Lionel "The Greatest of All Time" Messi

[Birdy]

Lol, You talk about objective criteria yet you vomit out the most subjective opinion of all, your just as bad as OGBarca, someone so delusional your opinions should be completely ignored...

If only you could show why there is a subjective opinion in what I wrote above, then I could take you seriously
But you apparently can't

Suddenly Bundesliga is a better league than La Liga. The clown brigade is coming up with some sci-fi stuff at this point.
.

No Bundesliga has been better than LaLiga the last 2 season already, you clown!

 

[Birdy]

People used the same arguments when RM and Barca were smashing teams early-mid last decade, that the league just sucked.

Its not as much that LL has improved since then, its the fact that top teams in Spain has turned mediocre.

Bayern smashing teams is mostly due to them being an absolute machine in attack, probably the best attacking force in the world for the past couple of years, i wouldn't blame it too much on Bundesliga being "bad".

Amen.
Both Barca and RM were many levels above English clubs in 2011 and 2012, but no one used the points tally or easiness of games in LL to argue against the level of the teams.

Double standards always

 

[Mitchell1978]

If only you could show why there is a subjective opinion in what I wrote above, then I could take you seriously
But you apparently can't

I did in my post

And the irony -> including a mickey mouse cup, like Copa America, in the important trophies, as if it is the World Cup.

And the irony -> on the 'trophies criterion' Jorginho wins above everyone else hands down, because he won the 2 most important trophies of 2021: UCL and Euros, these trophies being trillion times more important than Copa America.

Calling the Copa America a "mickey mouse cup" or "the UCL and Euros trillion times more important than Copa America" are textbook extremely biased opinions.

So much so that its impossible to take you seriously just like OGBarca

 

[malvolio]

People used the same arguments when RM and Barca were smashing teams early-mid last decade, that the league just sucked.

Its not as much that LL has improved since then, its the fact that top teams in Spain has turned mediocre.

Bayern smashing teams is mostly due to them being an absolute machine in attack, probably the best attacking force in the world for the past couple of years, i wouldn't blame it too much on Bundesliga being "bad".

And yet Bundesliga is the weaker league between the two.

Country coefficients | UEFA Coefficients | UEFA.com https://www.uefa.com/nationalassociations/uefarankings/country/#/yr/2022

Apart from Bayern, who are basically the team of the whole country, picking up for free/peanuts all the talent, having refs and league at their disposal. What other teams from Germany have done well in Europe?

 

[Morten]

And yet Bundesliga is the weaker league between the two.

Okay, and why are you telling me this?

Did i say Bundesliga was better? Nope.

 

[Mitchell1978]

People used the same arguments when RM and Barca were smashing teams early-mid last decade, that the league just sucked.

Its not as much that LL has improved since then, its the fact that top teams in Spain has turned mediocre.

Bayern smashing teams is mostly due to them being an absolute machine in attack, probably the best attacking force in the world for the past couple of years, i wouldn't blame it too much on Bundesliga being "bad".

Bundesliga GPG has consistenly been the highest of all the top 5 leagues, often over 3 GPG.
Half of LL teams regulary park the bus playing top teams, few Bundesliga do that.

Apart from Bayern most top teams also suck in the CL. Currently i rate the Bundesliga as the 4e best European League, barely.

Lets not forget Paco Alcacer averaging a goal every 65 minutes in his 1,5 seasons with Dortmund.
Granted some of that has to do with the playstyle of Dortmund, but the main reason is the space, the attacking football in the Bundesliga.
Its just an easier league to score in compared with other top 5 leagues.

 

[malvolio]

you really want to make thar argument when 4/5 of La Liga teams could be knocked out in the group stage this season?

What argument you buffoon?! Bundesliga has never been better than La Liga over the past 10 years.

 

[Rassvet]

What argument you buffoon?! Bundesliga has never been better than La Liga over the past 10 years.

As Birdy said, it has been better past two seasons for sure

 

[Mitchell1978]

As Birdy said, it has been better past two seasons for sure

Not by any objective metric: as Spanish teams have done better in European competitions both in 2019-20 and in 2020-21

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_coefficient

 

[malvolio]

As Birdy said, it has been better past two seasons for sure

Then stop taking for granted what the other clown says.

It wasn't.

Spain had 2 EL winners and 1 semifinalist in CL
Germany had 1 CL winner and another team that reached the semis the same year - and that was the CL light with 1 KO round and after the restart

So basically there is Bayern and that's it. Rest of the teams don't play for anything domestically and usually are passengers in Europe.

 

[Valdario]

Suddenly Bundesliga is a better league than La Liga. The clown brigade is coming up with some sci-fi stuff at this point.

Messi being best player in La Liga, top scorer, winning the Copa del Rey, winning Copa America as best player, is considered a worse player than a guy who pummeled a weak league with a juggernaut of a team behind him feeding him left and right.

The hate is unreal dawg. As Guardiola said, Messi is just too good. People complaining about the award are just weird. I can understand people saying that Lewandowski deserved the award, and in my opinion he did as well deserve it, but Messi for sure deserved it as well, if we're talking strictly about Ballon D'or 2021. He won Argentina's first major trophy in 30 years being the MVP, top scorer & top assister, a historic feat at the Maracana and he's still not worthy of the award for some people.

 

[khaled_a_d]

I really don't understand this obsession people have with "objective criteria" for an inherently subjective award.

Like that dumb debate over "well Ronaldo scored more goals so he should have won in 2011 but Messi won it because he had more trophies so CR should have won it in 2012." That's not how it's supposed to work.

There are no "criteria" or at least there shouldn't be. It's an award for the best footballer. That's it. There's no way to completley objectify that. It's not the golden boot or the "which player won the CL" award.

Messi wasn't anything special in 2021, but neither was anyone else. Lewandowski wasn't anywhere near as good as in 2020. Still by far Messi's worst Ballon d'or year though. I don't think he particularly deserved it but at the same time no one particularly deserved it over him.

Also at Jorginho third. Kante was way better.

I mean the editors of the award itself admits that, but for whatever reason people wants it to be something it isn't

 

[Rassvet]

Then stop taking for granted what the other clown says.

It wasn't.

Spain had 2 EL winners and 1 semifinalist in CL
Germany had 1 CL winner and another team that reached the semis the same year - and that was the CL light with 1 KO round and after the restart

So basically there is Bayern and that's it. Rest of the teams don't play for anything domestically and usually are passengers in Europe.

Calling Birdy a clown is a big L, even by your standards.

 

[Birdy]

How many times should we discuss in this forum that the comparative strength of every league is not deciding by adding the points of all of their teams in Europe and making a ranking??
Really, how many times??

 

[Birdy]

I did in my post




Calling the Copa America a "mickey mouse cup" or "the UCL and Euros trillion times more important than Copa America" are textbook extremely biased opinions.

So much so that its impossible to take you seriously just like OGBarca

Dude are you for real?
IS it biased to say that Euros is a much harder and difficult competition to win compared to Copa America?
Copa America has only Brazil as certified contender every time, and then you have to look if Argentina or Uruguay are good enough to compete, and that's it...
The other NTs are many levels below, you have only an exception every 15-20 years like Chile in 2014-2016, and that's it.
The level of competition is laughable

In the Euros you have probably the best 3-4 NTs each time, and another 4-5 ready to compete.
Day and night compared to Copa.

I don't even go into your insinuation about UCL, as it's laughable to even say that the top club competition can be compared to any NT competition

Textbook bias is to say Copa America is a trophy comparable to Euro or World Cup or UCL

Chatting with Messi fanboys here is seeing how the world looks upside down (within their mind)