Jadon Sancho

[MTL_Barca]

This post is just basically a way of saying why you think Messi is the GOAT and trying to belittle Ronaldo in some way.

If you think Messi is the GOAT that's fair enough, but this is the Barcelona forum so many will think that on here. I will say though Ronaldo has won the same number of Ballon d'Or's as Messi so if this guy as won the same amount of Ballon d'Or's (and broke more individual records) as this GOAT (in your view) in the same era than surely he must be up there too?

And there's more to Ronaldo's game than goals, he won the Ballon d'Or at United as flare player (a Neymar type player). How he transformed his game in his 30's and went on to win the amount of Ballon d'Or's he has during this stage of his career is nothing short of incredible, it's a feat no other player as done in 140 years or so in football, so to say there's a player who may go on to do that right now (Mbappe) and who is only 20 years of age (start of his career) and not finished in the top3 of a Ballon d'Or yet, never mind won it is a bold statement.

The point was more about the difference in style and not who i think is "better". I think no matter who people prefer most would probably agree on Messi having more natural "talent" than Ronaldo. So just based on that it seems more likely to me to see someone like another Real Madrid Ronaldo = very athletic, clinical scorer type of player. Not necessarily with his consistency but as i said for a couple of seasons it doesn't seem THAT unlikely. Still doesn't mean it's easy of course, just that Messi seems more like an anomaly than Ronaldo. And when saying more likely i don't mean like every other season, just in comparison.

Regarding Mbappe, yeah of course he's still far far far away from Ronaldo. He's just the first that came to mind for someone who could maybe be the next "best player in the world" after CR/Messi era and i'd say he's a lot closer to Ronaldo. And IF (very big if obviously) he can keep it up he could actually get to these numbers as well, doesn't seem too unthinkable considering he's just 20 (soon to be 21) years old and already an established starter for PSG and a world cup winner.

But that's just my take on it, feel free to disagree.

 

[Copperpot]

I think no matter who people prefer most would probably agree on Messi having more natural "talent" than Ronaldo.

Fair enough, i wouldn't agree on that at all though. I look at many different aspects of play in football, not just the main things (dribbling/skill/shooting/speed etc), Ronaldo proved he was the best as a flare player and proved himself as the best as a predator infront of goal, Ronaldo won his 1st Ballon d'Or as a totally different player to the Ronaldo who won his 6th, showing different aspects of football over the years, whereas Messi as always stayed fairly consistent who he was as a youngster and who he is now.

Dribbling wise only Maradona can compare to Messi in the history of the game.

I believe Ronaldo is the best player in the history of the game, certainly the best I've ever seen, but as said i can see arguments for all 4 and i have no problems with those who say Messi, the guy as been amazing over the years.

 

[Batistuta9]

Fair enough, i wouldn't agree on that at all though. I look at many different aspects of play in football, not just the main things (dribbling/skill/shooting/speed etc), Ronaldo proved he was the best as a flare player and proved himself as the best as a predator infront of goal, Ronaldo won his 1st Ballon d'Or as a totally different player to the Ronaldo who won his 6th, showing different aspects of football over the years, whereas Messi as always stayed fairly consistent who he was as a youngster and who he is now.

Dribbling wise only Maradona can compare to Messi in the history of the game.

I believe Ronaldo is the best player in the history of the game, certainly the best I've ever seen, but as said i can see arguments for all 4 and i have no problems with those who say Messi, the guy as been amazing over the years.

For me, the only category that Ronaldo can be compared to messi is goal scoring and messi has 6 golden boots to 4. No disrespect to Ronaldo, he has had an amazing career, one of the best in the history of the game, but messi is just better. He is the best dribbler, playmaker and goal scorer rolled into 1 player. Not Zidane, R9, Maradona or Pele were the best at 3 different categories, but only messi is and has been for a decade.

 

[Copperpot]

For me, the only category that Ronaldo can be compared to messi is goal scoring and messi has 6 golden boots to 4. No disrespect to Ronaldo, he has had an amazing career, one of the best in the history of the game, but messi is just better. He is the best dribbler, playmaker and goal scorer rolled into 1 player. Not Zidane, R9, Maradona or Pele were the best at 3 different categories, but only messi is and has been for a decade.

There's arguments Ronaldo as won Ballon d'Or's in different leagues, influenced his club to win the Champions League at different clubs (United/Madrid), proved himself at international level, won silverware at international level, influenced his team to more Champions Leagues overall, won league titles in the 3 main leagues (Spain/England/Italy), won more individual records, including being the alltime Champions League top scorer, whereas Messi as never jumped shipped at club level, always been at Barcelona, with the same club mentality and style of play.

The only other shirt people have saw Messi in is an Argentina shirt and he gets a huge amount of criticism, scored his first goal for Argentina vs Brazil this month for the first time in 2 years i believe.

I'm probably opening a can of worms by saying that (especially on a Barcelona forum), but these arguments have been done on the internet (and in person) for years and people have and will always have different opinions on who is the best.

 

[Batistuta9]

There's arguments Ronaldo as won Ballon d'Or's in different leagues, influenced his club to win the Champions League at different clubs (United/Madrid), proved himself at international level, won silverware at international level, influenced his team to more Champions Leagues overall, won league titles in the 3 main leagues (Spain/England/Italy), won more individual records, including being the alltime Champions League top scorer, whereas Messi as never jumped shipped at club level, always been at Barcelona, with the same club mentality and style of play.

The only other shirt people have saw Messi in is an Argentina shirt and he gets a huge amount of criticism, scored his first goal for Argentina vs Brazil this month for the first time in 2 years i believe.

I'm probably opening a can of worms by saying that (especially on a Barcelona forum), but these arguments have been done on the internet (and person) for years and people have and will always have different opinions on who is the best.

Messi is loyal to Barcelona and loves the club and doesn't have a reason to leave. About playing in different leagues, I'm pretty sure if messi played for man utd under fergie, real Madrid and juventus he would win with those clubs. Its not like Ronaldo won with Tottenham, valencia and napoli. He has lost 2 copa america finals on penalties and a world Cup final in extra time, the only thing lacking was a bit of luck, which all winning teams need. Ronaldo didn't even have to play the majority of the euro 2016 final and they still won

 

[jamrock]

Messi is better okay just don't argue the point it's a waste of time, there is about 20-30 percent of people who will think Ronaldo is better, nothing you can do about that

 

[Copperpot]

Ronaldo didn't even have to play the majority of the euro 2016 final and they still won

Did his part in the other rounds though, what your also not taking into account is Portugal had no right winning Euro 2016, other than Ronaldo in their team it was like Leicester winning the Premier League, possibly an even bigger achievement as that squad had zero quality.

Along with Messi, Argentina have players like Dybala/Di Maria/Aguero at their disposal, on paper (over the years) they are the 1st or 2nd best team in the Americas, they should be winning Copa America.

 

[Batistuta9]

Did his part in the other rounds though, what your also not taking into account is Portugal had no right winning Euro 2016, other than Ronaldo in their team it was like Leicester winning the Premier League, possibly an even bigger achievement as that squad had zero quality.

Along with Messi, Argentina have players like Dybala/Di Maria/Aguero at their disposal, on paper (over the years) they are the 1st or 2nd best team in the Americas, they should be winning Copa America.

As jamrock said there is no point arguing as nothing I say will change your mind and nothing you say will change my mind but come on man, "the Portugal squad had zero quality" . You're acting like Ronaldo won the tournament by himself. Santos is a good defensive coach, pepe was one of the best players in the tournament, eder came up with a golazo in the final and everyone did their role. They were lucky though, qualified from their group by coming 3rd.

 

[Judoman]

There's arguments Ronaldo as won Ballon d'Or's in different leagues, influenced his club to win the Champions League at different clubs (United/Madrid), proved himself at international level, won silverware at international level, influenced his team to more Champions Leagues overall, won league titles in the 3 main leagues (Spain/England/Italy), won more individual records, including being the alltime Champions League top scorer, whereas Messi as never jumped shipped at club level, always been at Barcelona, with the same club mentality and style of play.

The only other shirt people have saw Messi in is an Argentina shirt and he gets a huge amount of criticism, scored his first goal for Argentina vs Brazil this month for the first time in 2 years i believe.

I'm probably opening a can of worms by saying that (especially on a Barcelona forum), but these arguments have been done on the internet (and in person) for years and people have and will always have different opinions on who is the best.

You can believe what you will, but if you d like to check facts watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=569&v=D2UT1AmyZFE

 

[Sorin]

The argument of doing it in different leagues is one of the more asinine things written in favour of CRonaldo. The likes of Maldini, Bekenbauer, Pele are utter frauds by that measure. The fact that he played for the 3 biggest clubs in each country and hasn't overcome shit is completely lost on them.

I'm not going to write on this anymore since it's futile since I don't even consider CRonaldo in the same tier with Maradona, Pele and Messi, so yeah.

 

[KingLeo10]

The argument of doing it in different leagues is one of the more asinine things written in favour of CRonaldo. The likes of Maldini, Bekenbauer, Pele are utter frauds by that measure. The fact that he played for the 3 biggest clubs in each country and hasn't overcome shit is completely lost on them.

I'm not going to write on this anymore since it's futile since I don't even consider CRonaldo in the same tier with Maradona, Pele and Messi, so yeah.

I've been arguing this for a while now. United were the best team in England and top 3 in the world for much of CR7's tenure at United. RM was only relatively weak in 09-10 in CR7's first season but stacked otherwise all the other years. While Juve isn't out and out strong right now, they're still formidable. It's not like the dude is joining Napoli, Chelsea, or AM and lifting them to titles.

Messi had an extraordinary support cast from 08-12 and 14-15, true. But he's also had to deal with some poor (by elite standards) squads in 12-13, 17-18, 18-19, and maybe even 13-14.

Manager wise, it's not even comparable. SAF, Jose, Ancelotti, Zidane for CR7 versus Pep, Rijkaard, and Lucho for Messi.

 

[serghei]

As jamrock said there is no point arguing as nothing I say will change your mind and nothing you say will change my mind but come on man, "the Portugal squad had zero quality" . You're acting like Ronaldo won the tournament by himself. Santos is a good defensive coach, pepe was one of the best players in the tournament, eder came up with a golazo in the final and everyone did their role. They were lucky though, qualified from their group by coming 3rd.

Ronaldo is the more efficient scorer in the big games. This is important and one of the reasons Madrid won 4 CLs in the last 6 years.

You can't just ignore that. Ronaldo is the better striker, Messi is the better player.

 

[KingLeo10]

Ronaldo is the more efficient scorer in the big games. This is important and one of the reasons Madrid won 4 CLs in the last 6 years.

Effective, not efficient. He's got a much more varied arsenal and takes a lot more shots (which isn't bad because you have to get into good position to take those shots).

All of his KO goals last season were headers or PKs. That's such a lethal weapon to have if your only objective is winning. Barca's usually had an obligation to also play illustrious football while winning.

 

[serghei]

Effective, not efficient. He's got a much more varied arsenal and takes a lot more shots (which isn't bad because you have to get into good position to take those shots).

Effective if you wish.

 

[Batistuta9]

Ronaldo is the more efficient scorer in the big games. This is important and one of the reasons Madrid won 4 CLs in the last 6 years.

You can't just ignore that. Ronaldo is the better striker, Messi is the better player.

You can say that, but you can still argue against it. Ronaldo has 1 role, to score goals. If you look at messi under pep, he was better than Ronaldo in the big games, as his main role was to be the killer, the goalscorer. As time has gone on, the barca team has become weaker and messi has had to take more responsibility. Against the better teams, our midfield in the past 3 or 4 years has had very low creativity. For this reason, messi becomes our main creator in those games, but there isn't anyone to finish the chances he creates, which is exactly what happened in the 2nd leg at anfield