Lionel "The Greatest of All Time" Messi

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

You can say that again brother.

Messi and Ronaldo stacked too many Ballon d'Ors based on their popularity. No doubt the best players of their generation, but no way in hell they should be on 5-4 and likes of Xavi and Iniesta on 0. That's hilarious.

Xavi and Iniesta dominated football on club level AND national team level for a good 6 years and they have 0 BD to show for it ? It's a joke award.

Xavi 1, Iniesta 1, Messi 3 (4 at a push), Ronaldo 3. About right.

You can't take an award like that seriously, simply because there is a tremendous bias for the guys that score the goals.

i agree that xavi and iniesta deserve at least one ballon dor but for Ronessi's/Messinaldo's defense both scored 50+ goals which was a completely new level of football which the world has never seen (modern era). I remember when Messi scored 47 goals in a season and the people went crazy or when Ronaldo scored 41 goals alone in la liga 2011 people wonder how this is possible. In 11/12 both showed us numbers which were beyond human. Thats why it was difficult for xavi and iniesta to get enough hype between the years 08-12. Without them they would won ballon dors easily.

 

[serghei]

i agree that xavi and iniesta deserve at least one ballon dor but for Ronessi's/Messinaldo's defense both scored 50+ goals which was a completely new level of football which the world has never seen (modern era). I remember when Messi scored 47 goals in a season and the people went crazy or when Ronaldo scored 41 goals alone in la liga 2011 people wonder how this is possible. In 11/12 both showed us numbers which were beyond human. Thats why it was difficult for xavi and iniesta to get enough hype between the years 08-12. Without them they would won ballon dors easily.

Yea, scored a lot of goals, in mega-stacked teams with some of the best midfielders and fullbacks of all time. They didn't score these goals on their own. Besides, I didn't say Ronaldo and Messi don't deserve more BD than likes of Iniesta and Xavi. Just not basically all shared between them. Even when Spain win the World Cup. What the fuck was that, in 2010? That's easy Xavi or Iniesta. What more do you want.

I'd give the 2010 one to Messi if he somehow scores vs Inter some mega-goal and wins the CL with Barca. But he was silent vs Inter.

 

[Rassvet]

Why do you all still care so much about these silly awards?




/s

 

[CatalinR10]

Messi should have had 10 by now.

 

[Rassvet]

Messi should have had 10 by now.

nah, 6-7 after this year is fair

 

[Rassvet]

Agree. I actually thought hard about 2010. Xavi and Iniesta were definitely more influential than Messi that year, but that was the year Messi's equalled R9's record of 47 goals in a season (which back then was a big deal because Messi and CR7 hadn't started banging in 50 goals a season yet).

I would say Xavi - Iniesta were the more accomplished and influential players in 2010 while Messi was the best player on the planet in 2010. So, the award can easily have gone to the magician duo if France football actually had a consistent/clear criteria.

Xavi was much better than Iniesta in 2010 imo but Iniesta was the better of the duo in 2012

 

[Marshall D Teach]

Agree. I actually thought hard about 2010. Xavi and Iniesta were definitely more influential than Messi that year, but that was the year Messi's equalled R9's record of 47 goals in a season (which back then was a big deal because Messi and CR7 hadn't started banging in 50 goals a season yet).

I would say Xavi - Iniesta were the more accomplished and influential players in 2010 while Messi was the best player on the planet in 2010. So, the award can easily have gone to the magician duo if France football actually had a consistent/clear criteria.

I don't think there should be a "criteria" per se. It's an award for the best player in the world, which is inherently subjective.

If you try to award it based on some "objective" criteria then you'd have to give it to Drogba in 2012 for winning the CL or to Mario Gomez for scoring 753 tap ins in whatever year that was because hey he scored the most goals

 

[bismp]

It is really easy to say in retrospect that Leo/CR did not deserve their awards

In 2010 people were starting to get crazy for Leo, there were direct comparisons not only to R9, but also to Maradona, Pele etc. Scoring 47 goals in a season was unheard of at the time.

Furthermore, it completely funny and unfair to look only at the goals. 2010 Messi was a JOY to watch, the man was dribbling like crazy, scoring solo goals left and right etc. He was also quite clutch, do people forget the 4 goals vs Arsenal or the goal vs Real Madrid? Anyone watching Barcea consistently that season knew that he was by far the best player in our team.

The argument that he was in a stacked team goes the other way around too. Xavi and Iniesta also had the privilege to play with each other and to play in a great team with a generational talent like Messi and a great coach.
Spain was also STACKED with talent.

If anything Sneijder had a claim on the award, but once again, you couldn’t possibly compare him individually with Messi.

Another “scandalous” year is 2013. Yeah Ribery won the treble, but he was one of the best players in a great Bayern team. He was not the stand-out performer like Lewandowski in 2020. There is an argument for Robben, Lahm etc. On the other hand, CR had a monster year.

Finally, people tend to clown Modric for winning in 2018, but this is a “double standards” argument. Who should have won?

Had CR won, they would have said it was a popularity contest.

Messi had no claim to the award, he choked hard in the CL and was really mediocre in the WC.

Mbappe was really young and definitely did not perform to a Ballon D’Or level.

Griezmann had only won the Europa in club level

 

[bismp]

In my opinion if we value more individual performances the award should have been like this:

2008: CR
2009:Messi
2010:Messi
2011:Messi
2012:Messi
2013:CR
2014:CR
2015:Messi
2016:CR
2017:CR
2018:Salah
2019:Messi
2020:Lewa
2021:Lewa


And if we value team accomplishments more:

2008: CR
2009: Messi
2010: Sneijder or Xavi
2011: Messi
2012: Messi
2013: Ribery
2014: CR
2015: Messi
2016: CR
2017: CR
2018: Modric
2019: Messi or Van Djik
2020: Lewa
2021: Lewa or Messi

 

[KingLeo10]

It is really easy to say in retrospect that Leo/CR did not deserve their awards

In 2010 people were starting to get crazy for Leo, there were direct comparisons not only to R9, but also to Maradona, Pele etc. Scoring 47 goals in a season was unheard of at the time.

Furthermore, it completely funny and unfair to look only at the goals. 2010 Messi was a JOY to watch, the man was dribbling like crazy, scoring solo goals left and right etc. He was also quite clutch, do people forget the 4 goals vs Arsenal or the goal vs Real Madrid? Anyone watching Barcea consistently that season knew that he was by far the best player in our team.

The argument that he was in a stacked team goes the other way around too. Xavi and Iniesta also had the privilege to play with each other and to play in a great team with a generational talent like Messi and a great coach.
Spain was also STACKED with talent.

If anything Sneijder had a claim on the award, but once again, you couldn’t possibly compare him individually with Messi.

Another “scandalous” year is 2013. Yeah Ribery won the treble, but he was one of the best players in a great Bayern team. He was not the stand-out performer like Lewandowski in 2020. There is an argument for Robben, Lahm etc. On the other hand, CR had a monster year.

Finally, people tend to clown Modric for winning in 2018, but this is a “double standards” argument. Who should have won?

Had CR won, they would have said it was a popularity contest.

Messi had no claim to the award, he choked hard in the CL and was really mediocre in the WC.

Mbappe was really young and definitely did not perform to a Ballon D’Or level.

Griezmann had only won the Europa in club level

I agree with a few of your points, but I will defend Xavi - Iniesta on this.

That Spain team achieved so much BECAUSE of them. Ever since they began declining in 2012-13, Spain completely fell apart. Even when they had the best of RM, Barcelona, AM players for the mid 2010s.

IMO, Xavi - Iniesta have "perfect" resumes. 7-0 in WC final, CL finals, and Euro final. When they were dominant, Spain was dominant. And they were a large contributor to Barca's dominance (Messi reason no.1 still because elite club competition is much harder than WC).

 

[OGbarca]

Messi should have had 10 by now.

congrats on missing the entire point and nuance of the conversation , lol

 

[OGbarca]

yeah i think its very unfair to say that in 2010 at least xavi and iniesta werent individually better than messi. xavi in particular unplayable that season. as an individual he was brilliant.

 

[Catta]

Iniesta costed Xavi the BdOr in 2010. If any other player scored the wining goal in the final, Xavi would have won the prize. That goal split the votes up, and Messi won it in the end, Xavi was the best player that year but was unlucky with the hype Iniesta got.

 

[KingLeo10]

I think Barcelona and Milan are the only teams to have Ballon D'Or top 3 playing on the same team at the same time

We were also close in 2015 with MSN being 3 of top 4

 

[Birdy]

In my opinion if we value more individual performances the award should have been like this:

2008: CR
2009:Messi
2010:Messi
2011:Messi
2012:Messi
2013:CR
2014:CR
2015:Messi
2016:CR
2017:CR
2018:Salah
2019:Messi
2020:Lewa
2021:Lewa


And if we value team accomplishments more:

2008: CR
2009: Messi
2010: Sneijder or Xavi
2011: Messi
2012: Messi
2013: Ribery
2014: CR
2015: Messi
2016: CR
2017: CR
2018: Modric
2019: Messi or Van Djik
2020: Lewa
2021: Lewa or Messi

MAkes sense.

So, they have violated both criteria on different years just to give the award either to Messi or to CR every year