Bundesliga

[serghei]

Vidal is such a game changer though. His energy is like having two players on the pitch. He plays with passion and gets everyone around him playing better. He can close down so well and tackle, then when they have the ball he plays the ball simple and well, and can charge forward and score goals too.

I would say exactly the same about our Rakitic. Plays with passion, closes down players so well, he can tackle, he plays simple and well and can charge forward + score goals too. He is a great midfielder, but we have our share of those, in the first 11 at least.

 

[Hamzah]

Our players seem to be suffering post successful season syndrome where they aren't as intense in their training and it carries on to the games, we were the perfect example of focus last year but we seem to be taking it too easy now. If it carries on like this a top team would knock us out.

If we can get back to first half of this year form then that's a different story.

 

[Alik]

Our players seem to be suffering post successful season syndrome where they aren't as intense in their training and it carries on to the games, we were the perfect example of focus last year but we seem to be taking it too easy now. If it carries on like this a top team would knock us out.

If we can get back to first half of this year form then that's a different story.

We haven't even played the first match of the season yet.

There is no need to ostracize vigneshFCB, he is not a Bayern fan (you guys forgot his recent heated exchange with Ryu?), he is a Barca fan and a Guardiola fanboy, I think.

The problem is that all his comments are cheap shots at our team.

 

[vigneshFCB]

We haven't even played the first match of the season yet.



The problem is that all his comments are cheap shots at our team.

Check my comments history before you make such ridiculous statements. Saying that a fully fit Barca is better than a fully fit Bayern is a cheap shot? Check my discussion with that guy with the username Ryu-whatever.

 

[Yannik]

You forgot the bayernzone magic words: "If fit".

Seriously now, if we make an estimation:

Alves>Lahm, Pique>Boateng, Messi>Robben, Neymar>Costa, Suarez>Lewandowski, Busquets>Thiago.

I'll give you Neuer and Vidal, as Bayern players who would start for us. Alba vs Alaba, Mascherano vs Benatia is too close to call.

When has Alba vs Alaba ever been a close call, while Pique > Boateng is not? And Alves > Lahm is not AT LEAST up for a debate?
I think a blind guy could see the quality-differences between Bayern's and Barca's forwards, but you're maybe a little biased about some of the other positions.

 

[Ryu Hayabusa]

When has Alba vs Alaba ever been a close call, while Pique > Boateng is not? And Alves > Lahm is not AT LEAST up for a debate?
I think a blind guy could see the quality-differences between Bayern's and Barca's forwards, but you're maybe a little biased about some of the other positions.

+1
It's also weird to compare Thiago with Busquets (and then claim that the latter is easily better).

But I won't bother getting into any more of these debates.

 

[serghei]

When has Alba vs Alaba ever been a close call, while Pique > Boateng is not? And Alves > Lahm is not AT LEAST up for a debate?
I think a blind guy could see the quality-differences between Bayern's and Barca's forwards, but you're maybe a little biased about some of the other positions.

Since Alba scored the 2-0 goal in the European Championship final, something very very very few fullbacks manage to do, and been the best LB in La Liga along with Marcelo, and was a big part in our treble winning team. Alaba has done nothing Alba hasn't done in top football in terms of achievements. Style of play is of course open to subjectivism, of course most Bayern fans like Alaba's style more, while Barca fans do the same with Alba. But achievements are not, and I don't see a legit reason why Alba vs Alaba isn't a close call at LB (you can add Marcelo in the mix as he's as good as both - different style though).

Pique is better than Boateng currently (best CB in the world last season), and Lahm is mostly a midfielder these days, and even if he would play RB, Alves has been the best RB in the world in at least 5 of the last 8 seasons, including the last one.

Sure, Lahm brings more safety in defence, in the sense that you feel more secure with him at RB instead of Alves, but Dani does several important things going forward that Lahm just can't do, and that comes from the fact that he is technically superior -- a better passer and a better dribbler.

As I said, I'll give you Neuer and Vidal. I'd understand why a Bayern fan would also have Lahm over Alves, and Boateng over Pique (although for me Pique is better and has been one of the best CBs in the world for the most part of the last 6 years) and Alaba over Alba. 6 players from both teams are non-negotiable though so to speak, and would walk in the other team with ease. Neuer, Busquets, Vidal, Messi, Neymar, Suarez. Neuer is obvious, Vidal is one of the best box-to-box players in the world, and Busquets is one of the best and most gifted players to ever play at DM. Then you have Messi, Neymar, Suarez where it's clear, although I suppose you could have Lewandowski at CF and still have a great team, even though Suarez is a better striker. Depending on the system you could maybe find a place for Muller. That's about it. But, and I speak as a Barca fan, for our first 11, I would only take Neuer, Vidal, and maybe Boateng if he can play LCB, next to Pique (alhtough I have a feeling that might not work at all).

 

[Hamzah]

Player for player is cool, but you have to look at the overall unit and if they played like that or something similar, they are my early favourites for the CL, of course my opinion can change as i see more of the teams around Europe this season.

Remember the other factors like motivation, focus etc.

 

[Yannik]

Not going to start a debate about that now as it doesnt change anyones opinion anyway. You say you'd personally prefer these players positionweise over their Bayern-counterparts because: It works, so why change it? I think that is ok to say, but let me remind you that Alves-Lahm and Alaba-Alba comparisons individually have never really been a longlasting thing among 90% of football supporters and even large parts of Barca-fans, so your personal opinion is still basically your personal opinion and not certainly a thing everyone would agree with. If we assume this was a discussion not on barcaforum but on an open football-board, then you would have 11 replies in just 2 hours all quoting your comparisons about Alba and Alaba and Lahm and Alves, basically disagreeing and probably in a far less nicer way than I do.

Pique and Boateng are actually a thing worth a debate imo, sometimes Pique is better, sometimes Boateng is better and recently both are not having a worldclass start into the season. A 50/50 call, some like this guy, some like this guy. At least both are better than Ramos.

 

[vigneshFCB]

Since Alba scored the 2-0 goal in the European Championship final, something very very very few fullbacks manage to do, and been the best LB in La Liga along with Marcelo, and was a big part in our treble winning team. Alaba has done nothing Alba hasn't done in top football in terms of achievements. Style of play is of course open to subjectivism, of course most Bayern fans like Alaba's style more, while Barca fans do the same with Alba. But achievements are not, and I don't see a legit reason why Alba vs Alaba isn't a close call at LB (you can add Marcelo in the mix as he's as good as both - different style though).

Pique is better than Boateng currently (best CB in the world last season), and Lahm is mostly a midfielder these days, and even if he would play RB, Alves has been the best RB in the world in at least 5 of the last 8 seasons, including the last one.

Sure, Lahm brings more safety in defence, in the sense that you feel more secure with him at RB instead of Alves, but Dani does several important things going forward that Lahm just can't do, and that comes from the fact that he is technically superior -- a better passer and a better dribbler.

As I said, I'll give you Neuer and Vidal. I'd understand why a Bayern fan would also have Lahm over Alves, and Boateng over Pique (although for me Pique is better and has been one of the best CBs in the world for the most part of the last 6 years) and Alaba over Alba. 6 players from both teams are non-negotiable though so to speak, and would walk in the other team with ease. Neuer, Busquets, Vidal, Messi, Neymar, Suarez. Neuer is obvious, Vidal is one of the best box-to-box players in the world, and Busquets is one of the best and most gifted players to ever play at DM. Then you have Messi, Neymar, Suarez where it's clear, although I suppose you could have Lewandowski at CF and still have a great team, even though Suarez is a better striker. Depending on the system you could maybe find a place for Muller. That's about it. But, and I speak as a Barca fan, for our first 11, I would only take Neuer, Vidal, and maybe Boateng if he can play LCB, next to Pique (alhtough I have a feeling that might not work at all).

Sorry, Lahm is a better passer than Alves. Alves is more physical and less cerebral than Lahm. Lahm is far better. Also, I agree that Pique is comfortably better than Boateng. Busquets is much better than Vidal or Thiago or any Bayern midfielder. No doubt. Also, Alaba is comfortably better than Alba as Alaba is more cerebral (MUCH HIGHER FOOTBALL IQ) than Alba.

 

[serghei]

If we assume this was a discussion not on barcaforum but on an open football-board, then you would have 11 replies in just 2 hours all quoting your comparisons about Alba and Alaba and Lahm and Alves, basically disagreeing and probably in a far less nicer way than I do.

Good. People can dissagree all they want and how they want. We've just won the treble by walking the Champions League and that is the proof that the players of FC Barcelona are actually the best in the world at the minute this conversation is happening. Dani Alves was a monster at RB since the turn of the year, delivering great performances against City, Real Madrid, PSG, Bayern and Juventus. Some still think, in spite of recent results, that Lahm is better than Alves at RB right now? Fine by me.

Sorry, Lahm is a better passer than Alves. Alves is more physical and less cerebral than Lahm. Lahm is far better. Also, I agree that Pique is comfortably better than Boateng. Busquets is much better than Vidal or Thiago or any Bayern midfielder. No doubt. Also, Alaba is comfortably better than Alba as Alaba is more cerebral (MUCH HIGHER FOOTBALL IQ) than Alba.

Again, Alves is a better RB than Lahm. It's a reason he's been named the best RB of the season 4 times in the last 6 seasons by the Players' Union. He had an off 2013-14 season (as well as the rest of the team basically), but now he's back at being the best in his positions until he declines permanently.

Player for player is cool, but you have to look at the overall unit and if they played like that or something similar, they are my early favourites for the CL, of course my opinion can change as i see more of the teams around Europe this season.

Remember the other factors like motivation, focus etc.

Sorry, I can't have as CL favourites (before the season even starts in Spain) a team we beat 3-0 last season.

 

[Luftstalag14]

Ginter's first goal for BVB, 0:1 against Ingolstadt

 

[vigneshFCB]

Let's be real. If we had Lahm on our team we would be comfortably the best team in the world. We already are the best but we only scrape it. Lahm automatically increases game control by 20%. Alves is the second best RB, sure. But his silly crosses and losses of possession and general lack of intelligence and cerebrality drag him down. Prime Alves is probably better than Lahm but not now.

 

[Luftstalag14]

I agree that Lahm is better than Dani as a RB, as much as I love Dani. Lahm can DEFINITELY go forward and he often does, his crosses are not worse than Dani's.

Lahm sucks when he plays as a CDM.

 

[serghei]

2-0 Dortmund. Reus pen.