Martin Montoya

[ebc_99]

Montoya is 21, Thiago 22. They have to compete with Alves and Xavi. Of course, Alves and Xavi are better but what do you understand under youth-work? It's about playing time to develop, improving, becoming better. Montoya and Thiago prooved that they are class but how can they proove more of their talent when the coach does not believe in them? Instead of thousands of useless crosses from Alves, Tito should have let Montoya play a bit more. The match against Malaga, Montoya did so well and even scored a nice goal. There is no way that playing almost all games with the same players will lead us to success in the future because we have the best youth academy in the world but what is it worth when there is no one who uses the diamonds correctly?

I understand that they need to play but Tito believes in giving the best players the place on the team and in theory that should push the younger players to improve. Some won't like it and ask to leave which is what Thiago is doing, others like Montoya will stay and fight. I like Montoya and would start him over Alves from the beginning of this season and see if he improves the balance defensively. Overall I think Dani Alves is the better player and can understand why Tito stuck with him in the important games. Montoya did not show that he could be a starter until late in the season when he really improved and his total minutes are not far off Adriano's who is also a RB option. This season I think Montoya will push Dani Alves and it is up to him to take his place.

Older players should not have to step aside for younger players to take their place. The younger players have got to take that place themselves and push the older players out of the way and the current young Barca players are not doing that just yet. When Busquets was promoted he took that place from Toure, he gave Guardiola no option but to put him in the team, same with Messi. Montoya and Thiago have not done enough yet to warrant playing time more than they have received.

Montoya is smart enough to know that and is patient, he is 10 years younger than Dani Alves and his chance is just around the corner. Thiago should be the same, 11 years younger than Xavi, if he just waits then I bet he will start 30 to 40 games this season and if he performs well enough then he will start the big games. To leave when it is so close is stupid.

 

[DonAndres]

You read my mind mate
OT: Hope we meet in this lifetime someday. It would be like looking into a mirror

Thanks :beer2: I agree, you and I share a lot of opinions

Alves was beaten in the air but thats not him being poor defensively a fullback of that height should never be being asked to mark players of that height and in that areas for set pieces. You cant expect him to win those duals in that areas.

Anyway those were headers knocked back across goal to players unmarked, breaking down goals like that you could start blaming 3/4 players.

If Alba was asked to mark a center forward from a corner and they knocked it back across goal he couldnt be blamed for that.

Alba was marking two of the players that actually scored goals and his was the area of the park they targeted.

He is a complete liabilty defensively far more so than Alves.

I'm not saying it should be Alves' responsibility to mark them perfectly but you're making it out to be like Alba should perfectly stop an on-fire Muller+Robben when even Alves proved to be less than useless defensively, not even offering workrate let alone solidity. I know always breaking down a goal/play to specifically make a player look bad is poor logic, but it seems to be what you're into so might as well use the same standard. They didn't specifically play on the right just to target Alba, Muller and Robben bomb forward as right sided players and if you knew about Bayern, you'd know that. You could see it in the CL final as well. Both of them are the players Bayern often use as focal points in attack, especially on counterattacks as they burst forward. Both defenders weren't able to do their jobs, and Alba offered nothing less than Alves who barely gave a damn, at least Alba was running around for the full 90 minutes and helping out as much as he could.

 

[Meitux]

Thanks :beer2: I agree, you and I share a lot of opinions



I'm not saying it should be Alves' responsibility to mark them perfectly but you're making it out to be like Alba should perfectly stop an on-fire Muller+Robben when even Alves proved to be less than useless defensively, not even offering workrate let alone solidity. I know always breaking down a goal/play to specifically make a player look bad is poor logic, but it seems to be what you're into so might as well use the same standard. They didn't specifically play on the right just to target Alba, Muller and Robben bomb forward as right sided players and if you knew about Bayern, you'd know that. You could see it in the CL final as well. Both of them are the players Bayern often use as focal points in attack, especially on counterattacks as they burst forward. Both defenders weren't able to do their jobs, and Alba offered nothing less than Alves who barely gave a damn, at least Alba was running around for the full 90 minutes and helping out as much as he could.

I have to agree with everything you said.If anything Alves is below shit in defending,being too much lazy and providing nothing more than Alba when going forward...They are both attack minded players and also Alba is way faster and can cover up at least.So every way you see it Alba is better

 

[JamDav1982]

Thanks :beer2: I agree, you and I share a lot of opinions



I'm not saying it should be Alves' responsibility to mark them perfectly but you're making it out to be like Alba should perfectly stop an on-fire Muller+Robben when even Alves proved to be less than useless defensively, not even offering workrate let alone solidity. I know always breaking down a goal/play to specifically make a player look bad is poor logic, but it seems to be what you're into so might as well use the same standard. They didn't specifically play on the right just to target Alba, Muller and Robben bomb forward as right sided players and if you knew about Bayern, you'd know that. You could see it in the CL final as well. Both of them are the players Bayern often use as focal points in attack, especially on counterattacks as they burst forward. Both defenders weren't able to do their jobs, and Alba offered nothing less than Alves who barely gave a damn, at least Alba was running around for the full 90 minutes and helping out as much as he could.

I am not saying he should stop them. I am saying that they highlighted him as a weakness and his positioining etc was very suspect even when back defending.

Alves offered plenty of work rate and the only thing he did wrong defensively was getting beat in the air at set pieces he should never be expected to play an important defensive role in.

You claim he jogged back without trying on Robben for the third goal which is just a lie. He was never going to catch him and he realised there were other men between Robben and the goal.

I watched plenty of Bayern games last season and their attacking was normally balanced and if anything the left hand side was more dangerous. It was clear in that game they targeted Alba. If you cant see that then fair enough.

You seem to have decided on this idea that Alves did not give a damn based on you reading one situation of him 'not tracking back'.

Spare me the lecture, you said all this before from a photo of Alves and came out with some of the worst understanding of a defensive situation I have heard. In that example he certainly gave a damn and bust a gut to get back and cover for the CB's out of position.

 

[JamDav1982]

I have to agree with everything you said.If anything Alves is below shit in defending,being too much lazy and providing nothing more than Alba when going forward...They are both attack minded players and also Alba is way faster and can cover up at least.So every way you see it Alba is better

Wow, about the only thing you got right is that Alba is faster.

 

[Cule4life]

I understand that they need to play but Tito believes in giving the best players the place on the team and in theory that should push the younger players to improve. Some won't like it and ask to leave which is what Thiago is doing, others like Montoya will stay and fight. I like Montoya and would start him over Alves from the beginning of this season and see if he improves the balance defensively. Overall I think Dani Alves is the better player and can understand why Tito stuck with him in the important games. Montoya did not show that he could be a starter until late in the season when he really improved and his total minutes are not far off Adriano's who is also a RB option. This season I think Montoya will push Dani Alves and it is up to him to take his place.

Older players should not have to step aside for younger players to take their place. The younger players have got to take that place themselves and push the older players out of the way and the current young Barca players are not doing that just yet. When Busquets was promoted he took that place from Toure, he gave Guardiola no option but to put him in the team, same with Messi. Montoya and Thiago have not done enough yet to warrant playing time more than they have received.

Montoya is smart enough to know that and is patient, he is 10 years younger than Dani Alves and his chance is just around the corner. Thiago should be the same, 11 years younger than Xavi, if he just waits then I bet he will start 30 to 40 games this season and if he performs well enough then he will start the big games. To leave when it is so close is stupid.

Why did we not have a problem of unhappy youngsters under Pep then? Because we had a competent manager then who knew how to manage youngsters and who wasnt obsessed with 100 points records to make himself seem relevant
What more does Montoya have to do in the limited chances he gets that he's ready to take over Alves? Score hat tricks every time he steps on the field?

 

[JamDav1982]

Why did we not have a problem of unhappy youngsters under Pep then? Because we had a competent manager then who knew how to manage youngsters and who wasnt obsessed with 100 points records to make himself seem relevant
What more does Montoya have to do in the limited chances he gets that he's ready to take over Alves? Score hat tricks every time he steps on the field?

One youngster is upset.

Pep never had a youngster the age and ability of Thiago to keep happy.

He caused the situation by signing Cesc in the first place.

 

[Meitux]

Wow, about the only thing you got right is that Alba is faster.

Because Alba is not good defensively doesnt mean Alves is better right?I have seen him many times losing the actual guy he should mark,he let his player very comfortable..not trying to press him or block a propably shot that came in.And seriously why would they tell Alves to mark Gomez or Muller or any of those strong tall guys,it wouldnt make any sense.Can you tell me right now what Alves offers more than Alba in attack?

 

[Semi-Neutral]

Pep never had a youngster the age and ability of Thiago to keep happy.

?

 

[Cule4life]

One youngster is upset.

Pep never had a youngster the age and ability of Thiago to keep happy.

He caused the situation by signing Cesc in the first place.

You cant blame signing Cesc on Pep alone. All players and the board were equally responsible
I bet if Pep was in charge he would have found a way to keep both Thiago and Cesc happy. Again if Tito was even remotely competent we wouldnt be in this situation in the first place

 

[DonAndres]

Wow, about the only thing you got right is that Alba is faster.

Where do you get the idea that everyone who doesn't share your clouded and biased opinion is wrong and that the reasons you are giving are at all relevant. If Alves gets owned, it wasn't his responsibility or fault. If Alba gets double teamed, he's the biggest defensive liability in the world. And if anyone says otherwise it's "No, and that's a fact". You give no evidence that Alves rightfully did anything better than Alba, but of course you're right and give a completely reasonable argument

 

[darthvader7888]

Can you tell me right now what Alves offers more than Alba in attack?

Crosses to the moon.

 

[JamDav1982]

Because Alba is not good defensively doesnt mean Alves is better right?I have seen him many times losing the actual guy he should mark,he let his player very comfortable..not trying to press him or block a propably shot that came in.And seriously why would they tell Alves to mark Gomez or Muller or any of those strong tall guys,it wouldnt make any sense.Can you tell me right now what Alves offers more than Alba in attack?

Tell me one team that have ever ripped Barca to bits by targeting Alves then.

Alves creates more chances, sets up more goals and puts in more succesful crosses.

He is a better passer and crosser of the ball and sticks to his position out wide better.

 

[Deco 20]

I think Alves is a smarter player than Alba. At times he's a genius even.

 

[JamDav1982]

Where do you get the idea that everyone who doesn't share your clouded and biased opinion is wrong and that the reasons you are giving are at all relevant. If Alves gets owned, it wasn't his responsibility or fault. If Alba gets double teamed, he's the biggest defensive liability in the world. And if anyone says otherwise it's "No, and that's a fact". You give no evidence that Alves rightfully did anything better than Alba, but of course you're right and give a completely reasonable argument

Alves never got owned in any example you gave unless you think getting beat in the air by a CB and a six feet plus forward player.

You totally got it wrong about him not tracking back or caring and just made that up completely.