Chainsaw
Killahead
Or even better
Madridista translation: Messi could not perform without Ronaldinho-Eto'o, therefore C. Ronaldo is better!
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Madridista translation: Messi could not perform without Ronaldinho-Eto'o, therefore C. Ronaldo is better!
Raed
Dr. Raed St. Claire
.First of all Xavi is a fucking beast...
Next I think you're extremely overrating his effect on some of our players in you post. Don't get me wrong he is very important and I totally agree with the portion of your post regarding his style and I like the way you broke it down.
No I am not extremely overrating his effect on your team, but there is always a pinch of salt added to make a point come across. Your players are magnificent, no doubt, but they need an enabler, and that is Xavi. You can see in his absence they miss him.
However, Alves being shit with Brazil in the Copa wasn't due to Xavi bro, even if Xavi was there, his crossing would still have been shit, and his defensive blunders would've still been there. Xavi might've helped Brazil as a whole if he was there and hence Alves might've had more chances to do something, but Alves on the individual level had a poor Copa, simple as.
I can meet you half way there, but a huge part of the reason as to why Alves looked exposed is because he plays so far up the field and takes a while to come back, without Xavi's time on the ball, the opposition will always overwhelm a very attacking full back. That firstly affects his defensive duties, which in return takes away from his offensive ones. Alves was used an outlet in the absence of Marcelo, but he couldn't do that for two reasons, he isn't a pitch long ball carrier, and he did not have the cover from Ramires. He likes to be played into space especially in the final third, and offered options for a quick combination, something Xavi made available for him easily. Admitedly though, Alves combines exceptionally well with Messi too.
Messi trying to take over Xavi's role should not be attributed to Xavi not being there, but the coach being a damn idiot and repeating the same mistake his junkie predecessor did. They simply fail to utilize their squad in a way that would free Messi from having to attempt to carry the whole fucking team, which is a bit too heavy for his back. Not every team must have a 'Xavi', there were many formations and tactical plans that were suggested in our very own Argentina thread that, I would bet some money on it, would've relieved Messi off some of the unrealistic pressure and allowed him to do his thing.
Point being, which is what I am trying to get across here is that to free Messi the way you guys want would require two more men in midfield, so 5 as opposed to 3. So, my point was that Messi looked a shadow of himself without Xavi not that he sucked balls, because he missed his enabler. I said Messi is overwhelmed, not shit. Yanno?
The truth is that Messi wasn't trying to be Argentina's Xavi, he was trying to be Argentina's Messavi, which is a tad too much, but we all know how Messi is.
Again, goes back to what I said overwhelmed
Completely disagree about Pedro. Its his unreal workrate and amazing clutchness that makes him unique, and overshadows his rather 'limited abilities' relatively speaking when speaking about Barcelona. Xavi definitely helps him shine as he does with everyone, but that's definitely not what makes Pedro an above average player.
Pedro's work rate is perhaps the most under rated key component in Barcelona's fine balance. I appreciate his contribution as much as anyone else (or, do not appreciate his contribution), but what makes him truly stand out (and by that, I mean CL final first goal stand out type of shit) is when Xavi stares him down and offers him a pass he can't refuse. Pedro wouldn't fuck with Xavi's passes, it also helps that he is a cheeky motherfucker with a killer finish. There are a few players who have the ability to make Pedro look magnificent, like remove him from the shadows and put him into the spot light, like guti, de la pena, cazorla, and Zidane. the first two failed to reach Xavi's heights for all their talents, the third plays simple football at top level (not quite world class) and the fourth is a football legend and Xavi is up there with him every step of the way.
Another essential factor is that Messi and Alves sometimes tend to struggle because they are playing in a completely different system with their national teams. The Spanish players play a simillar style with their national so its much easier to get into their groove for them. Its not just Xavi bro, its a whole system, Xavi is a part of that system, and even Xavi himself will not be his same commanding self if he played in a team that plays with a different approach. The way we play the game in itself helps make Xavi what he is, our system takes advantage of every single quality Xavi has, which is why he owes Pep so much.
Difficult to argue with that, because to complete the paradox about his game he would need players who understand him just as much as he understands them. After all, he cannot be generous with selfish or shit players
I don't believe Xavi is the heart of our team, but rather the pacemaker...
El Maestro it is.
Raed
Dr. Raed St. Claire
HA! You won't find a man with more refined taste in football than me mate. Fuck you all for taking what I said out of context. I said I don't enjoy Xavis football as mch as Iniestas. But can you blame me for enjoying Casper a little more?
There is not a midfielder out there in the world who I think is better than Xavi but Iniesta is the flair.
E
estranged
Guest
Haha. Sorry that was just a cheap shot by me, I agree...I enjoy watching Iniesta more than Xavi too, Iniesta is more sporadic than Xavi while Xavi keeps it simple and tends to do a lot of the utility work (which is actually more imporrtant).
Anyways you were coming up with loads of good points, and I agree to an extent with you. But you should be more careful about how you get them across though(your explanations). You are right about Alves getting exposed for Brazil and not for Barca, and your explanation as to why that is case is correct. At Barca he can bomb forward without worrying about getting back (although he works his off and gets back to his position most of the time) but given that his team concede pressure through posession he has a lot fo time to get back, he doesn't have that luxury when playing for Brazil, but that is not entirely down to Xavi it's down to all of the Barca team, Alves is critical to Barca's possession football too.
See this is somewhat of a flaw in your argument that Messi needs Xavi to tick, equally Barca/Xavi/Pedro need Messi. That Xavi pass to Pedro was made possible mostly by the fact that Messi had dragged Evra so much out of position which allowed that gap for Xavi's pass and all the time and space in the world for Pedro. Of course Messi is better with Xaviesta, but it works both ways, Messi's presence itself opens up so many gaps for Xaviesta to exploit with their passes, let alone how he actually makes use of their passes (converts them rather than fucking them up)...no player on the plant would have made such great use of Iniesta's genius pass which got the first goal at the nou camp against Arsenal.
Anyways you were coming up with loads of good points, and I agree to an extent with you. But you should be more careful about how you get them across though(your explanations). You are right about Alves getting exposed for Brazil and not for Barca, and your explanation as to why that is case is correct. At Barca he can bomb forward without worrying about getting back (although he works his off and gets back to his position most of the time) but given that his team concede pressure through posession he has a lot fo time to get back, he doesn't have that luxury when playing for Brazil, but that is not entirely down to Xavi it's down to all of the Barca team, Alves is critical to Barca's possession football too.
Alves starts/leads many Barcelona attacks, even better than Maicon IMO. He does it so often you would lose count but as an example the 1-1 at the Nou Camp this season. He has Barca's second highest assist rate (and La Liga's 2nd I think) just behind Messi. His one twos with messi cut through defences like a hot knife through butter, his one touch football is out of this world, and his runs into space constantly wreaks havoc and drags defenders out fo psoition which enables Messi/Pedro to get into dangerous positions.
See this is somewhat of a flaw in your argument that Messi needs Xavi to tick, equally Barca/Xavi/Pedro need Messi. That Xavi pass to Pedro was made possible mostly by the fact that Messi had dragged Evra so much out of position which allowed that gap for Xavi's pass and all the time and space in the world for Pedro. Of course Messi is better with Xaviesta, but it works both ways, Messi's presence itself opens up so many gaps for Xaviesta to exploit with their passes, let alone how he actually makes use of their passes (converts them rather than fucking them up)...no player on the plant would have made such great use of Iniesta's genius pass which got the first goal at the nou camp against Arsenal.
Ocurrente
New member
moral support?
Myrmecophile
Mr. Japes
#winning
Catalonian Devil
Shukran Pep
Now that sounds much more sensible then that first post, he is indeed an enabler, and the best there is, and its only natural that players who are used to him will miss him when he's not around.
He's that kind of luxury that you get so accustomed to involuntarily, you only feel its quality once it goes missing, but that shouldn't take away from our players ability to perform at a high level even without him.
Bottom line is, Xavi spoiled the fuck out of the Barca players.
Ode to Django
You're not even a real journalism
Well Spain sucked in the recent friendly vs Italy without the main man, and Pirlo ran the show (i know it was only a friendly & Spain probably don't even care) but still the man is essential for both Spain & Barca for possesion football. The Messi for Argentina reminds me somewhat of the England case, it's never the players fault always the coaches/tactics that are wrong.
M
mitkoa7x
Guest
Spain didnt care at all, Del Bosque had a huge grin on his face even when it was 2-1.
VincevvZ
New member
ok i may sound stupid saying this, but is someone able to explain me why there are so many xavi critics? saying he talks too much shit, hes a cheater, a sneaky bastard and so on. ive seen a lot of barca games ofcourse, and ive read a lot of xavi interviews and to me he looks like quite a humble person. i know he said some stuff about mourinho not bringing anything new to football, which imo is not true as i think mourinho is a great trainer doing things many others cant. but other than this occasion he seems to me as a man who is very sympathetic to the people surrounding him, a man who loves his friends and family and so on. i know a lot of xavi haters are just madridstas hating everything that has to do with Barca, but tell me, why is xavi such a cheeky bastard? 
Ode to Django
You're not even a real journalism
He is very opinionated and says what he thinks and argues with officials (most of the time he's right to do so) i think thats why most aren't to keen on him
LaMessiah
New member
Don't forget a lot of english fans, especially arsenal for all his comments about Cesc.
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