Real Madrid (old thread)

[poncirus]

Argentina were shit because they had looney who thought some random tactical tricks can paper over the cracks and hide the fact he didn't do the basics of coaching: make his team defend and attack as a unit and reach the high level of automatism in the their game. It's not he wasn't playing chess, it's the fact he thought it's all about playing chess. That's a common mistake of a pretentious, inadequate coach.

That's the thing people forget and tend to overstate tactical fine tuning which is absolutely necesarry but is also a secondary and less important aspect of the game. It gets even more crazy when people think there is some geniality in football tactics. It's laughable, there are some coaches who are obsessive with it, some who are a bit smarter than else, some who like to present themselves as masterminds... but in reality there is no "tactical winner" who invents new and unexpected stuff all the time.

In the end it's the basics of the game. And top coaches are peole who have the way to instill them in highly talented and highly payed individuals, winning game after game under pressure. Well coached team is able to pass the ball, attack and defend with great level of accuracy, consisteny and efficiency. That's where you recognize the top work, not in some revolutionary idea no one could figur out but "genius". But I guess the basics are just not so interesting to average viewer...

 

[Beast]

Argentina 2010,Brazil 2006,France 2002, Greece 2004.France 1998,Holland 1990,Brazil 1982,Brazil and France 1986. Holland 1974
Galacticos 2003-2004, Barca last year , Barca 1997

so many examples those who clearly know nothing about football coaching (above ) should study

 

[gingerless]

poncirus kind of has a point, now i wouldn't go as far as to say tactics don't matter but they're not the make or break imo (unless the manager is a fucking retard), they come after certain things. luck, players etc as mentioned.

 

[Sergio]

Maybe at playing with your friends in the park level, but not at the top level, not at Classico level.

At the highest level, when both teams have 11 supreme athletes, with the best of skill and experience, plus a bench of more, its the tactical differences that more often than not make the difference. Or can even make up for a difference in quality, look no further than when Mourinho brought his good, but none the less inferior Inter team to Camp Nou.

 

[Beast]

The problem is they are more than you think , people who don't know the great importance of tactics has probably played more video games than normal..think if he can lead Barca on Fifa he can in real life..

the human intelligence is smarter and unpredictable than the AI
Take Barca to localize the example
You have the best players in the world , let's say the best starting 11 in the world.. did you win the Champions league every year ?
No you were taken out by two chess players , SAF and Jose while both having inferior teams in comparison

Real football is not street football nor it's a video game were talent prevail ..the master/gaffer prevail

Maybe at playing with your friends in the park level, but not at the top level, not at Classico level.

At the highest level, when both teams have 11 supreme athletes, with the best of skill and experience, plus a bench of more, its the tactical differences that more often than not make the difference. Or can even make up for a difference in quality, look no further than when Mourinho brought his good, but none the less inferior Inter team to Camp Nou.

Absolutely spot on

 

[gingerless]

so pep's genius tactics beat real in the classico and humiliated tactical "genius" mourinho?

it was motivation, talent/skill, hard work more than anything

 

[Beast]

so pep's genius tactics beat real in the classico and humiliated tactical "genius" mourinho?

it was motivation, talent/skill, hard work more than anything

lol.. of course not .. it was TACTICS

Pep studied and found Achilles heel , he put Xavi to man mark Xabi when you don't have the ball ..
we were brainless ..Barca walked with a home run

Jesus don't u guys try to watch ANYTHING beside some player tricks ?

 

[Abaddon]

lol.. of course not .. it was TACTICS

Pep studied and found Achilles heel , he put Xavi to man mark Xabi when you don't have the ball ..
we were brainless ..Barca walked with a home run

Jesus don't u guys try to watch ANYTHING beside some player tricks ?

Exactly, I have always maintained that Barca was more impressive without the ball in that last clasico than with the ball. We couldn't keep the ball for even 30 seconds, we simply could not do anything.

 

[poncirus]

so pep's genius tactics beat real in the classico and humiliated tactical "genius" mourinho?

it was motivation, talent/skill, hard work more than anything

Absolutely spot on. That's why Pep is brilliant coach, because he made his team to consistently play attacking, highly automatised, expansive football, with tremendous level of interplay. That's what you do day in day out on training ground and to make such a brilliant job you have to posses great knowledge, methodology and great management skills. Also it requires a special type of personality, that's why top coaches are so highly payed.

Particular game tactics matter and are absolutely necessary, but only after the basics. People somehow fail to recognize it lately.

 

[IrvDizzle]

tactics determine training. not the other way around. how the players train and what they work to achieve is based on the tactical decisions that a coach makes. for instance, for FCB, possession is imperative. As such, when FCB does not have possession, pressing to win the ball back is even more imperative. this is a tactical choice by Pep. He could tell the team to sit back, become compact around the 18 yard box, and wait for the other team to give the ball back. Instead, he tells his players to press. So instead of having defensive drills about organization and cover, he has pressing drills. Granted Pep has the players who are talented and willing to do this, and his ability to get his players to "buy in to his system" is something that all great managers have across all sports, but his tactics are another weapon in his arsenal and completely independent of his managerial charms. Moreover, they are more important. Just ask Arsene Wenger.

 

[Beast]

tactics determine training. not the other way around. how the players train and what they work to achieve is based on the tactical decisions that a coach makes. for instance, for FCB, possession is imperative. As such, when FCB does not have possession, pressing to win the ball back is even more imperative. this is a tactical choice by Pep. He could tell the team to sit back, become compact around the 18 yard box, and wait for the other team to give the ball back. Instead, he tells his players to press. So instead of having defensive drills about organization and cover, he has pressing drills. Granted Pep has the players who are talented and willing to do this, and his ability to get his players to "buy in to his system" is something that all great managers have across all sports, but his tactics are another weapon in his arsenal and completely independent of his managerial charms. Moreover, they are more important. Just ask Arsene Wenger.

U can't teach video games fans that matter , there is no training in the game

 

[Aryagorn]

Weird discussion... Wat the hell!? Players(& their attributes) are as important as do the tactics, vice versa! Yo poncirus there are some players here, some who are on the verge of making it professional & some unlucky ones who couldn't and I'm sure they all agree tactics form a vital ingredient of a winning team, not just the cherry on the top but a very vital one


Yeah Ibra-Ronaldo swap... Now how about that for discussion eh!?

 

[Sergio]

Yeah, the tactical thing is really such a ridiculous discussion, it was pretty much put to bed in the 1920's, can't believe there is anyone with an interest in football who would dismiss the importance of tactics so easily. Shocking.

Ibra always said (fat) Ronaldo was his idol - a man that played for Barca, Madrid, Inter and Milan. Am sure he will want to complete the set as well.

 

[xaviniesta]

Ibra always said (fat) Ronaldo was his idol

there's only one Ronaldo, so please stop that using the '(fat) Ronaldo'


thanks

 

[Aryagorn]

It would be such a fun... Even if Ronaldo isn't involved in the deal(which of course is going to be the case, me thinks). Gio would go all