Gini Wijnaldum

BBZ8800

Senior Member
Poor Schalke will be playing in Bundeslia 2, so I'd like to think we'd beat them! Dortmund roll us over at Signal Iduna though, Haaland would destroy the defence.

I don't follow Bundesliga, it was just an example of random opponents like City had Dortmund and Monchengladbach this season.
We would win against those type of teams, even though, against Dortmund it is questionable.

But against any of top 10 sides mentioned in my previous post, it will be 80:20% chances for our opponents.
Messi 34, Aguero 33, no wings, no width, Mats the Frosty on goal, Lenglet in defense, Dest in defense lol, Busi covering counters and similar.

I won't even start to analyze a mental strength, lack of captains and a lack of that spark in younger superstars which led us to glory in the past on the wings of young/hungry superstar Ronnie&Etoo, young/hungry Goat Messi, young/hungry Neymar.

Instead of hungry/young superstars, we will have Messi 34 and Aguero 33.

Unless something crazy-lucky happens with our team, there is absolutely no logical way that this squad will offer something special in the next season.
I mean, the core will be even more older, more washed up and more mentally damaged. And we are fixing those holes with washed up Aguero and Wijnaldum, who not only are wahed up but also haven't played for us and it will take some time to learn the movement/chemistry and similar. By the time they'll fit in, Aguero will be 34, Messi 35.

So, CL wise, 90% likely scenario is: Titanic, episode 5 or whatever number it is already (Rome, Anfield, Bayern, Psg, anyone in 2022).
 

BBZ8800

Senior Member
PAIN.


btw even in that 14/15 season u didn't like Neymar at all and always complained about him

I didn't like Neymar then, I don't like him now, but compared to our current squad, who are so bad, Neymar sounds like someone who's name I should tattoo on my back.

This is why I also stopped talking bad about a current Messi.
Even though I am not too happy with his current overal level, but without him, we would be a few levels below, no matter how much flaws he has today (the same as in Suarez's case).

I mean, I was a fan and watching games in Gaspart's era, so I will survive easily for 5 years without trophies, if I survived back then, today it is less important factor in my life.
But I am still kinda shocked reading comments by some fans who are full of hope for new signings and for a new season.

Football is not maths, but some things can be predicted.
If we would put our team strength in numbers like in Fifa and videogames where skills range from 1 to 100, then imo, our overal strength in the next season will be even worse than today (or equal at best).
Why?

Let' say that we will get Gini who's skills are let's say 80.
But he won't be a starter, and if he will, he will still enter for Busi (??) who's skills were also around 80.
Not to mention that Busi knew our tactics and opponents, while Gini won't know anything.
The same will happen if he'll enter for Frenkie or Pedri.
So, on paper and in terms of overal skills, he is hardly an improvement over any midfielder.

Depay? The same.
He can't be better than Messi or Griezz.
Or at best, he might offer a slight improvement over Dembele, but still: he is new and doesn't have chemistry/knowledge about La Liga.

Aguero, the same. He is either worse or a slight improvement, but he won't be able to run for too long or for 90 minutes 2 times per week.

So, when you sum it all, we aren't getting too much improvement with new guys, yet, we are losing a lot of skills from Messi, Busi, Pique, Alba due to age.
So, if Messi's skills/stamina/physique drops from 90 to 80 or 85 in the next season (which is quite possible since he will be 34), that will be a bigger drop than what we will get from Aguero or Wijnaldum.
And again, not to mention Messi's mental health and motivation after another horrible season in 2020/21.

Everything is possible in football, but I would put my money that over 38 rounds, not too much will change compared to this season, when you take all the factors from the above into the account (age, motivation, new guys not knowing our tactics, Messi ageing fast).
 

Rory

Senior Member
I didn't like Neymar then, I don't like him now, but compared to our current squad, who are so bad, Neymar sounds like someone who's name I should tattoo on my back.

This is why I also stopped talking bad about a current Messi.
Even though I am not too happy with his current overal level, but without him, we would be a few levels below, no matter how much flaws he has today (the same as in Suarez's case).

I mean, I was a fan and watching games in Gaspart's era, so I will survive easily for 5 years without trophies, if I survived back then, today it is less important factor in my life.
But I am still kinda shocked reading comments by some fans who are full of hope for new signings and for a new season.

Football is not maths, but some things can be predicted.
If we would put our team strength in numbers like in Fifa and videogames where skills range from 1 to 100, then imo, our overal strength in the next season will be even worse than today (or equal at best).
Why?

Let' say that we will get Gini who's skills are let's say 80.
But he won't be a starter, and if he will, he will still enter for Busi (??) who's skills were also around 80.
Not to mention that Busi knew our tactics and opponents, while Gini won't know anything.
The same will happen if he'll enter for Frenkie or Pedri.
So, on paper and in terms of overal skills, he is hardly an improvement over any midfielder.

Depay? The same.
He can't be better than Messi or Griezz.
Or at best, he might offer a slight improvement over Dembele, but still: he is new and doesn't have chemistry/knowledge about La Liga.

Aguero, the same. He is either worse or a slight improvement, but he won't be able to run for too long or for 90 minutes 2 times per week.

So, when you sum it all, we aren't getting too much improvement with new guys, yet, we are losing a lot of skills from Messi, Busi, Pique, Alba due to age.
So, if Messi's skills/stamina/physique drops from 90 to 80 or 85 in the next season (which is quite possible since he will be 34), that will be a bigger drop than what we will get from Aguero or Wijnaldum.
And again, not to mention Messi's mental health and motivation after another horrible season in 2020/21.

Everything is possible in football, but I would put my money that over 38 rounds, not too much will change compared to this season, when you take all the factors from the above into the account (age, motivation, new guys not knowing our tactics, Messi ageing fast).

A lot more likely Wijnaldum takes to barca quickly due to Koeman and Frenkie. But if he doesn’t then yes the squad is not much improved by his signing for as long as he takes to get up to speed. Dembele has been here 4 years now is it? Still has no chemistry. Basically I wouldn’t be all doom and gloom over players maybe taking a long time to build chemistry when current options are already like this. To be conservative the current signings improve the forwards and midfield options by 10%-25% (hard to put a figure on it). If we had that much of an improvement this season we probably would have won the league. Maybe we’d win the UCL group and face porto round of 16. Domestic double and ? ucl sounds like a good season to me.
 

Interlop

Member
Let' say that we will get Gini who's skills are let's say 80.
But he won't be a starter, and if he will, he will still enter for Busi (??) who's skills were also around 80.
Not to mention that Busi knew our tactics and opponents, while Gini won't know anything.
The same will happen if he'll enter for Frenkie or Pedri.
So, on paper and in terms of overal skills, he is hardly an improvement over any midfielder.

Depay? The same.
He can't be better than Messi or Griezz.
Or at best, he might offer a slight improvement over Dembele, but still: he is new and doesn't have chemistry/knowledge about La Liga.

Aguero, the same. He is either worse or a slight improvement, but he won't be able to run for too long or for 90 minutes 2 times per week.

So, when you sum it all, we aren't getting too much improvement with new guys, yet, we are losing a lot of skills from Messi, Busi, Pique, Alba due to age.
So, if Messi's skills/stamina/physique drops from 90 to 80 or 85 in the next season (which is quite possible since he will be 34), that will be a bigger drop than what we will get from Aguero or Wijnaldum.
And again, not to mention Messi's mental health and motivation after another horrible season in 2020/21.

Everything is possible in football, but I would put my money that over 38 rounds, not too much will change compared to this season, when you take all the factors from the above into the account (age, motivation, new guys not knowing our tactics, Messi ageing fast).

I don’t think you understand the point. By your logic right now if we substitute Busquets we drop from 80 to like 50-60 with Pjanic. The same goes with Braithwaite. These are moves to improve our bench and be in some casual first 11s, take some minutes off Busi, Pedri, FDJ. We don’t have money for upgrades though. We cannot buy that 95 OVR player.
 

xxxxxx

Senior Member
So.... we're replacing a 33-year-old Suarez with a 33-year-old Aguero. We're also replacing a 31-year-old Rakitic with a 31-year-old Gini.

I'll let you decide which of those players is better.
 

DonAK

President of FC Barcelona
Don't mind this signing thinking about it now although would like an attacking CM the most tbh.
 

Messigician

Senior Member
Do not sign this useless and finished player. Not Barca calibre never has been.

Budget FC trying to turn us into the Spanish Everton
 

BBZ8800

Senior Member
I don’t think you understand the point. By your logic right now if we substitute Busquets we drop from 80 to like 50-60 with Pjanic. The same goes with Braithwaite. These are moves to improve our bench and be in some casual first 11s, take some minutes off Busi, Pedri, FDJ. We don’t have money for upgrades though. We cannot buy that 95 OVR player.

Ok.
He is good as one of 4 players for 3 midfield spots (as a rotation).

But... I still think that we could ask these questions:
1. why did we sold 33 years old Suarez, who knew the club and tactics and was usually scoring a lot?
=> to lose one season and play without a striker
=> only to buy a worse copy of Suarez one year later in Aguero?

2. or, the same:
Why did we got rid of 32 years old Rakitic, who could have been a decent 4th pick in midfield after playing 6 years at a club as the most used midfielder in that period (and had tons of chemistry with a team)?
Or getting rid of 33 years old Vidal, who also played here and had a chemistry?
=> only to change them for Pjanic, who never played in Spain and turned out to be a way inferior player for us than both Rakitic and Vidal?
=> and again, only to buy another similar player, this time in Wijnaldum, who is 31, without any expericence in Spain and in our system?

I would understand if we had 20M offers for Raki/Vidal/Suarez.
But we literally forced them out of a club, for free.
We are even paying a part of Surez's wages who is winning La Ligas for our opponents Atletico, lol.

These sales/new signings don't make any sense. Just a good, old Barca erratic, impulsive nonsense.

An analogy to Suarez/Aguero and Rakitic&Vidal/Pjanic&Wijnaldum would be:
1. to force Messi out of a club this summer
2. then play one season without Messi/a new leader
3. and then splashing 100M wages next summer on a 30 years old/washed up/injured Neymar

Selling Rakitic & Vidal made sense ONLY if we wanted:
1. to play more Pedri/Riki/Illaix and similar young players
2. or we would have bought some 26 years midfielders in their prime

But selling Rakitic & Vidal, who were not perfect, but who were still useful and had a chemistry with a team = and changing them for Pjanic who played 4 years at France and 9 years in Italy (lol) and Wijnaldum, who played 8 years at Holland and 6 years at EPL.

For example, let's try a simple test, out of a last few signings (in midfield and attack), which players clicked right away with our tactics, movement and teammates?
1. Dembele = still don't understand our tactics 4 years later
2. Coutinho = still struggles with fitting in after 3-4 years
3. Paulinho = never really clicked
4. Gomes = he was lost for the whole season with decoy runs
5. Denis = never clicked
6. Arthur = okish, but not good enough
7. Boateng = lost
8. Griezmann = still kinda lost
9. Malcom = meh
10. Turan = never clicked
11. Frenkie = he is still kinda lost in midfield and doesn't fully understands our system and movement
12. Pjanic = hasn't clicked

Basically, the only signings who clicked somewhat faster were Suarez, Rakitic and Vidal.
And we got rid of all of them and forced them out of a club due to being cancers and amigos, only to sign weaker players than them, who had less La Liga experience and who are as equally as physically washed up.

Regarding Wijnaldum, I don't mind him.
I actually like that type of physical/workhorse players.
I am just saying that this whole story over the last 2 summers makes zero sense.
Just a classical Barca's erratic selling/buying without too much long term planning.
** Younger fans who started to follow Barca during 2008-2012 used to though that we are organized club because we were spared from erratic buying in those years since we were blessed with Messi-Xavi-Busi-Iniesta, so there was no need for erratic buying.
But since the Neymar's sale, we have again turned into a classical Barca from 90s and early 00s, who used to buy 8-10 new players each summer, lol.

** a funny story from the past, in seasons 1997/98 and 1998/99, when Van Gaal was our manager in his first stint, he bought 13 players in the first 2 summers, buying 8 Dutch players in 18 Months, lol:
1997 summer: Gk Hesp, RB Reiziger
1997 winter: CB Bogarde
1998 summer: CF Kluivert, CM Cocu, LW Zenden
1998 winter: CB Frank De Boer, CM Ronald De Boer

I have just checked the number of transfers per season in the old times:
1995: 5 new players
1996: 8
1997: 8
1998: 7
1999: 4
2000: 6
2001: 8
2002: 4
2003: 7
2004: 10
2005: 2
2006: 3
2007: 5
2008: 7
2009: 4
2010: 4
2011: 2
2012: 2
2013: 1
2014: 7
2015: 2
2016: 6
2017: 7
2018: 9
2019: 6
2020: 4

Look at how the list was crazy with a lot of signings in 90s and until 2005.
Then we consolidated a team in 2004/05 and 2005/06 with a core of Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol, Valdes, young Messi plus a few foreign gems like Ronnie, Etoo, Marquez.
And then due to Xavi-Iniesta-Messi-Puyol and later Busi, we didn't have to buy too much from 2005 to 2014.
Then when Puyol and Valdes left and when Xavi and Iniesta got older, we needed to buy again, and our signings were always quite horrible with around of 30% of players staying at a club for more than 1-2 years.

This is why I say that Suarez for Aguero and Raki-Vidal for Pjanic-Wijnaldum is a good old Barca's erratic transfer nonsense.
Just buying and selling like madman.
 
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malvolio

Senior Member
We getting a washed up system player under Klopp. That's what we're getting. Reality will hit hard next season if we don't get at least 2 smart transfers. Changing rejects from our team with free rejects from others is not the way forward.
 

Birdy

Senior Member
Imagine thinking a player that was starter and basic wheel of a team that won EPL and UCL the last 3 years is a reject...
:facepalm:
 

Catta

Senior Member
Wijnaldum is the definition of average, offers nothing in any of the 3 midfield position Barca uses. Should have just kept Rakitic.
 

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