11 - Neymar Jr. - v4

[Flavia]

It could be worse without him. As the current path this board is taking, not really renewing the squad, can cause many troubles in the future.

 

[FC B]

also the fact is that neymar in barca for 3 seasons, he played great for only one season (when i say great i mean as expected because he is most expensive player in the world), and this is not the same season, its first half of this one and second half of season last year, so his big problem is inconsistency, about his lifestyle, i dont care, just deliver on the pitch and do what you want out of it.

No, he isn't the most expensive player in the world.

 

[Icarium]

I told a few pages ago that I think that CR7 is an idiot as a person.
Since he plays for Real, we all mock him. And it is ok to say that he is an idiot as a person.
But what, if he would sign for us (for some strange reason), should I start to write posts how I love his personality, how he is not an asshole and similar, since he would be our player suddenly?
(Well, Ney is not CR7, but you'll get what I am trying to say)

So i would like to what is your opinion on Alba? Do you like his "personality" or hate his "personality"?

Anyway Neymar's supposed bad form only lasted for like 1 and half months (His post ballon ceremony was average not good enough though, but post villarreal match very bad). Sadly it coincided with our most important fixtures, this is straight after coming from International break. Entire team had a dip in form. But it was huge in Neymar's case. Even Suarez and Messi were not that brilliant during that period but they are more developed and matured players so it was not that alarming. Hopefully that will change this season. How hard is it hope for a better scenario than criticizing him for everything? He carried the barca team during messi's absence. Only very few can achieve that. Very few. No you are convinced how neymar is a failure and we should sell him and buy pogba or we are screwed right? And your idea of replacement was freaking Reus. Just brilliant.

Lets wait for one more season to have this discussion, if the hot cold form gets worse then it is a concern. Until then it is a non-issue. Players can't perform at highest level every match. That is messi level of brilliance we are talking about. Even he has some off games less it maybe.

 

[DonAK]

What's this lifestyle and personality thing?

Bring Oleguer back then? Nice guy and drove a van. Didn't care about money.

 

[BBZ8800]

So i would like to what is your opinion on Alba? Do you like his "personality" or hate his "personality"?

Alba is an idiot sometimes, but it is not affecting his play too much.
Sometimes he gets yellow cards for no reason and gets into fights, but he isn't hurting a team too much.

Neymar fights more with other players than Alba.
Neymar parties more than Alba.
Neymar is hot and cold more than Alba.

So, I have a problem with Neymar and his personality which is causing him all these problems.
And since he is our player, those his problems are hurting our team also.

Anyway Neymar's supposed bad form only lasted for like 1 and half months (His post ballon ceremony was average not good enough though, but post villarreal match very bad). Sadly it coincided with our most important fixtures, this is straight after coming from International break. Entire team had a dip in form. But it was huge in Neymar's case. Even Suarez and Messi were not that brilliant during that period but they are more developed and matured players so it was not that alarming. Hopefully that will change this season. How hard is it hope for a better scenario than criticizing him for everything? He carried the barca team during messi's absence. Only very few can achieve that. Very few. No you are convinced how neymar is a failure and we should sell him and buy pogba or we are screwed right? And your idea of replacement was freaking Reus. Just brilliant.

I would personally sell him this summer if someone is offering 150-180m.
But I am not a board, so don't worry.

Lets wait for one more season to have this discussion, if the hot cold form gets worse then it is a concern. Until then it is a non-issue. Players can't perform at highest level every match. That is messi level of brilliance we are talking about. Even he has some off games less it maybe.

Ok, let's make a bet:
1. if he will play better=awesome. (Of course, some haters will still whine)
2. if he will have another hot and cold season, some of users will lose their faith in Neymar (just like Vlom lost it this season, compared to a last season)
But, majority of fans will reply this in a summer 2017:
"But he is young, he is only 25. He will be better and more mature in upcoming years."
"But he is a future Ballon D Or winner"
"But he is our future"
"What other player could we buy?"
"But, when on form, he is almost as good as Messi and Cr7"
"But when Messi was injured, he was so good"
"All players have dips in form"

Did I mention already the best answer of all time "But he is so young, he is only 25, he has so much potential, he is our future."
Let's make a bet about that.

Also, I don't get this reply: "He is only 24", lol.
He is 24 already and people are making excuses how that is a very young age and that he will improve (a lot?) in upcoming years.
I won't even compare him to a young Messi when Messi was 24.

For example, Ronaldinho when he was 24, he didn't need excuses (that he is "only" 24):

Or young Samuel Etoo.
He also didn't need excuses that he is only 24.

I mean, Neymar is supposed to be the next Ballon D Or, or our future leader, our future best player, a future everything.
But, then, if we dare to compare him with Messi, people will say: lol, don't compare him with Messi. Ok, fine.
If we compare him to other Barca's level of world class forwards of his age, like Ronaldinho or Etoo, people have excuses again.
Ronnie was a better player than Neymar aged 24.
Ronnie was an insane leader aged 24.
You could have relied on Ronnie in that age. He would almost never disappoint you.
Ronnie was even ok off-field aged 24.

Etoo?
He was (imo) also a better player than Neymar aged 24.
He wasn't hot and cold aged 24.
You could have relied on Etoo back then. In small matches and in key CL matches.
Twitter/Snapchat weren't distracting him aged 24.

(Ronnie and Etoo played in a world without cheat-codes, aka having a Messi in your team)

So, other similar Barca's legends and our forwards were grown and responsible men and leaders aged 24, but when you look at Ney, we get excuses:
"But he is young. He is (only, lol) 24. He has the best days infront of him"

Should I dare to mention another problem that pacey wingers and pacey forwards usually have their peak earlier than Cms or Cbs, who peak in late 20s or around 30?

Neymar will be 25 at the end of the next season.
If he will still act like a kid, if he won't be a leader, and if he'll be hot and cold, then until WHEN should we wait his "golden years"?

 

[Flavia]

If we will win a CL, my Neyhate will drop significantly to extremely low levels, you have my word

I wonder what a high level would be, then

 

[Trickykid]

I'm very sorry, [MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION], but I honestly don't put a whole lot of faith into the opinions of those so called well known forum members (some more than others, obviously, but please don't be so naive to assume that post count equals post quality). Especially so when most of it seem to have been written in the heat of the moment. And as Flavia and others have already stated, you could easily replicate that trick with the likes of Messi, Piqué, Masch, Dani and probably everyone else tbh, in order to make them look like terrible players.

Nice legwork, though. Must've taken a bit...

 

[Total-Football]

And even if he was the most humble guy off the field, like Xavi or Puyol, I still wouldn't be pleased with his displays in Barca in these 3 seasons, considering that we invested already 200 Millions in him over 3 seasons.

200 Millions invested in Neymar is one of the reasons why we don't have (too much) money today for a RB, Cbs, LB or a 4th striker of a better quality.

i agree about yout summary and the perspective of fans .. i personally think that anyone who dodges the taxes should be incarcerated , and if they on messi's or neymar's money , the sanctions should be doubled .. it's a disgraceful act , but that's my point of view about life , this is a forum about football , i will be damned if i wish to see messi or neymar doing time.

but my problem with your post is the very last part that i have quote , when you combine the transfer fee and the salary of several years and you put it like that (200M) , i think that's kinda cheap , it's a way of juking the stats , Neymar transfer fee was around 85-90 Millions that's it , no need to invent a new way of delivering the numbers just to show a point .. if we were to use the same formula for messi than the numbers would be astronomical. you are doing the same shit barca haters were doing when bayern defeated us in 2013 , they invented a new way of showing a result ( 7-0 ) which is false and show how butthurt they were .. Barca lost 4-0 and 3-0 and we never took 7.

we can't buy new ones because we have players on huge salary , somehow you ignore that fact that messi earns more than the double of Ney's and Suarez who also earns more and you went straight to Neymar , right

we are challenging for the treble every single year and Neymar is one of the three decisive players who help doing it .. Money doesnt mean everything my brother .. Liverpool got 80 Millions for Suarez, spent all of if and they ain't got a single decent player with that money , this is not Pro Evolution Soccer , you can sell neymar for 190 Millions , buy world class players with that Sum just for them to fail .. Real life is not ( pace 99, acceleration 86 etc .. ) just remember when schvshenko went to chealsea and how he was before .Neymar is well integrated into our squad , knows his role , he finally understood our way of playing and he has done some effort to adapt with sucesss . appreciate that and be happy , because a world class player in hand is better than 3 " potential ones "

 

[iniesta_8]

Sell and buy Eden Hazard.

 

[Total-Football]

[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION] i have just read why you said about messi .. classic case of " to prove that messi is god let's put the blame on everybody else " .. i would have saved myself the reply

 

[xXKonan]

Neymar's agent Ribeiro said there's three teams that are willing to pay Neymar's buyout clause (Likely United,Real,PSG). But he also said Neymar is happy in Barcelona.

http://jovempan.uol.com.br/esportes...s-clubes-se-dispoem-pagar-multa-ao-barca.html

I think he will renew obviously, but his agent and dad will forever be a pain in the ass to deal with.

 

[DonAK]

If it ever comes to his dad and agent trying to take him elsewhere(and potentially mess up his career for their own financial gain) then we should make whichever team that comes pay the buyout and the taxes. Show no mercy.

IF it comes to that ofc.

Hopefully the guy is smart enough to value his career and legacy ahead of his entourage's selfish desires.

 

[xXKonan]

With Neymar's dad his goal is pretty clear at least "all about the money"

Neymar's agent though Ribeiro? Dude is a flat out Madridista. His goal and only goal is for Ney to be a Madrid player not matter how bad his reputation sinks. I remember his shitty rant awhile ago on Instagram that he was flat out mad and blamed Ney's dad for all the problems Neymar is having and it could've been solved if he went to Madrid.

Ney, Could've gone to Real years ago but he didn't and decided he wanted to play at Barca with Messi. Frankly Neymar would be better off without having Ribero around that's for sure.

 

[BBZ8800]

we can't buy new ones because we have players on huge salary , somehow you ignore that fact that messi earns more than the double of Ney's and Suarez who also earns more and you went straight to Neymar , right

How I see Messi is that Messi turned our club into a current Barca.
We won 4 Cls with him and 7 La ligas in 11 years.
We have never achieved something like that in our whole history, in any era.

People will now say, but we had Xavi, Iniesta, Pep, 100s of things.
Yes, yes, a team needs 100 factors to come on top, but in my eyes, Messi is and was 50-70% of everything we won and achieved.
We would have won some titles with this team even without Messi, but we would never reached the current greatness.

In that sense, I don't care how much Messi earns, since he returned every single penny invested in him.
Or, he returned 2-3x times more than we invested (probably).

About Ney, it is all about personal opinions.
For example:
Messi has a high wage? =I don't care. I think that he deserves it and he is worth it
Suarez has a high wages? =I don't care. I think that he deserves it and he is worth it
Neymar has a high wages? =oh, well I care. Since I don't think that he deserves even the current transfer fee and a current wages. And he is especially not worth his new wages

And it all comes down again to how you see him.
If I remember your old posts, I think that you are pleased with Neymar at Barca.
So, if you are pleased, you probably think that there are no better guys for a LW and you are ok with his wages.

I said a lot of times, he is way behind M-S duo in my eyes, and I believe that our current team would be of the equal strength with Messi-Suarez-and someone else on the left (for 60-70 millions), plus 100m invested on other positions or on a Cm.

But no need to enter the same discussion again, like: who is better on the left, and a Cm+new winger are not better than Neymar.

You asked why I didn't mention Messi's wages, this is my explanation.
In my eyes, Messi is worth it.
Suarez is worth it.
Iniesta is worth it.
Busi is worth it.
Those guys are paid a lot, and they deliver. More or less constantly.

About Ney's delivery we have written 1000s pages.

Neymar is well integrated into our squad , knows his role , he finally understood our way of playing and he has done some effort to adapt with sucesss . appreciate that and be happy , because a world class player in hand is better than 3 " potential ones "

It is again a matter of how you look at it.
You can say:
1. that Ney is integrated and everything will be fine
2. on the other hand, I care about CL's the most. And since I have experienced tons of pain in 90s and early 00s watching our team losing every year in 100s of funny/unlucky/stupid ways to any random European giant (you have watched it too, if I remember your posts), then you'll realize how blessed our team/our fans are currently with having a Goat Messi, and other world class players around him
Nothing can guarantee a CL title, but if in April 2017, Messi and Suarez will play well, and if Neymar will again have spring-holidays and if we somehow lose because of his lack of effort, I will really go to Barcelona and kick his ass

I mean, this is not about Neymar and hating Neymar.
This is about Barca.
If you face Real, with 3 on form forwards in Cr7, Bale and Benzema.
And imagine that we have 2 and a half on form guys (Messi, Suarez and hot off form Ney), then we will probably lose (let's say that 2 guys couldn't fight alone against Real' team, we lacked something).
People will say: but all players have runs of a bad form.
But again, my point is: this guy is the most inconsistent player in our current team, and he is on paper the 2nd highest paid player, right?

You can say that everything is fine, but I see nothing in Neymar or in the way how he acts onfield or off field which suggests that he is improving, maturing, getting more consistent and similar.
All I see is that he is acting like a movie star more and more, while his on field displays are more or less the same, or more hot and cold in each new season.

So, sorry if I am a pessimist, but I am pissed at him, because we spent so much money on him, I am pissed about how he plays for us, and I am pissed about a prospect of losing another 1-2 CL years (maybe Messi's last world class years) with a guy who goes MIA in every April because he can't be concentrated on football for more than 2-3-4 Months in a row.

Sorry again for my pessimistic posts and I also hope that I am wrong about Ney's future and his motivation and concentration on football.
But I can't be so relaxed about him, as you and other users with replies: everything is fine, he is only 24, he will get better.

 

[Total-Football]

[MENTION=16942]BBZ8800[/MENTION] so many fucked up things in your comment i don't know where to begin , but i'll just say some important things :

1- if - arguibly - the best team ever needed a minute 93's goal and several awful décisions from ref to get us to the final .. than no team ever can garantee to play the final every single year .. Neymar or Maradonna or any one .. if your criteria of a succuss is the champions league than prepare yourself for depression , because we can hand you a 500 M budget and you can't garantee us the big eared trophy .. we just played the final last year to refresh your memory , the competition which reflects the consistency and the power of a team is LaLiga , and we're winning it back to back with Neymar been decisive especially during the period when messi got injured , because everybody panicked and rightfully so .

2- if you don't care about messi's wages or suarez 's wages that's your problem , Raul was the best goalscorer in the history of real Madrid , even got em a couple of champions leagues , late in his career , not only he was huge on salary , but him being a forced starter literally was the cause of madrid's self fucking ,the idea of worshipping a player to the detriment of a team have no place in my school of thought , messi is barca's employee , he get's paid to do what he's doing , i appreciate everything , i consider him the best ever , but the day when he's not fit to start, i would fearlessly vocalize that .. and this " team messi " " team neymar " type of mentality , i don't fuck with that .. the day Neymar starts to slow ala ronaldinho " 2007" is the day i would call for selling him , i wouldn't give a fuck if he singlehandedly won us 3 champions leagues .. so just spare me enumerating messi's achievement that changes nothing , he's not exempt of any discussion to me , whethere economical or footballistic.

3- as for the part where you say u don't care about suarez , messi , buskets , iniesta salaries you only care about neymar's.. that part makes absoultely nonsense so i abstain

4- Neymar didnt cost us big money .. his fee is aroun 85 - 90 Max and his salary is 10 M per year .. there are players half his abilities who make far more ( especially in the EPL ) and as for his transfer fee .. Renato 50 M Bale 107 M i don't even have to add more.