Jack Wilshere

[Bergkamp10]

Exactly. In 05/06, he would be bullied so easily off the ball it was ridiculous. Hence why we always did badly against the more physical teams. I just don't see Wilshere being bullied off the ball in the PL the way Cesc was. Even at Bolton on loan, the most dirty player in the league Kevin Davies said he couldn't believe how tough Jack was. Fabregas struggles against Chelsea and United in the league. He's had two or three good games against United and none against Chelsea while Wilshere on loan at Bolton was their best player against both of these teams. He was also our best player yesterday. At 18, that's an incredible achievement.

 

[Pepe Silvia]

Yeah, I'm a big fan of this kid.

 

[10Rivaldo]

I love it when players become world class. Everyone forgets how much work they had to do to get there, and how much improvements they had to make. Cesc used to be the most lightweight player ever, and even Ashley Cole wrote in his book that he was a 'featherweight' that would never be suited to the premier league. He also couldn't hit a barndoor until the last couple years. It was hard work and learning under Wenger that made him the prolific scorer/assister he is now, and the same will happen with Wilshere.

Cesc was known as a goalscoring volante when he was in the youth ranks at Barcelona though. So it's not really something completely new.

 

[Robbie]

Cesc scored only 3 goals in 46 appearances in his first full season, then 5 in 50 appearances, and 4 in 54 appearances (with a lot more assists). 3 years of almost no improvement in front of goal while playing almost every single game. To see how much he improved, look at last season. 19 goals 19 assists in 36 appearances. For reference, Ibrahimovic scored 22 goals and 10 assists in 42 apps.

Players aren't born world class, but everyone forgets their previous flaws when they improve. Digging into stats and old videos, how good was Xavi or Iniesta in their late teens/early 20's? How about Zidane? When Zidane was 23, Blackburn's owner passed on signing him, saying "Why do you want to sign Zidane when we have Tim Sherwood?". It was years before he would show the world his talent in 1998, but that quote didn't sound so stupid then. Hindsight is funny like that.

 

[gunner89]

Cesc scored only 3 goals in 46 appearances in his first full season, then 5 in 50 appearances, and 4 in 54 appearances (with a lot more assists). 3 years of almost no improvement in front of goal while playing almost every single game. To see how much he improved, look at last season. 19 goals 19 assists in 36 appearances. For reference, Ibrahimovic scored 22 goals and 10 assists in 42 apps.

Players aren't born world class, but everyone forgets their previous flaws when they improve. Digging into stats and old videos, how good was Xavi or Iniesta in their late teens/early 20's? How about Zidane? When Zidane was 23, Blackburn's owner passed on signing him, saying "Why do you want to sign Zidane when we have Tim Sherwood?". It was years before he would show the world his talent in 1998, but that quote didn't sound so stupid then. Hindsight is funny like that.

Obviously his finishing has improved but it's also to do with him playing much further up the pitch. He was always very good since he started off. It's just that he played deeper and we had more goalscorers. In his first season we had Henry,Reyes,Ljungber,Pires all past double figures while even Van persie was their abouts i think. Their was a reason he was slotting into the midfield when we had the best team in the league at just 17 years of age. Look at his debut against manchester united in the community shield. He bossed the game. Wilshere for some reason reminds me of iniesta.

 

[koko]

How about Zidane? When Zidane was 23, Blackburn's owner passed on signing him, saying "Why do you want to sign Zidane when we have Tim Sherwood?". It was years before he would show the world his talent in 1998, but that quote didn't sound so stupid then. Hindsight is funny like that.

saw an interview with cantona once he was saying that he recomended zidane to fergie when he was young and availiable for free fergie took a look and wasnt interested

 

[Trequartista]

Interesting to see that the way Wenger treated Cesc is nearly the same way he is dealing with young Jack,playing him in a more deeper role to mature and improving his passes and giving him some strength,will his long term future be in a more offensive role?I think so,it would be very hard to put Wilshire in Cesc's position rightnow as he is too young to control the game,get himself into good position to score and create spaces for others but I think once he shows signs of maturing Wilshire will be moved to the AMF role,BTW ZIdane-Wilshire comparisons makes no sense,I just dont care whether 18 years old Wilshire has the potential to become as good as X player or not,its about his developement,17 yeras old Bojan had the potential to become a better player than 17 years old Pato but what about 20 years old Pato and Bojan

 

[Robbie]

I wasn't comparing him to Zidane, I was just saying that not that many people "rated" Zidane until he was 24. Wilshere is 18 and has years to develop his own style and achieve his own fame not being compared to anyone else.

 

[Bergkamp10]

Got sent off today for a really bad tackle, 2 footed off the ground. Hopefully it will teach him to not be so reckless at times as that's one weakness in Jack's game - he's got a bit of a Bergkamp-esque nasty streak. Apart from the red in added time today, he was sensational. He's now become a key player for us and we'll miss him for the 3 games he'll be suspended for but luckily Cesc is back.

 

[10Rivaldo]

He needed that red card, he's a bit reckless.

 

[Trequartista]

Yeah,a red card is the best thing for him now,the tackle against Pool and the tackle today,really reckless,maybe bec he is full of enthusiasm,I always had my doubts about his ability but after seeing 2 or 3 complete games for him,he is really awesome,probably future of England's midfield

 

[Metaphysical]

funniest thing is wenger said it wasn't a malicious tackle.

yet when people tackle his players like that he's complaining about rough treatment and calling for massive suspensions.

what a twat.

 

[Bergkamp10]

funniest thing is wenger said it wasn't a malicious tackle.

yet when people tackle his players like that he's complaining about rough treatment and calling for massive suspensions.

what a twat.

It wasn't malicious tackle, it was mistimed. Even the Birmingham manager said it was mistimes. The difference with the likes of Shawcross is that he has a history of being a dirty player while Wilshere although petulant is not a dirty player who goes out thinking he's going to be a hard man.

But watching the tackle on match of the day tonight, it wasn't that bad. Worthy of a red but not a disgusting tackle at all, just late and mistimed as all the panel said.

 

[Robbie]

Forget about that tackle and watch how he played today. The kid was absolutely brilliant! Ran the show and spotted runs like he had eyes on the back of his head.

England have great defenders and great attackers, but without Scholes/Beckham/Gerrard there are really in need of a player like Wilshere. The way he practically walked into the first team and hit the ground running reminds me so much of Cesc.

 

[Metaphysical]

It wasn't malicious tackle, it was mistimed. Even the Birmingham manager said it was mistimes. The difference with the likes of Shawcross is that he has a history of being a dirty player while Wilshere although petulant is not a dirty player who goes out thinking he's going to be a hard man.

but that's bollocks.

if anything, wilshere is a dirtier player than shawcross. he's far sneakier and knows how to put himself about (a good trait, and the reason he'll make it in the PL despite his size - like scholes). shawcross is just bigger and stronger than most people, and he's a bit of a clumsy oaf so makes rash decisions and late tackles.

anyway, I'm not saying wilshere's tackle was malicious, it wasn't. like you said, arsene said, big eck said... it was just mistimed. but the hilarity of wenger leaping to his defence while constantly and FIERCELY criticising other players for the same type of infraction, is hilariously hypocritical.