State of La Liga

[House of Flies]

probability? it will happen. you are assuming that no contracts will end during your reign... and given that the club is spending 20m on new players with 3m wages, old players who are as important would be wanting a higher contract. its imperative for them to ask for it especially if their new colleagues are earning that much.

if the club does buy these 3 important players, are you assuming that people are just going to sit and accept the reality that these new players will need to be paid more whilst their club still pays them peanuts? good luck. cause what you are saying is a recipe for disaster because you are forgetting the notion of benchmarking and how important it is in deciding player wages. all that you are asking for a low morale in the club through your methods.

and where exactly will you find these awesome players for 20m? jordan henderson costs close to that and he isnt even that good. that my friend is due to price inflation because everyone knows that everyone else has money. dont you think thats a major reason why spanish teams sell to barcelona and real madrid at a price that is typically 3-4 times higher than if they had done business with another la liga team. at the same time, barcelona and real sell their players to other teams at a lower price. ---> this is exactly where del nido, who built up sevilla on utilizing these market inadequacies, is largely shortsighted. his disposable income will rise but his net transfer gains will subsequently drop.

 

[Beast]

That would be applicable if the seller didn't know the other clubs are earning 20 Mil as well so the prices will go up.. and it's not that they have the amount increased with such ease, you are forgetting once more money is announced those players existing will demand for an increase so the cheer reality is
first year 20 Mil - 14 on new player - 6 on wages
second year 20 Mil 12 on new player 8 on wages
3rd year 20 Mil 10 on a new player 10 on wages
...etc
so if this club gets relegated they will not be in Segunda but they will go bust

you scenario would be applicable of the 20 Mil and buying a player is the only variable happening

 

[oz187]

I'm giving an illustrative example that is workable and I'm assuming the clubs aren't overpaying. Obviously if the club pays silly money to a player that can cause internal problems and demands for parity but it's up to the club to utilise the money effectively within their wage policy. The specifics depend on the club.

If Atletico Madrid were to do this it would not cause any wage inflation. They just bought Falcao for 40M, so buying more players for half the money and lesser wages would not cause demands for wage inflation. If Levante had the extra money then this transfer policy probably wouldn't be effective. They could instead buy more players for cheaper. It is up to the clubs to work within their budget and they don't just have to buy from each other, they can buy players from abroad if they want.

 

[House of Flies]

The premise of your argument is that clubs wouldnt be overpaying but any club with an illusion of more money is bound to overpay. The notion of free money doesnt help someone to work a solution when the management itself is horrible. Look at Leeds for example, it qualified for CL continuously and then, its president decided to take loans on future CL income and when that didnt happen, the club went belly up.

Now, lets look at the clubs that were nothing but became into something with a business plan- Porto and Lyon. Their business strategies are the reason why they have put themselves into significant places without the need for extra TV cash. La Liga needs to look at these clubs to realise what is needed to be a successful club. Getafe has done this quite well and recently, so has Valencia. Sevilla used to do it previously when they sold Ramos, Alves and Baptista at outrageous fees but used that money wisely to constantly challenge Barcelona and Real but Del Nido prematurely transitioned from a selling club to a buying club. Del Nido used his money unwisely to pay for players that were either crap or victims of long term injury- Tom de Mul, Kone, Sergio Sanchez, Konko, Zokora, Guarente, Dabo, Chevaton and the list goes on.

Villarreal does not and will not ever have the fan base to support itself hence requires the transfer income to keep the club afloat.

What I have done highlights why clubs in La Liga will not actually use that money properly. At. Madrid overpaid for Falcao but At. Madrid also should never be classified as a club that has sound management. Also, buying from abroad would just create another EPL type situation which is something that I am so against as it would really stop youth development.

 

[oz187]

What I have done highlights why clubs in La Liga will not actually use that money properly.

La Liga needs to look at these clubs to realise what is needed to be a successful club. Getafe has done this quite well and recently, so has Valencia.

You've contradicted yourself. Sometimes La Liga clubs use their money well, sometimes they don't. This applies to the top two as well(Ibra, Kaka vs Pique, Ozil).

If you want the gap to close then the standard of other teams has to improve. Either they improve their youth systems or they buy better players. Buying better players has winners and losers. So either they buy from abroad and raise the standard of the league, or they buy from each other in which case there is a redistribution of talent within La Liga and some teams become better and others worse.

 

[House of Flies]

You've contradicted yourself. Sometimes La Liga clubs use their money well, sometimes they don't. This applies to the top two as well(Ibra, Kaka vs Pique, Ozil).

If you want the gap to close then the standard of other teams has to improve. Either they improve their youth systems or they buy better players. Buying better players has winners and losers. So either they buy from abroad and raise the standard of the league, or they buy from each other in which case there is a redistribution of talent within La Liga and some teams become better and others worse.

I havent contradicted myself because Getafe hasnt made one bad move. Valencia made a bad move with Soler's premature plans but now, under new management, they are getting smart. Barcelona and Real Madrid are sorta safe because if the shit hits the fan when it comes to debt- presidents can be removed and debt can be absorbed by the members if need be and the clubs have assets that guarantee their future.

Financial Gap =/= Sporting Gap. Barcelona and Real always had the edge when it came to having the moolah but it never became an issue in the past because other clubs were winning. The moment when Barcelona and Real smartened up, others cried foul. People say that its the latin culture where people put themselves over others, but the predicament that other clubs find themselves in, is not due to Barcelona or Real. The standard of the league will only improve through Barcelona and Real not Sevilla and Villarreal and that will take time. I mean ffs, how much uproar was there by Del Nido when kick off times were moved to early morning to help asian viewers.

 

[La Furia]

The revolution begins. Del Nido has called on all presidents except Perez and Rosell to demand a more equitable distribution of funds.

-Getafe, Sporting, Levante have said they wont be going to the meeting. Mallorca says "maybe"
-Gil Marin is going for Atletico, Cerezo declined saying there is more important issues to worry about (even here Atleti is dysfunctional).
-Villarreal penyas are planing to make their support shown during the Villarreal-Sevilla match.


Except for the clubs mentioned earlier, every other club is sending representation. Not as impressive as it sounds though, as the two most important clubs in Spain after Barca and Madrid, Valencia and Atleti, are going as observers.

Any attempt to pressure the LFP is going to need Atleti and Valencia's involvement, as they are the two biggest sources of revenue outside of the old firm, and it's a considerable drop off after them.

For more information: http://forzafutbol.com/ligajusta

 

[House of Flies]

This is hardly a revolution. This meeting has proper support of like 12 clubs. Valencia and At. Madrid lose more than they gain out of attending this.

 

[Phatroonaldo]

As shown by the diagram, Valencia and Atletico get worse deals with in both situations so the chances of them agreeing is nil.

PL generates about twice the amount of money than La liga does, thus comparing the situation in PL and la liga is absurd. At least 60% of the fans in Spain support Barca and Madrid and so do the vast majority of the global fanbase of La Liga. Not remotely similar to PL.

Also, Premier league as a whole and the clubs were nowhere in Europe and global following after they started sharing revenue. The good results they're seeing now is all because of the good marketing and foreign investment(Billionaires of course). Attracting foreign investment and marketing is the responsibility of the respective clubs.The midtable PL teams have done a great job at this. Whereas the same cannot be said about the respective liga clubs.

Sevilla, Villareal and co. could try and take advantage of a golden Barca and Madrid generation and the recent european domination by Barca which has caused increase in popularity of La liga. Will they attempt to do so is a different matter.

If the deal takes place, the only competitiveness in la liga will be because of Barca and Madrid getting shittier; thus making La Liga worse overall, in European terms and as marketing contenders for the EPL. The league will become more competitive but at what cost?

 

[Metaphysical]

Valencia will never go along with this, neither will Atleti.

all that has to happen is for Barça and Madrid to take a hit from their own share and give Sevilla & Villarreal more money. coz that's all they really want. they talk about the health of La Liga but they're just in it for themselves. they don't give a fuck about the real victims of the current system: the lower half of the table.

 

[Metaphysical]

why is the points gap between Real and Valencia so big? because the bottom half of La Liga is of a much higher standard than the bottom half of the PL, and takes more points off positions 3-10 as a result. this makes it harder for teams to catch Barcelona and Real, who have gotten the hang of mowing down the competition (I'll get to why in a second).

this wasn't always the case, though. in fact it's a very recent phenomenon. as recent as the summer of 2009. after seeing Barça win a Treble and thump them 2-6, Real went out and spent somethin' like 200 million in one summer to assemble a super squad and compete with them. then we saw the 99-96-71 "fucking barbaric" points total of 09/10, and then the equally mental 96-92-71 of last season.

but even in that Treble season of 08/09, it wasn't that bad: 87-78-70 is a balanced distribution of points between the top three.

really, looking at these totals, it becomes apparent that La Liga's competitive inequality is less about TV money and more about Messi and Cristiano. the ridiculous goalscoring exploits of these two over the last couple of years - Cristiano has 86 in that period, Messi 100 (one hundred goals in two years ffs!) - is what has made the difference in Barcelona and Real destroying the smaller teams and racking up such huge points totals.

financial inequality does exist and does need to be addressed, but unless taking half of Barça's TV money would stop Messi from being the best player in the World or Cristiano from scoring goals for fun, it won't change much in La Liga.

if only Valencia had been able to build Nou Mestalla.

 

[House of Flies]

To continue your argument, Meta, Messi and Ronaldo have continued their goal scoring feats in CL as well regardless of their competition. Messi is a superhuman.

 

[oz187]

I havent contradicted myself because Getafe hasnt made one bad move. Valencia made a bad move with Soler's premature plans but now, under new management, they are getting smart.

No it is a contradiction. You can't on the one hand say teams will definitely overpay and on the other hand say clubs are getting smart. If Valencia are getting smart, then they would spend that 20M a year really well and become more competitive. They wouldn't even need to spend it necessarily. If they had that they could have kept Mata in addition to the other new arrivals. Villarreal could have kept Cazorla in addition to the squad they have now. They may not be in the title race come April but both would be more competitive.

...Real went out and spent somethin' like 200 million in one summer to assemble a super squad and compete with them. then we saw the 99-96-71 "fucking barbaric" points total of 09/10, and then the equally mental 96-92-71 of last season.

but even in that Treble season of 08/09, it wasn't that bad: 87-78-70 is a balanced distribution of points between the top three.

It's interesting to see that the 3rd place team has been consistent at 70-71 points.

really, looking at these totals, it becomes apparent that La Liga's competitive inequality is less about TV money and more about Messi and Cristiano.

Well without TV money there would be no Cristiano. Barca have come to this situation because of long term vision coming to fruition and La Masia giving them a production line of superstar players and the foundation of one of the best squads in history. Real Madrid competed by buying a squad of superstar players. Also in 08/09 Barca won the title early, but since then have been pushed all the way. If Madrid hadn't spent like they had, these last two seasons both they and Barca would probably have a lower points total.

 

[Metaphysical]

yup. 3rd place hasn't moved.

what happened was the top two started winning at a relentless pace. this is a combination of Messi & Zlatan for us, and Mourinho & Cristiano for Real. if people think back, Mourinho did the same thing in England. every match must be won. so he forces his competitors to play at that same insanely high level too. under his guidance, Chelsea won the PL with 95 and 91 points.

 

[Aryagorn]

That del Nido guy, is he a gangster Italian mafiaso type or what!? Every time there's noise it's him who's heading the mob. And it's already established he's a bloody money whore and does nothing much for the club in the first place. Bloody hypocrite