Jose Mourinho

Status
Not open for further replies.

Raed

Dr. Raed St. Claire
+

This whole "Saint Iker" this and that is all hot air. Plenty of comments that prove that. Old and new. Whether or not him being the mate of Xavi or not, LOL. Xabi Alonso is a great friend of Xavi as well. Still a prick.

Mind you, Iker is still a nice character. But that's not what it is all about. He WAS also a very great goalkeeper. He is not anymore and that will show next season should he regain his place under a new manager.



Why am I being deluded? For stating the facts and for not falling for all the Mourinho bashing here that is mostly limited to my fellow Barcelona fans for very obvious reasons? My opinion is shared by many madridistas in Spain. The point is that being a legend does not equal to immunity.

Now when it is clear that Mourinho is leaving the mess that is RM, it is much easier to blame him for everything when it was clear all season long that Casillas was the stitch and the destructive part in the conflict. Purely for selfish reasons. No other such conflict has ever taken during Mourinho's hugely successful managerial career.

A club legend and one of the most respected football personalities (Zanetti) just confirmed that more or less. Are you going to accuse him of "dark ants" as well?

Can't you see that Mourinho has tried to change the structures of a failed organization/system that is RM? Obviously figures such as Valdano who represented that rotten culture were not going to like those changes since he has been well-known for underlying the role of the manager. This goes far back in time than just Mourinho's tenure. All the RM managers, apart from Mourinho (only due to his immense credentials and personality) have been mere puppets without the acquired influence to create stability at RM.

Mourinho was the only manager, since Del Bosque who managed to pull RM in some kind of cohesive direction. Tried to change the rotten aspects at the club despite immense pressure from the xenophobic Spanish media and figures such as Valdano who constantly tried to undermine Mourinho.

Let's face it. Iker has not performed particularly well while López has sealed his place. Deservedly so. Iker has simply not played well enough to say that he is untouchable.

Anyway why should I even care? At the end of the day Mourinho's exit is not going to help RM and for all I care Iker could continue at RM as the starting goalkeeper for another decade since it would only be in FCB's interest IMO.

Everyone in the squad tired or JM? You mean only this season after it was known that he would be gone and that he did not want to waste his time in a destructive environment and in country where even his children where insulted for simply being the children of Mourinho.

In the first two seasons the RM players where willing to give everything for him. His results were great and he improved the team in every single department especially on the European scene which has been the priority of RM for 10 straight years. He turned them from European nobodies to 3 times straight CL-semifinal participants and no sane person can argue against such achievements.

All during an era where we had complete hegemony until he arrived.

Even if we assume that Mourinho is the evil man that most Barcelona fans here yell (as expected BTW) then there is no way that Iker is the innocent "saint" that you try to pull him off as. No way. Especially not since it is well-known that was the stitch all season long.

Great captain, ah?

You arguments so full of holes it is not even funny. You are attacking Casillas as if Casillas forced himself to play, which he hasn't. The only thing Casillas was guilty of was saying 'this situation is new to me'. All the criticism Casillas is getting is because his fans love him so much, howeveer he hasn't said anything.

Also, Valdano part of a rotten culture? Valdano who set up the club since the 90s is rotten? Xenophobic spanish media? Now you are creating stories? Capello puppet? Del Bosque Puppet? Schuster puppet? Though you are right, those who insulted Mourinho's children deserve to be jailed.

Mourinho's success was met with Mourinho's failure the following year in an easy league. Sorry bro, he can't handle his own success because it came off a very heated prior season that it burnt him and his team. He isn't one for the ages and while I believe that if he stays long enough he would win the CL but it would require a massive ovehaul, not even Real Madrid cannot afford. Real Madrid granted him all the power and what has he done with it? Delivered a league and threw away the following one, why is it that three semi finals are a success but a league loss is not a failure? ...ta fuck?
 

spark

New member
The fact that this is the liveliest thread is amazing and nothing short of spectacular, everyone has Mourinho fever. I have yet to come across anyone in the world of football that has attracted more attention. Simply, wow.

Anyway, the pretext of the arguments that are pro Mourinho unfortunately are not true no matter how solid Mourinho's arguments may sound like, but simply, they are fabricated because the problem isn't being discussed properly. Mourinho's failure do not stop at his dealing with Casillas and his issue extends way beyond that. Mourinho and Casillas didn't have an issue, until Mourinho felt betrayed by Spain's National Team Captain for calling Xavi and settling the score.

A gesture from Casillas that was widely accepted and appreciated from all corners of Spain. Mourinho tried to strain a social and sporting sporting issue that has plagued Spain for years and have been able to over come in the past decade thanks for Aragones and the willingness of the Spanish people.

Mourinho's success largely depends on raising tension for his tactics to work, and it took him a while to raise to the tension in Real Madrid because the players were relectant and were not at ease with it. What was competitive became personal, what was tense became ugly and what was cheeky became dirty. The whole mood in Madrid was darkened. He complained and got his way, Madrid budged in and cleared the way for him by removing Valdano from the spot.

At this point Mourinho didn't have any problems with players and by the end of the 2011 season he was campaigning for Casillas to be ballon d'or winner. So his first season ended behind Barcelona, behind Pellegrinis Madrid but in the semi finals. Controversial calls in favor of Barcelona and the lack of initiative from Madrid saw his team finish with a Copa del Rey. At this point one was being sympathetic, one was being hopeful, that Mourinho's second seasons were always better.

Now for second season, he has gotten his way and he removed the slick suit and put on his track suit, a new approach and a new style. Mourinho formulated a team that did anything possible to win over Barcelona and succeeded, as well as registering the mightiest league campaign with a win over Barcelona away. That was epic but tensions were high, blood was boiling and relationships damaged, and with it some players as well. Details aside, had Mourinho been tactically less predictable and been slightly more adventurous he would have probably beaten Bayern but it wasn't meant to. He drove away Pep, he had the league all to himself. He still didn't have any issue with anyone but by that point he had alianted the entire media and has treated them like trash.

While his treatment of the media in many cases based on actual facts, he was completely in wrong for not being diplomatic, and he had no need to pick a fight with them. His handling of the media was piss poor and that resulted in a massive war against him and which drained him and his team. The strain on the team was all but evident and the players had enough.

The way the season started no body understood what was going on, his throw away of the league to Tito was absolutely shambolic and an absolute failure and to protect himself, he half sarcastically claimed responsibility and this is where it started to go downhill very quickly. His comments such as 'when the team wins, it is the players, when the team loses it is my fault', 'I claim all responsibility for not motivating the team' were not very well respected in Spain and most certainly in the capital because no one believed him. He quickly denounced the league for the sake of the '10th' and his problems which he had kept a lid on all along where surfacing faster than he can manage and the biggest problem was that the media was anxiously waiting because of the prior two years, on which they capitalized on mercilessly.

His behavior was that less than adequate for Madrid's stature and that Ramos and Casillas were saving face and their refusal to join the circus show was the second time Mourinho felt betrayed. His jealousy towards the World champions were evident by his comments towards Casillas saying he is far too protected. Sure, he was protected but why pick a fight with Casillas? A fight that he was always going to lose? The club saved his ass by acting promptly and purchasing Diego Lopez, and please do not forget his total melt down mid season and his flirting with other clubs but Perez check mated him. He never allowed him an excuse and kept him in his position to claim all responsibility for everything and even though Mourinho wanted out, and the club forced him to stay because they know better, they backed him in a corner and the only way for him forward was actually forward he drove the club to the semis. Had Mourinho gotten his way, he wouldn't be bragging about a 3rd year 3 CL semi finals. Along the way he piicked a fight with Torill for a strange reason and if he had an issue with the club's set up vertically, as in the club did not properly set the youth team directly as a feeder club to the first team he did nothing to solve the issue but to address it in public, a massive blow to the youth team's moral and whatever harmony the club was enjoying.

So while many thing that he has broken the hegemony that Barcelona enjoyed, and while that many feel he has succeeded in bringing Madrid to proper European heights, one must understand that he has failed where others did as well, and his contribution to the club was exaggerated by him because of the unfortunate case of Madrid fans being divided right now. His fans want him out because they don't want him dealing with Madrid and those who either hate him or dislike him want him out because they cannot stand him and this is the only thing that unites the fans around Mourinho, that they both want him out, and so does he.

While the players shoulder the blame for not being fit and for being lazy, and Casillas having his form drop, he most certainly didn't create a long lasting powerful team because right after his win, he has failed. He gambled on the CL and he lost. And this wraps up his tenure at Madrid. Missed opportunities and a ton of drama, Mourinho lost the war on both fronts, on the pitch and the mic wars. Both wars he started.

But to wrap all this up and in very short...the problem isn't Casillas, nor is it Pepe, or Ramos, or Ronaldo, or Benzema or Higuain or who ever, the problem is simple, has Mourinho delivered? No? k, thanks bye, move on. He doesn't want to be on board, and we won't stand in his way. He has nothing to worry about, he is 45 million richer anyway, that should be enough to cover the ikea boxes.

Wow I disagree with a few minor things (driving away Pep, throwing away the league) but I enjoyed this post. Someone that can see through the façade :beer2:
 

Beast

The Observer
Walls of text alert :satorra:


Iker is in Mou's bad books for the simple reason he had clear the air meetings with Xavi and co. when Mou wanted everything to be a war. Xavi's father confirmed that Mou wanted Iker to end their friendship. Anyone taking anything Mou says at face value deserves to be misled.He says what he needs to when it is convenient. Which is why every club he has coached has had the best ________ "inesert player and position". The man once called Cristiano bad educated when he was the enemy at Manchester. Lampard and Drogba were the best. Ibra was the best.


Iker was the best ... http://www.as.com/futbol/video/mourinho-decia-casillas-era-mejor/20130507dasdasftb_6/Ves :lol:

The fact that this is the liveliest thread is amazing and nothing short of spectacular, everyone has Mourinho fever. I have yet to come across anyone in the world of football that has attracted more attention. Simply, wow.

Anyway, the pretext of the arguments that are pro Mourinho unfortunately are not true no matter how solid Mourinho's arguments may sound like, but simply, they are fabricated because the problem isn't being discussed properly. Mourinho's failure do not stop at his dealing with Casillas and his issue extends way beyond that. Mourinho and Casillas didn't have an issue, until Mourinho felt betrayed by Spain's National Team Captain for calling Xavi and settling the score.

A gesture from Casillas that was widely accepted and appreciated from all corners of Spain. Mourinho tried to strain a social and sporting sporting issue that has plagued Spain for years and have been able to over come in the past decade thanks for Aragones and the willingness of the Spanish people.

Mourinho's success largely depends on raising tension for his tactics to work, and it took him a while to raise to the tension in Real Madrid because the players were relectant and were not at ease with it. What was competitive became personal, what was tense became ugly and what was cheeky became dirty. The whole mood in Madrid was darkened. He complained and got his way, Madrid budged in and cleared the way for him by removing Valdano from the spot.

At this point Mourinho didn't have any problems with players and by the end of the 2011 season he was campaigning for Casillas to be ballon d'or winner. So his first season ended behind Barcelona, behind Pellegrinis Madrid but in the semi finals. Controversial calls in favor of Barcelona and the lack of initiative from Madrid saw his team finish with a Copa del Rey. At this point one was being sympathetic, one was being hopeful, that Mourinho's second seasons were always better.

Now for second season, he has gotten his way and he removed the slick suit and put on his track suit, a new approach and a new style. Mourinho formulated a team that did anything possible to win over Barcelona and succeeded, as well as registering the mightiest league campaign with a win over Barcelona away. That was epic but tensions were high, blood was boiling and relationships damaged, and with it some players as well. Details aside, had Mourinho been tactically less predictable and been slightly more adventurous he would have probably beaten Bayern but it wasn't meant to. He drove away Pep, he had the league all to himself. He still didn't have any issue with anyone but by that point he had alianted the entire media and has treated them like trash.

While his treatment of the media in many cases based on actual facts, he was completely in wrong for not being diplomatic, and he had no need to pick a fight with them. His handling of the media was piss poor and that resulted in a massive war against him and which drained him and his team. The strain on the team was all but evident and the players had enough.

The way the season started no body understood what was going on, his throw away of the league to Tito was absolutely shambolic and an absolute failure and to protect himself, he half sarcastically claimed responsibility and this is where it started to go downhill very quickly. His comments such as 'when the team wins, it is the players, when the team loses it is my fault', 'I claim all responsibility for not motivating the team' were not very well respected in Spain and most certainly in the capital because no one believed him. He quickly denounced the league for the sake of the '10th' and his problems which he had kept a lid on all along where surfacing faster than he can manage and the biggest problem was that the media was anxiously waiting because of the prior two years, on which they capitalized on mercilessly.

His behavior was that less than adequate for Madrid's stature and that Ramos and Casillas were saving face and their refusal to join the circus show was the second time Mourinho felt betrayed. His jealousy towards the World champions were evident by his comments towards Casillas saying he is far too protected. Sure, he was protected but why pick a fight with Casillas? A fight that he was always going to lose? The club saved his ass by acting promptly and purchasing Diego Lopez, and please do not forget his total melt down mid season and his flirting with other clubs but Perez check mated him. He never allowed him an excuse and kept him in his position to claim all responsibility for everything and even though Mourinho wanted out, and the club forced him to stay because they know better, they backed him in a corner and the only way for him forward was actually forward he drove the club to the semis. Had Mourinho gotten his way, he wouldn't be bragging about a 3rd year 3 CL semi finals. Along the way he piicked a fight with Torill for a strange reason and if he had an issue with the club's set up vertically, as in the club did not properly set the youth team directly as a feeder club to the first team he did nothing to solve the issue but to address it in public, a massive blow to the youth team's moral and whatever harmony the club was enjoying.

So while many thing that he has broken the hegemony that Barcelona enjoyed, and while that many feel he has succeeded in bringing Madrid to proper European heights, one must understand that he has failed where others did as well, and his contribution to the club was exaggerated by him because of the unfortunate case of Madrid fans being divided right now. His fans want him out because they don't want him dealing with Madrid and those who either hate him or dislike him want him out because they cannot stand him and this is the only thing that unites the fans around Mourinho, that they both want him out, and so does he.

While the players shoulder the blame for not being fit and for being lazy, and Casillas having his form drop, he most certainly didn't create a long lasting powerful team because right after his win, he has failed. He gambled on the CL and he lost. And this wraps up his tenure at Madrid. Missed opportunities and a ton of drama, Mourinho lost the war on both fronts, on the pitch and the mic wars. Both wars he started.

But to wrap all this up and in very short...the problem isn't Casillas, nor is it Pepe, or Ramos, or Ronaldo, or Benzema or Higuain or who ever, the problem is simple, has Mourinho delivered? No? k, thanks bye, move on. He doesn't want to be on board, and we won't stand in his way. He has nothing to worry about, he is 45 million richer anyway, that should be enough to cover the ikea boxes.

The above two posts...

Duc , you being a fan of JM is something and falling for his "It's them not me " is another thing

everyone and his dog know the real reason why Iker fell with Jose (and did Ramos ) it was the Xavi-Puyol thing .... Ramos stood by his team mates when they fell from Jose good books earlier this season (Ozil shirt etc )

the problem is Jose tried but he never came down to understand the RM atmosphere & culture and comparing the club with Inter & Chelsea is laughable (and i'm an Inter fan )
Real won more in any decade than Inter did in any decade in the last 40 years ..ditto for Cheslea so when you come down to coach players who know their club history and already WC & Euro winners you need to know they are already winners without your divine intervention

He is an excellent manager a top 3 manager , but he is too stubborn for his own good and i'm sure in the future if he ever comes back to coach Real he would win a lot more than he did in his last 3 years but he did make a lot of mistakes and the club was smart to make him the first football manager (England style ) last year for the first time in our history so he take all the blame for any failed transfer or lack off

however diverting the blame on others is pity act and we don't have a memory of a fish , he was calling for Iker to be the WPOY 1.5 year ago suddenly it's "I should have bought Diego lopez after the first year " lol.. ok
mind you Iker was in bad form this year and Diego deserved to start but we don't know if Iker regained form or not because he didn't play him till now .. and Iker has been on top for almost 12 years now we all know he has the talent so a drop in form is a temp thing as i don't believe he is finished but Iker is also the club captain and if Jose did that with Zanetti in Inter he would suffer the same issues
He is still adored by a section of the ultras because he wind you up a lot and that's always good in the ultra's book but that's about it

If Jose is blamed it's because

1- he has full authority (as given and requested )
2- he asked to be blamed (quoted several times )
And most importantly
3- he actually is to be blamed for the following reason

when you play off form players because you like them it's your fault (Pepe & Di Maria ) , when you have full control of transfers and you decide to send Carvajal to Leverkusen when you know you have an issue in the RB it's your fault , when the strikers lose form and you continue to ride of CR form instead of doing special training regime for them it is also your fault , when your player come back from injury over weight (Marcelo ) when previous manager like Capello used to give hefty fines for any 0.5 a kilo increase ever after the players come back from a break /vacation it is your fault , when you can see that Pepe is way off from (Galatasary second leg ) and you insist on playing him ahead of other CB (Albiol ) in a crunch game and he cause 4 goals and you still keep him on the pitch it is your fault

He did well overall but not enough to keep him as he still insist on his tactics which is now exposed and the club needs new tactical approach

As for Valdano point that's a big ass Lol .. you don't know what you are talking about here
 

Poor_Sunyol

In Lucho we trust!
Yay! A proper football discussion! Unfortunately you have covered all the points I was going to make. Well done to Duc, Raed and Gio for some great posts. Nice to read actually and I have to say that I agree whole heartedly with Raed on this. Mou fell out with Casillas purely on non-football grounds. I think Gio and I wrote some long posts about Mou and the likelihood of him failing at Madrid some years ago when he was announced that he was taking over. Fortunately for Barca, he has turned out to be a failure and has left Madrid with a big rebuilding project. Which is timely as we have to go through one ourselves.
 

Stric

New member
The fact that this is the liveliest thread is amazing and nothing short of spectacular, everyone has Mourinho fever. I have yet to come across anyone in the world of football that has attracted more attention. Simply, wow.

Anyway, the pretext of the arguments that are pro Mourinho unfortunately are not true no matter how solid Mourinho's arguments may sound like, but simply, they are fabricated because the problem isn't being discussed properly. Mourinho's failure do not stop at his dealing with Casillas and his issue extends way beyond that. Mourinho and Casillas didn't have an issue, until Mourinho felt betrayed by Spain's National Team Captain for calling Xavi and settling the score.

A gesture from Casillas that was widely accepted and appreciated from all corners of Spain. Mourinho tried to strain a social and sporting sporting issue that has plagued Spain for years and have been able to over come in the past decade thanks for Aragones and the willingness of the Spanish people.

Mourinho's success largely depends on raising tension for his tactics to work, and it took him a while to raise to the tension in Real Madrid because the players were relectant and were not at ease with it. What was competitive became personal, what was tense became ugly and what was cheeky became dirty. The whole mood in Madrid was darkened. He complained and got his way, Madrid budged in and cleared the way for him by removing Valdano from the spot.

At this point Mourinho didn't have any problems with players and by the end of the 2011 season he was campaigning for Casillas to be ballon d'or winner. So his first season ended behind Barcelona, behind Pellegrinis Madrid but in the semi finals. Controversial calls in favor of Barcelona and the lack of initiative from Madrid saw his team finish with a Copa del Rey. At this point one was being sympathetic, one was being hopeful, that Mourinho's second seasons were always better.

Now for second season, he has gotten his way and he removed the slick suit and put on his track suit, a new approach and a new style. Mourinho formulated a team that did anything possible to win over Barcelona and succeeded, as well as registering the mightiest league campaign with a win over Barcelona away. That was epic but tensions were high, blood was boiling and relationships damaged, and with it some players as well. Details aside, had Mourinho been tactically less predictable and been slightly more adventurous he would have probably beaten Bayern but it wasn't meant to. He drove away Pep, he had the league all to himself. He still didn't have any issue with anyone but by that point he had alianted the entire media and has treated them like trash.

While his treatment of the media in many cases based on actual facts, he was completely in wrong for not being diplomatic, and he had no need to pick a fight with them. His handling of the media was piss poor and that resulted in a massive war against him and which drained him and his team. The strain on the team was all but evident and the players had enough.

The way the season started no body understood what was going on, his throw away of the league to Tito was absolutely shambolic and an absolute failure and to protect himself, he half sarcastically claimed responsibility and this is where it started to go downhill very quickly. His comments such as 'when the team wins, it is the players, when the team loses it is my fault', 'I claim all responsibility for not motivating the team' were not very well respected in Spain and most certainly in the capital because no one believed him. He quickly denounced the league for the sake of the '10th' and his problems which he had kept a lid on all along where surfacing faster than he can manage and the biggest problem was that the media was anxiously waiting because of the prior two years, on which they capitalized on mercilessly.

His behavior was that less than adequate for Madrid's stature and that Ramos and Casillas were saving face and their refusal to join the circus show was the second time Mourinho felt betrayed. His jealousy towards the World champions were evident by his comments towards Casillas saying he is far too protected. Sure, he was protected but why pick a fight with Casillas? A fight that he was always going to lose? The club saved his ass by acting promptly and purchasing Diego Lopez, and please do not forget his total melt down mid season and his flirting with other clubs but Perez check mated him. He never allowed him an excuse and kept him in his position to claim all responsibility for everything and even though Mourinho wanted out, and the club forced him to stay because they know better, they backed him in a corner and the only way for him forward was actually forward he drove the club to the semis. Had Mourinho gotten his way, he wouldn't be bragging about a 3rd year 3 CL semi finals. Along the way he piicked a fight with Torill for a strange reason and if he had an issue with the club's set up vertically, as in the club did not properly set the youth team directly as a feeder club to the first team he did nothing to solve the issue but to address it in public, a massive blow to the youth team's moral and whatever harmony the club was enjoying.

So while many thing that he has broken the hegemony that Barcelona enjoyed, and while that many feel he has succeeded in bringing Madrid to proper European heights, one must understand that he has failed where others did as well, and his contribution to the club was exaggerated by him because of the unfortunate case of Madrid fans being divided right now. His fans want him out because they don't want him dealing with Madrid and those who either hate him or dislike him want him out because they cannot stand him and this is the only thing that unites the fans around Mourinho, that they both want him out, and so does he.

While the players shoulder the blame for not being fit and for being lazy, and Casillas having his form drop, he most certainly didn't create a long lasting powerful team because right after his win, he has failed. He gambled on the CL and he lost. And this wraps up his tenure at Madrid. Missed opportunities and a ton of drama, Mourinho lost the war on both fronts, on the pitch and the mic wars. Both wars he started.

But to wrap all this up and in very short...the problem isn't Casillas, nor is it Pepe, or Ramos, or Ronaldo, or Benzema or Higuain or who ever, the problem is simple, has Mourinho delivered? No? k, thanks bye, move on. He doesn't want to be on board, and we won't stand in his way. He has nothing to worry about, he is 45 million richer anyway, that should be enough to cover the ikea boxes.

tumblr_m573cm446k1rtjw1mo1_250.gif
 

khorne

New member
I don't really mind mourinho, as long as there is a healthy distance between him and barca. if we play him two times a year in the champions league, that's fine. I don't think he is an evil or despicable person, and if his approach to coaching is that his first and foremost responsibility is the success of the club, at the cost of any decent human relationships, that's legitimate too. clubs know exactly what they're buying into when they sign mourinho.
trouble is, he didn't deliver any success at madrid. He didn't win the cl, he didn't overcome the barca of pep guardiola. he can wipe his ass with that one league title, if you manage one out of 4 attempts in what basically is a two horse race, you have failed. Whether his tactics and antics and little mind games are morally reprehensible or not is a moot point, since they didn't work in the end.
He is a good coach. he tried at madrid. he failed. end of story. there is no need to mystify that man
 

El Gato

Villarato!
Take a hike then pal. No ones forcing you to be here.

With all respect, neither was anyone forcing you to defend the others and play the advocate. It's not like there is a massive problem stemming from it now so why give a mod reaction like that?

Speculation starting now, but IMO United will not be Jose's destination. Jose doesn't build dynasties and United have been a dynasty for the last 3 decades, highly unlikely it will be the case if Jose takes over. If anything Moyes will simply be a thorn in Mourinho's side as he tries to take over England with Chelsea once again.
 

DucdeOrléans

New member
The fact that this is the liveliest thread is amazing and nothing short of spectacular, everyone has Mourinho fever. I have yet to come across anyone in the world of football that has attracted more attention. Simply, wow.

Anyway, the pretext of the arguments that are pro Mourinho unfortunately are not true no matter how solid Mourinho's arguments may sound like, but simply, they are fabricated because the problem isn't being discussed properly. Mourinho's failure do not stop at his dealing with Casillas and his issue extends way beyond that. Mourinho and Casillas didn't have an issue, until Mourinho felt betrayed by Spain's National Team Captain for calling Xavi and settling the score.

A gesture from Casillas that was widely accepted and appreciated from all corners of Spain. Mourinho tried to strain a social and sporting sporting issue that has plagued Spain for years and have been able to over come in the past decade thanks for Aragones and the willingness of the Spanish people.

Mourinho's success largely depends on raising tension for his tactics to work, and it took him a while to raise to the tension in Real Madrid because the players were relectant and were not at ease with it. What was competitive became personal, what was tense became ugly and what was cheeky became dirty. The whole mood in Madrid was darkened. He complained and got his way, Madrid budged in and cleared the way for him by removing Valdano from the spot.

At this point Mourinho didn't have any problems with players and by the end of the 2011 season he was campaigning for Casillas to be ballon d'or winner. So his first season ended behind Barcelona, behind Pellegrinis Madrid but in the semi finals. Controversial calls in favor of Barcelona and the lack of initiative from Madrid saw his team finish with a Copa del Rey. At this point one was being sympathetic, one was being hopeful, that Mourinho's second seasons were always better.

Now for second season, he has gotten his way and he removed the slick suit and put on his track suit, a new approach and a new style. Mourinho formulated a team that did anything possible to win over Barcelona and succeeded, as well as registering the mightiest league campaign with a win over Barcelona away. That was epic but tensions were high, blood was boiling and relationships damaged, and with it some players as well. Details aside, had Mourinho been tactically less predictable and been slightly more adventurous he would have probably beaten Bayern but it wasn't meant to. He drove away Pep, he had the league all to himself. He still didn't have any issue with anyone but by that point he had alianted the entire media and has treated them like trash.

While his treatment of the media in many cases based on actual facts, he was completely in wrong for not being diplomatic, and he had no need to pick a fight with them. His handling of the media was piss poor and that resulted in a massive war against him and which drained him and his team. The strain on the team was all but evident and the players had enough.

The way the season started no body understood what was going on, his throw away of the league to Tito was absolutely shambolic and an absolute failure and to protect himself, he half sarcastically claimed responsibility and this is where it started to go downhill very quickly. His comments such as 'when the team wins, it is the players, when the team loses it is my fault', 'I claim all responsibility for not motivating the team' were not very well respected in Spain and most certainly in the capital because no one believed him. He quickly denounced the league for the sake of the '10th' and his problems which he had kept a lid on all along where surfacing faster than he can manage and the biggest problem was that the media was anxiously waiting because of the prior two years, on which they capitalized on mercilessly.

His behavior was that less than adequate for Madrid's stature and that Ramos and Casillas were saving face and their refusal to join the circus show was the second time Mourinho felt betrayed. His jealousy towards the World champions were evident by his comments towards Casillas saying he is far too protected. Sure, he was protected but why pick a fight with Casillas? A fight that he was always going to lose? The club saved his ass by acting promptly and purchasing Diego Lopez, and please do not forget his total melt down mid season and his flirting with other clubs but Perez check mated him. He never allowed him an excuse and kept him in his position to claim all responsibility for everything and even though Mourinho wanted out, and the club forced him to stay because they know better, they backed him in a corner and the only way for him forward was actually forward he drove the club to the semis. Had Mourinho gotten his way, he wouldn't be bragging about a 3rd year 3 CL semi finals. Along the way he piicked a fight with Torill for a strange reason and if he had an issue with the club's set up vertically, as in the club did not properly set the youth team directly as a feeder club to the first team he did nothing to solve the issue but to address it in public, a massive blow to the youth team's moral and whatever harmony the club was enjoying.

So while many thing that he has broken the hegemony that Barcelona enjoyed, and while that many feel he has succeeded in bringing Madrid to proper European heights, one must understand that he has failed where others did as well, and his contribution to the club was exaggerated by him because of the unfortunate case of Madrid fans being divided right now. His fans want him out because they don't want him dealing with Madrid and those who either hate him or dislike him want him out because they cannot stand him and this is the only thing that unites the fans around Mourinho, that they both want him out, and so does he.

While the players shoulder the blame for not being fit and for being lazy, and Casillas having his form drop, he most certainly didn't create a long lasting powerful team because right after his win, he has failed. He gambled on the CL and he lost. And this wraps up his tenure at Madrid. Missed opportunities and a ton of drama, Mourinho lost the war on both fronts, on the pitch and the mic wars. Both wars he started.

But to wrap all this up and in very short...the problem isn't Casillas, nor is it Pepe, or Ramos, or Ronaldo, or Benzema or Higuain or who ever, the problem is simple, has Mourinho delivered? No? k, thanks bye, move on. He doesn't want to be on board, and we won't stand in his way. He has nothing to worry about, he is 45 million richer anyway, that should be enough to cover the ikea boxes.

Success breads interest and Mourinho has been the most successful manager during the last decade.

That's a simplistic view to hold. So Mourinho decided to turn the club into a mess the day Casillas "called Xavi and settled the score"? Really? Did that not happen before this season even began?

Plagued Spain for years? In what direction actually? Did not stop Spain from winning the European Championship last summer.

That's what happens when your organization/club structure is not geared for a person of Mourinho's character. That was well-known long before he was appointed. Another mistake by Pérez out of many (sporting at least).

Notice that such problems never occurred at his former clubs and that says a lot in my opinion.

Valdano was removed because he wanted to yell influence on matters that should be left to the manager, president and remaining staff.

The media have treated Mourinho as shit since the first day. The type of guy like Mourinho that actually can outplay the media, has the charisma and leadership is never well-liked. Again a difference of football culture. In England they love such characters hence why he always felt at home there. Let's not try to make the Spanish media innocent of all this when they all live and breathe on creating conflicts.

I can't remember 1 single day during the last 3 years that they DID NOT create one rumor about Mourinho or elaborate his comments in a absolutely ridiculous manner. Especially the Madrid-based media that have made this a living.

Mourinho knew he was leaving and that the environment he envisioned was not going to be created hence he focused on the CL and Copa del Rey. You should maybe give him some credit for even being able to pull RM out of the mess that he was by no means the sole person responsible for (no matter what you write and others) and reach the CDR final after beating FCB, beating us in the league and reaching the CL-semifinal. How many other managers would be able to pull that off under those circumstances? My guess. Not many.

I am surprised all this comes from you, although not really since that opinion is now shared by most madridistas now when they KNOW that he is going to leave, since I recall you and most other madridistas here calling him the greatest manager in the world and the best manager at RM since Del Bosque. Especially after the "league of records" there were no superlatives left to describe how amazing he was. Among the vast majority of madridistas.

Mourinho, as said before, knew that he was going to leave after this season and has since been on a self-destructive mood, especially after the CL-exit. I don't blame him for that. Would not take the circus serious either.

Has not delivered? That's not the opinion of most neutral observers if you try to look at it. 3 titles in 3 years against a historic FCB team and 3 straight CL-semfinals is delivering. But as I said and Mourinho said himself, then it's not fantastic at all but it could be worse. Most importantly he has closed the gap, that was huge between us and you, before he arrived. That is undeniable as well. For each encounter he has got better.

Before Mourinho RM were nobodies in European football for 10 straight years. Don't forget that.

Anyway Mourinho will prove his worth as everywhere he has been and win more trophies and he will have the last laugh as he always seems to do.
 
Last edited:

Poor_Sunyol

In Lucho we trust!
Why do you have such a hard on for Mou?

P.S. RM are still nobodies in Europe, they haven't won anything for decades.
 

DucdeOrléans

New member
Why do you have such a hard on for Mou?

My "dark ants". I like strong characters/winners like him and have immense respect for his credentials and achievements that are second to none. Also because the expected criticism now when he is going to leave, has been incredibly undifferentiated.

Well I also give him credit for destabilizing RM which all comes handy for us since we are in a transitional period ourselves.

In terms of entertainment value, which football is all about at the end of the day, he is a stable deliver too.

P.S. RM are still nobodies in Europe, they haven't won anything for decades.

At least he made them noticeable and put them on a map again. 3 straight CL-semifinals says it all really. Anyway he does not see that as a success but I think that he deserves credit for that "achievement" anyway.

If anyone would have told that this would happen with another manager at RM just 3-4 years ago I would laugh.
 
Last edited:

Poor_Sunyol

In Lucho we trust!
My "dark ants". I like strong characters/winners like him and have immense respect for his credentials and achievements that are second to none. Also because the expected criticism now when he is going to leave, has been incredibly undifferentiated.

Well I also give him credit for destabilizing RM which all comes handy for us since we are in a transitional period ourselves.


In terms of entertainment value, which football is all about at the end of the day, he is a stable deliver too.

That I can agree with! However I don't see his achievements as being that exceptional to be honest. He builds teams to achieve short term success and that is down to the money made available to him by the clubs he is attracted to (Porto being the exception to the rule).
 

Mr Hulot

New member
Pepe might be a "thug" but how is Ramos a thug? For being a winner and giving everything and a bit more for the shirt? You do realize that this kind of never-die attitude has been one of the many great attributes of Ramos since his Sevilla days?

He has had his outbursts like many other defenders but that does not make him a thug. Nor comparable to Pepe who also adds a great deal of diving to his reputation.


Ramos, a winner? More like a bully and a quitter.
 

DucdeOrléans

New member
That I can agree with! However I don't see his achievements as being that exceptional to be honest. He builds teams to achieve short term success and that is down to the money made available to him by the clubs he is attracted to (Porto being the exception to the rule).

Sure.:tito:

I never called them exceptional. I said that they are neither fantastic nor horrible (for sure) in one of my previous posts. I just felt that he does not get the credit he deserves for closing the gap, which was huge, between us and them.

Sure, that has been his way of operating and no sane person can say that this has not been a successful model. Mourinho is a football nomad. And the best there is. It's only natural that clubs, after he leaves them, are not able to outperform his achievements immediately. But why should he care? That's not his job. He is all about results and not longevity or leaving a project for his successor. That's not the job of a football nomad as he calls himself.

Hence why I am curious to see if he would be successful at Man Utd if he stayed for 5-6 years. I am afraid that it is not in his character to do that though. But I sure as hell believe that he would be successful in that role too if willing to adjust himself.

His spending at Inter was not that big either. His net spending in those 2 season (2008-2010) was just 38 million euros. This current Juve team under Conte have spent more money. Had anyone told to me that Inter would win a treble I would laughed at him too. But Mourinho did it. Beating us in the process.
 
Last edited:

Mr Hulot

New member
The fact that even Barcelona fans support Iker shows that Mourinho is right tbh. :lol: The guy had reached a status which he never deserved. At some point MARCA were campaigning for him to win the Ballon d'Or (http://www.marca.com/2012/07/03/en/football/national_teams/1341333173.html). Which was ridiculous. Shit in the air. Shit footwork. Great shotstopper (like many Spanish goalkeepers). Lucky to be playing for great teams such as Real Madrid and Spain. Real Madrid's version of Pique so to speak if you look at his "fame to actual performance ratio". You put a random decent goalkeeper in his place and he won't look out of place.

2013%2f4%2fIker-vs-Diego.jpg


Point proven.

Fake personality as well. The great captain of Spain publicly claiming that Fabregas just dove when Marcelo scissor kicked him, eh?

This! I hate when Barca fans say that he is the only good Madridista and that they want him in our club.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Home of Barca Fans

Top