Arturo Vidal

BBZ8800

BBZ8800

Senior Member
Sumlit, something more:
Barca from 2009-2011:

1. never overcame a match when we were losing in a CL knockouts, right?
The only case is Chelsea 2009, when we were helped by refs.
2. whenever we had to turn the match around, we lost (Inter 2010, Chelsea 2012), as always=lack of a mental strength and character to turn the match.
3. further, we didn't face any physical team back then.
We faced Chelsea, and won due to referees and the only shot on goal (iniesta).
The next 2 times when we faced thugs: Inter 2010, Chelsea 2012, surprise surprise, we lost again.

So, both Pep's Barca and post Pep's Barca almost never turned a tie around (except rare occasions: Psg and Milan, iirc).
In majority of cases, when we were losing=we turned into a sinking ship.

Also, both Pep's and post Pep Barca lost almost every single match against thugs teams, except 2015' against Bayern who had 8 injured players, right?
That is something like 1 or 2 wins out of 8-9 matches, right?

So, to some extent, even famous Pep's Barca:
1. suffered against thugs
2. suffered on away matches
3. suffered when we were losing 0:1 in CL knockout matches

So, imo: we ONLY had insane technique.
And once when a technique disappeared, you have a current Barca.
Juve 0:3, Roma 0:3, Atletico 0:2, Atletico 0:1, Bayern 0:4, Chelsea 0:1, Inter 1:3.

We always lose to thugs.
We always lose to aggressive, physical teams.
We can never overturn a tie against aggressive physical teams.

Should we continue in the same way, and hope that a light technical controller like Arthur or Thiago will magically solve the problem?
They will= if a draw will be generous and if we'll face only Shakhtar, Porto, Leverkusen, Arsenal and Man Utd until the final.
If we draw any other thug team, we are dead, as always.
 
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KingMessi

KingMessi

SiempreBlaugrana
Rot starts at the head. If the club thinks that the team lacks character, then they should look no further than Valverde. He should be the first to go. After all it's his complacency and lack of planning that fucked us in the CL.
 
Sumlit

Sumlit

San Claudio Bravo
BBZ8800 said:
You should have read the whole post then.
Luka Modric has technique, but Madrid has lots of physique, aggression, thughs, mental strength and CR7, the robot in terms of mental strength and coming back.

Barca 2009-2011 is the only team ever who won trophies without physique, thugs and mental strength.
But as you see, when we lost alienish technique, we can't win anymore.
The same as Spain, who are a bad copy of our famous style.

Both Barca and Spain died in the same moment, when insane technique was past it's prime.
Click to expand...

What thugs were there in 15 when they won the treble? Unless you somehow consider Mascherano a thug and him alone confers thugishness to the entire team.

It's pretty crazy that you would sit there and write that sextuple and treble winning teams had no mental strength.
 
Joan

Joan

Well-known member
BBZ8800 said:
.
Click to expand...

Very good post, BBZ. :thumbsup:

People can discuss if character is the right word to use, but the point stands. The team lacks hunger, natural drive, fighting spirit... that's not something you either do or don't have, can be lost over years. Guys who have won it all usually lose some of it. Could argue the same happened to our team.
 
KingMessi

KingMessi

SiempreBlaugrana
Hamzah said:
Cojones and mentalidad are an important aspect of football, no pseudo science
Click to expand...

Sure they are. And our players have it. Else they wouldn't have made it as professionals.

You can't make these kind of generalizations by looking at the players from afar. You only see part of the whole picture there. For BBZ and others to point out only certain games and make a character judgement on our players is entirely dishonest.
 
Sumlit

Sumlit

San Claudio Bravo
I'm not going to continue to argue the same thing. It's pretty laughable to me people sit here and claim that 09-11 team who DOMINATED football had no mental strength. It's just befuddling beyond belief.

No wonder they think the team now lacks character. They just don't understand what mental strength and character is.

Also, this weird fetish with physicality and thugs is very bizarre.
 
Joan

Joan

Well-known member
KingMessi said:
Rot starts at the head. If the club thinks that the team lacks character, then they should look no further than Valverde. He should be the first to go. After all it's his complacency and lack of planning that fucked us in the CL.
Click to expand...

Would be handy if removing Valverde solved all of our problems. As Messi983 pointed out, 5 different coaches, similar outcomes. Can't tell me Lucho had no character. It's plainly obvious to me some of our players started to lack fighting spirit. Sure, firing Valverde for a random madman might help, but can't dany players are to be blamed too.
 
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KingMessi

KingMessi

SiempreBlaugrana
Joan Laporta said:
Would be handy if removing Valverde solved all of our problems. As Messi983 pointed out, 5 different coaches, similar outcomes. Can't tell me Lucho had no character. It's plainly obvious to me some of our players started to lack fighting spirit. Sure, firing Mourinho for a random madman might help, but can't dany players are to be blamed too.
Click to expand...

Character + Tactical Accumen + Adapatability

Lucho didn't have the third. When his gameplan was figured out, it all went tits up.
 
Sumlit

Sumlit

San Claudio Bravo
Joan Laporta said:
Would be handy if removing Valverde solved all of our problems. As Messi983 pointed out, 5 different coaches, similar outcomes. Can't tell me Lucho had no character. It's plainly obvious to me some of our players started to lack fighting spirit. Sure, firing Mourinho for a random madman might help, but can't dany players are to be blamed too.
Click to expand...

What's this about 5 coaches same outcomes?
 
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