs over here who tried to school us all crticisers by making up shitty excuses for EV all the time when it was clear the team is in trouble.

Nah you are lying as usual and I never said that 'Barca were always in control v Chelsea and Sevilla'.

You are too giddy about Barca getting beat and making things up.

 

[DonAndres]

Sarri plays 4-3-3. Insigne - Mertens - Callejon. He's the man.

From all I've seen of Sarri and his Napoli side, I would be 100% all in on him.

Unfortunately, I don't see it happening. Managerial positions, especially in Spain, are handed out more on the basis of precedent and networking. Every Barca coach has to be a former Barca player or have some connection to Barca somehow, etc.

Sarri, being Italian and coaching in Serie A with 0 connection to Barca, is highly unlikely to be considered. I truly have to wonder if someone like Farto/Segura/etc. who decide on the coach even know who he is.

 

[BBZ8800]

EV was one step behind tactically. 3 at the back + a flood of midfielders in the middle is exactly how Chelsea managed to contain and outplay/outpress us in the first leg.

The 4-4-2 encourages the opposition team to settle into lines. It keeps Iniesta and Busi out of the zones where they're most effective, breaking the press and breaking the defensive lines. Busi from We had no 1v1 dribbling threat out wide, no pace, we weren't even building up the wings at all which is what the main point of a 4-4-2 is offensively.

The game changed so much when we brought Dembele in and changed the emphasis. For a minute there it looked like we were gonna score. It's the shape that we've played with for years and the shape that was best for us in many games this season as well.

The silver lining in all this is that we should have some significant squad upgrades for the CL next season, and the tactical issues that need fixing are pretty rudimentary. Don't think EV is the one to do it though, seeing as how the players have given up on his 4-4-2 philosophy and he's hardly shown any tactical intelligence over the season.

But the question is who else is there?? Can't think of any available manager who'd be an ideal fit for us at the moment.

I am dead serious.
Imagine a year 2019, CL quarters Barca against AM again.

You have a current team plus Dembele, Cou, Arthur, Griezz.
You are Barca's coach.

What formation and a lineup would you field, but please, don't put a lineup of midgets since AM will outplay you in the middle, proven tons of times till now.
Will you play 433?
Where will Messi play?
How will you break their bus of 4+4 players around the box with open flanks since we can't cross?

Also, without Raki/Suarez, how will you defend corners against AM, english teams, Real etc?

I agree, 433 and our style is a good recipe against RM.
But what about AM, Bayern, Liverpool, Psg etc?

If you'll play 433 with Coutinho-Raki-Busi, we'll get murdered in a CL.
If you'll play 433 with Cou-Arthur-Busi, we'll look like 13 years old kids in defending.

So, please, give me some answers.

I am not worried about La Liga.
433 is usually good enough against tons of technically inferior teams in La Liga.

A million dollar question is: how to get past a 1/4 in a CL?
Barca has been knocked out in 4 quarters in the last 5 years.

 

[Devils]

I wouldn't be surprised if he lost the locker room tonight btw.

This was historic humiliation.

 

[jamrock]

My biggest question would be what did he think was going to happen when he brought on Gomes in the 81th minutes?.

 

[JamDav1982]

Roma just did what Sevilla did.

They targeted early balls into space left by Alba high up the park and exposed Umtiti shite defending when left isolated.

Rest of team made it too easy for them to do it.

My biggest question would be what did he think was going to happen when he brought on Gomes in the 81th minutes?.

Decoy runs obviously.

 

[Total-Football]

My biggest question would be what did he think was going to happen when he brought on Gomes in the 81th minutes?.

Spare the man psychological issues, which are no joke. Sadly at the expense of fc barcelona and its fans.

 

[jairzinho]

My biggest question would be what did he think was going to happen when he brought on Gomes in the 81th minutes?.

This is the puzzle that everyone has been trying to figure out.

What was Gomes supposed to do? What exactly was EV trying to achieve by putting a player like that out there.

A player who has shown time and time again that he's not at the level required to play in this team and yet he bring him on in a game like this?

Judging by that decision alone I think EV should leave asap. It's irresponsible and reckless coaching.

 

[El Flaco]

[tw]983810767010099200[/tw]

 

[Stoichkov1]

Roma just did what Sevilla did.

They targeted early balls into space left by Alba high up the park and exposed Umtiti shite defending when left isolated.

Rest of team made it too easy for them to do it.

We also lost every single duel with Roma players and every second ball in midfield like it happened against PSG last year.

Busi said exactly this, he said he thought we learned from that match but actually we lost in the same way.

 

[jamrock]

This is the puzzle that everyone has been trying to figure out.

What was Gomes supposed to do? What exactly was EV trying to achieve by putting a player like that out there.

A player who has shown time and time again that he's not at the level required to play in this team and yet he bring him on in a game like this?

Judging by that decision alone I think EV should leave asap. It's irresponsible and reckless coaching.

Yea for this alone I would fire him, that decision made no sense, I wish na journalist would ask him this question.

 

[gasgas]

I am dead serious.
Imagine a year 2019, CL quarters Barca against AM again.

You have a current team plus Dembele, Cou, Arthur, Griezz.
You are Barca's coach.

What formation and a lineup would you field, but please, don't put a lineup of midgets since AM will outplay you in the middle, proven tons of times till now.
Will you play 433?
Where will Messi play?
How will you break their bus of 4+4 players around the box with open flanks since we can't cross?

Also, without Raki/Suarez, how will you defend corners against AM, english teams, Real etc?

I agree, 433 and our style is a good recipe against RM.
But what about AM, Bayern, Liverpool, Psg etc?

If you'll play 433 with Coutinho-Raki-Busi, we'll get murdered in a CL.
If you'll play 433 with Cou-Arthur-Busi, we'll look like 13 years old kids in defending.

So, please, give me some answers.

I am not worried about La Liga.
433 is usually good enough against tons of technically inferior teams in La Liga.

A million dollar question is: how to get past a 1/4 in a CL?
Barca has been knocked out in 4 quarters in the last 5 years.

Seems clear favourite.

Was excellent in his two stints at Olympiacos and last stint at Bilbao. No room for Arda/Gomes types in his teams. Hard work and passing accuracy is his mantra.

A little bit of hindsight