Cr150

[Djoker]

CR is obviously nowhere near Messi/GOAT level but he is an all time great. For instance, no young player today looks like they'll ever come close to matching prime CR. Not even Mbappe, Vini, Gakpo etc are as talented. Dude was that good.

 

[Maradona37]

CR is obviously nowhere near Messi/GOAT level but he is an all time great. For instance, no young player today looks like they'll ever come close to matching prime CR. Not even Mbappe, Vini, Gakpo etc are as talented. Dude was that good.

I think Mbappe is equally as talented if not more so, but yeah, will never achieve as much. Though Mbappe has already pissed all over him in World Cups.

Nobody is saying he wasn't talented (although he's always relied more on athleticism I think), it's the sheer over the top hysteria that puts people off and actually leads them to go the other way and underrate him to compensate.

He's not in the top five players of all time and that's the point, even if he is better than Mbappe et al. Somewhere between 6-10 would be fair maybe. Though that still puts him above many geniuses. The point is his fans and the guy himself are deluded enough to brag about being the best player ever, and that repels normal thinking people.

 

[Djoker]

I think Mbappe is equally as talented if not more so, but yeah, will never achieve as much. Though Mbappe has already pissed all over him in World Cups.

Nobody is saying he wasn't talented (although he's always relied more on athleticism I think), it's the sheer over the top hysteria that puts people off and actually leads them to go the other way and underrate him to compensate.

He's nowhere near the top five players of all time and that's the point, even if he is better than Mbappe et al. Somewhere between 6-10 would be fair maybe. Though that still puts him above many geniuses. The point is his fans and the guy himself are deluded enough to brag about being the best player ever, and that repels normal thinking people.

I would definitely rank Messi, Pele and Maradona over CR. After that it becomes at least debatable. I have the likes of Cruyff and Di Stefano above too but I don't have major issues with CR at #4 all time. Not with what he's accomplished and I do think his peak was quite sensesational. Ironically I think the best CR was circa 2012 before he started winning.

Mbappe to me is not particularly close to CR's level as a player. Sure he's exceeded him at the WC but outside of that, Mbappe doesn't have a much of a legacy. And even then one can easily argue Griezmann was the protagonist for France in 2018 and even a few matches in 2022 he was the best attacking player for France.

 

[Maradona37]

I would definitely rank Messi, Pele and Maradona over CR. After that it becomes at least debatable. I have the likes of Cruyff and Di Stefano above too but I don't have major issues with CR at #4 all time. Not with what he's accomplished and I do think his peak was quite sensesational. Ironically I think the best CR was circa 2012 before he started winning.

Mbappe to me is not particularly close to CR's level as a player. Sure he's exceeded him at the WC but outside of that, Mbappe doesn't have a much of a legacy. And even then one can easily argue Griezmann was the protagonist for France in 2018 and even a few matches in 2022 he was the best attacking player for France.

Fair enough. To me the likes of Cruyff, Di Stefano, R9 and others were significantly more gifted than CR. I am not really a fan of CR at all as a player. To me he is more athlete than footballer and spent far too much of his career playing on the shoulder of the last man. He also has a huge list of games where he was poor but covered up with a goal.

I don't know how you can say Mbappe 'isn't particularly close'. When you watch them (CR prime) there's not much difference between them at all. Both are very fast, have fairly tricky feet, look to cut in for the finish. I don't think Mbappe in that RM team that won the CLs makes them worse. And Mbappe has now joined RM and could forge a legacy of his own. As someone who's been playing and watching football for many years, it's abundantly clear that Ronaldo is far closer to Mbappe's talent level than Messi's.

And I agree Griezmann could have been the best player in those World Cups (taking into account Mbappe was only 19 in 2018). Griezmann is a very underrated player. But Ronaldo has never done anything special in any major tournament. He won in 2016 but he and Portugal were mediocre the entire tournament, and he has never come close to Player of the Tournament in any other.

In my respectful opinion, you're giving CR too much credit and undervaluing Mbappe a bit much, especially given Mbappe is still only 25 with probably his best days yet to come. As players they're quite similar in talent and style/profile. I think Ronaldo being a bigger 'celebrity' with more raving fans (not you) and having already played out his career leads to some bias towards him.

But we can agree to disagree.

 

[Maradona37]

' Ironically I think the best CR was circa 2012 before he started winning.'

Yep, made that point myself too. Which further highlights the vast importance of team-mates in a TEAM sport. And the idiocy of those who claim he carried RM (Lol).

 

[malvolio]

Mbappe won't have as many Ballons as Cristina, but he'll have a complete trophy haul.

France would not be world champions without him. While Griezmann was a more constant player for them, he isn't the difference maker. And Mbappe was the difference maker in that match vs Argentina, which basically sealed their WC path to win. He also carried France the whole tournament and nearly made them WC champions again in Qatar.

 

[Temptation]

Ronaldo had way more tools in the locker than Mbappe.


Ronaldo was tall, strong and the best header of the ball. Ronaldo had great distance shooting ability with both feet. Ronaldo used to score many free kicks in his prime. Some of them were outrageous in terms of distance and angles. Ronaldo's crossing has always been elite since his United days. A very underrated and overlooked quality of his game.


Mbappe doesn't have any of these qualities. Ronaldo was a far more complete player.

 

[Maradona37]

Ronaldo scored from about 2 of his every 100 pot shots from distance, and if anything his ridiculous shooting from everywhere highlights his stupidity and selfishness as a player - it's not something to use as a positive. A couple go in like the Porto one, and people use it as evidence of his great shooting ability...

Fair enough on the heading. As for him being 'strong' - having a six pack and some muscles doesn't make someone strong. He consistently went over like a pussy and dived all the time. He was a good crosser, hardly elite.

Regardless, I am not talking about who is more 'complete' (and Ronaldo like Mbappe totally lacks all-time great levels of dribbling, passing, playmaking, Hazard and Neymar beat these two in those, never mind all-time greats), I am talking about who is the best at what they do the most. And in terms of coming inside off the left and shooting or linking up with others, Mbappe is no worse than Ronaldo.

I don't even like Mbappe, he is a tool. But he's strangely underrated by people who think he's just a pace merchant when he has much more to his game than that. It wouldn't surprise me if he wins a lot at RM (hope he doesn't) and overtakes Ronaldo's legacy. Ronaldo's legacy gets boosted from being artificially positioned as Messi's rival, when he was nowhere near.

For someone with a great 'legacy', his international career has generally been average at best in terms of how he's performed at tournaments.

 

[Maradona37]

Anyway, really can't be bothered spending my valuable free time arguing about this inbred rapist cunt. He's a scummy human being and really not worth the effort. Believe what you like lads.

 

[Temptation]

Diving doesn't make a player physically weak. It's done to gain an advantage. Gamesmanship. Diego Costa is very strong and used to dive all the time.


In order to consistently win headers over every kind of defender, you need to have a substantial amount of strength.

 

[Maradona37]

Diving doesn't make a player weak. Diego Costa is very strong and used to dive all the time.


In order to consistently win headers over every kind of defender you need to have a substantial amount of strength.

I wouldn't call Ronaldo 'strong' in the way I would Costa or Drogba, for instance.

Anyway, see post above.

 

[Iniesta Ultra]

At least this should be the last tournament we have to see his girly pre-teen behavior. Or will he pull a Pepe next WC?

 

[Maradona37]

And last thing to say...nobody is saying he hasn't been a great player. He's clearly been a great player for his prime.

It's the desperation (not on here) of others to position him as the best player ever, or alongside the top three. Taking offence on his behalf like they are fucking related to the cunt. And the sheer fury you are met with when you dare to say something very reasonable and highly likely, like he's less talented than Cruyff or R9 or Beckenbauer.

The people who love him are so precious and take offence at rating others over him, when it's more than reasonable to say those players were better than him. That is what I mean by idol worship and people's rationality going out of the window because they have a creepy love for a footballer and in turn end up getting offended on his behalf and tying their own self-esteem as a person with him.

 

[Temptation]

Costa and Drogba were traditional CFs, targetmen whose entire game depended on strength, holdup play with back to goal.


Ronaldo was never a striker. He can't play with his back to goal. One of the main reasons why fitting current Ronaldo into a team is so difficult tactically. He'll never be a CF. Always an LW. Ronaldo is a modern wing forward/wide forward.


For his position, he's strong physically.

 

[Maradona37]

I know all that and agree with it. I have always said it's laughable people say 'wow he scores so much from the wing' - when actually, being on the wing is by far his best position and allows him to maximise his goalscoring, ghosting inside while Benzema takes defenders away.

I know he has poor hold up play (which actually shows a lack of strength to be fair) and can't play with his back to goal and is a mediocre number 9. I fully agree with you. I also agree he's fairly strong for a winger, but I still wouldn't call him a colossus or anything or use it as a major strength of his.

And, again - nobody is saying he wasn't a great player. But being considered 6th to 10th of all time by plenty of people isn't enough for his rabid fans, despite being a huge achievement in itself.