10 - Lionel Messi - v1

[Hatem Ben Arfa]

so are you suggesting that having a lot of footage of a player, a lot of videos to analyze their play... is immortalizing them? and i guess having next to no footage of a player doesn't make them prone to an exaggerated, inflated notion?


seems legit

no.

when I say immortalized, I mean that it will be there FOREVER for generations to see.

and I am not basing my opinions on Pele just on the little video footage there is of him.

 

[Doobs]

Original offside rule
The offside rule formed part of the original rules in 1863 but it was a far remove from the law as we know it today. Any attacking player ahead of the ball was deemed to be offside - meaning early tactical systems featured as many as eight forwards, as the only means of advancing the ball was by dribbling or scrimmaging as in rugby. In the late 1860s, the FA made the momentous decision to adopt the three-player rule, where an attacker would be called offside if positioned in front of the third-last defender. Now the passing game could develop.

Despite the unification of the rules and the creation of the FA in 1863, disputes, largely involving Sheffield clubs who had announced their own set of ideas in 1857, persisted into the late 1870s. However, the creation of the International Football Association Board (IFAB) finally put an end to all arguments. Made up of two representatives from each of the four associations of the United Kingdom (England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland), the IFAB met for the first time on 2 June 1886 to guard the Laws of the Game. Then, as today, a three-quarters majority was needed for a proposal to be passed.

Yeah it did exist

Anyway i still think scoring goals was far easier in that time, then it is now, no doubt.
Maradona>Messi>Pele

 

[FiReFTW]

lol @ hatem ben arfa

 

[Bilal Khan]

I came here to see some good discussion... HBA has been spoiling the thread with Pele crap.

 

[Aryagorn]

This should be good read for you: http://www.bagsynotin.net/2010/04/pele-the-myth-of-1000-goals/

In 1971, finally the first national championships formed. Pele had just entered his 30’s. That first season, Pele made 21 appearances for Santos… and scored a solitary goal. In the same national competition the next season, he scored 5 in 16 appearances. Was Pele past his peak at this point? Perhaps. But during the same seasons state championships, he was still scoring at a rate of a goal every other game, indicating the differing strength of opponent Pele could have faced consistently through his career had circumstances been different.



holy fuck Pele, you bastard!!

 

[Raed]

Xavi has assisted none of Messi's 34 Liga goals this season, and Messi is nothing without Xavi.

I think I proved that already, didn't I?

 

[dalitis8]

Is Pele the most overhyped player of all times?

 

[Raed]

Is Pele the most overhyped player of all times?

No, that Messi is indeed activated to his fullest potential because of Xavi.

 

[Hatem Ben Arfa]

In 1971, finally the first national championships formed. Pele had just entered his 30’s. That first season, Pele made 21 appearances for Santos… and scored a solitary goal. In the same national competition the next season, he scored 5 in 16 appearances. Was Pele past his peak at this point? Perhaps. But during the same seasons state championships, he was still scoring at a rate of a goal every other game, indicating the differing strength of opponent Pele could have faced consistently through his career had circumstances been different.



holy fuck Pele, you bastard!!

it is widely accepted that Pele was in his prime at 18 years of age, not 31

 

[Phatroonaldo]

yeah, an 18 year old boy named Pele scoring 66 goals in a single season in Brazilian league at a time when Brazil league was the best in the world (Campeones Del Mundo multiple times and they all played in Brazil) is not that impressive at all. Let's just belittle that because every game ended 8-3

funny, I could have sworn at times this season Pep has played on 3 at the back and a 7 in midfield that camps in the oppostion half playing keep ball and probing for a goal.

besides we only won 5-3 a few days ago

The problem is you're trying to compare goalscoring records between different eras. A goal per match during that time was not uncommon, a goal per match in this era is freak stuff.

Bican, Pele, Puskas, Eusebio, Muller; those are the famous players with records of a goal per game or more. Then you have much less known players like Luis Artime (261 Goals/ 300 Games),Telmo Zarra (333 Goals/ 352 Games), Just Fontaine (200 Goals/ 240 Games), Ferenc Deak (547 Goals/ 400 Games), Uwe Seeler (446 Goals/ 520 Games), Sandor Kocsis (418 Goals/ 470 Games), Franz Binder (1006 goals/ 756 Games).

The only reason you won't hear about these players is because it was not out of ordinary. When there are ten other players with similar goalscoring record, it's not that impressive anymore.

Hard to do? Sure. But extraordinary? No.

When you try compare eras, you miss out the progress that has happened in the way the game is played.Not just in football, it's the case in every sport. Paul Morphy may have been a prodigy of his era but Kasparov would pummel him every single time.

 

[mitkoa7x]

I cant believe there is still doubt as to who is the best player of all times...

 

[mixer]

 

[Yugi]

so are you suggesting that having a lot of footage of a player, a lot of videos to analyze their play... is immortalizing them? and i guess having next to no footage of a player doesn't make them prone to an exaggerated, inflated notion?


seems legit

myth = busted

 

[Aryagorn]

it is widely accepted that Pele was in his prime at 18 years of age, not 31

okay. Now read that post again and then reply

 

[La LL]

you really can't remain civil and have a debate. you just have to get personal don't you.

I can agree to respect your differing opinion and not get personal and take the mick. why can't you?

I'm saying that you have an annoying habit of crashing a thread if there's a positive debate or celebration going on. We win a game? Iniesta is jealous of Messi. We win another game? Fabregas is falling out with Pep. Messi scores 55 goals? It's not enough because Pele scored more. You drop your opinions at the worst possible time. You're so transparent that if something is even slightly suggestive of anything out of the ordinary in a game, everyone knows you'll be there to blitzkrieg the shit out of any win we might have afterwards. Even if there isn't (like now or well... I'm surprised you haven't turned this into an Alexis vs. Messi feud like you've done before).

Same with this vague Pele bullshit that you're pulling out of thin air. There was no need to bring that up, everyone was just happy that Messi had scored 55 goals. Sure it's somewhat a decent debate and I'm not saying it's not an interesting one but learn your timing.

It's like if a friend of yours is having a birthday. Do you crash the party and tell him the presents he got were shit compared to the ones given at another birthday last week?