Luis Enrique

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Flavia

Guest
It was down to Barca losing or drawing against Real Sociedad at Anoeta since the Rijkaard days. lol No rational explanation. Barca never win there. La Real have beaten Atletico and Real Madrid at home this season, too. It happens. The right side being Munir-Montoya and the left side Pedro didn't help. With Messi and Neymar and Alves starting might have gotten something out of the game. That lineup wasn't the most glorious decision of Lucho, for sure.

It was the best chance in years to beat Sociedad at Anoeta. Their overall game was pretty bad.
Barça players look lost in the pitch. And now we're hearing why, they're not understanding what Lucho wants. By now we should have, at the very least, a clear system in place. But we don't.

And the midfield is not working, but I don't think that's down to the players only. You don't need wc players in all positions to make a team work. MSN should be working better by now, as well.
 

serghei

Senior Member
He has a point. Rotations aren't the problem.

They are if you don't have that great of a squad. I'm guessing Bayern doesn't have Douglas and Montoya as RB. They have Lahm and Rafinha. Their squad is better than ours and they have a coach that knows how to rotate, and doesn't do it randomnly.
 

mssarm

Member
It was the best chance in years to beat Sociedad at Anoeta. Their overall game was pretty bad.
Barça players look lost in the pitch. And now we're hearing why, they're not understanding what Lucho wants. By now we should have, at the very least, a clear system in place. But we don't.

And the midfield is not working, but I don't think that's down to the players only. You don't need wc players in all positions to make a team work. MSN should be working better by now, as well.

Our midfield won WC and Europa cup under Del Bosque. Care to explain why all of sudden our midfield started to look like crap on last WC? It was under the same coach Del Bosque, not Lucho "who doesn't know how the play midfield".
 
F

Flavia

Guest
Our midfield won WC and Europa cup under Del Bosque. Care to explain why all of sudden our midfield started to look like crap on last WC? It was under the same coach Del Bosque, not Lucho "who doesn't know how the play midfield".
Which midfield? Xavi is not the same player anymore, neither is Iniesta. Rakitic was Enrique's signing. But apparently he isn't using him properly, or Enrique shouldn't had snubbed Kroos. In anyway, our midfield problems are on the coach. Enrique should at least be trying Rafinha.
 

rixxer

New member
Ursegor again nailing it imho. A lot of things against Lucho are just simply false hope that changing a manager it will change everything and we would take over Madrid once again. I don't think so, people in here underestimate the transition Barca is going through and impact that it usually has on team play. There is no patience at all, fans are not giving even a full season to the new manager anymore...
But communicative problems are real issue, that Usergor may underestimate. Lucho may even be the guy to lead Barca through those transition times, but when his message is not reaching to players, it is no use. He will be gone before trees start bearing the fruits. I have witnessed it in every kind of organization, if people with old habits do not understand the changes because they are not explained to them in understandable way these measures just won't work and the resistance is inevitable. And for Barca manager to loose a dressing room or Messi, it is only the highway...
 
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Hamzah

High Definition Member
If Lucho just explained his ideas and where he is coming from everything could be solved. That's what pep was good at, every time there was a revolutionary change he would explain it and even physically demonstrate it on the training pitch.

I still think his tactic sucks though and offers no creativity in midfield.
 

Chainsaw

Killahead
Ursegor, I agree on some points you are trying to make. You are trying to shift the blame from Enrique to the squad but I don't buy it all. If Enrique was aware of the squad diminish he had a whole summer to convince the club to make the right changes. Look at the arrivals and tell me if them, in your opinion, were enough to improve the squad in all departments. Tell me why the likes of Kroos and Laporte should be rejected for the likes of Rakitic, Mathieu and Vermaelen.

About the defence getting better, I disagree. In every big match Barca played this season the defence was heavily exposed. Last season despite having less options in the back the defence did much better. I don't think speaking statistically will say the whole truth and we haven't even played many remarkable opponents so far and already conceded 8 in 3 matches. Remembering the matches we were lucky it was only 8.

About the Sociedad match, I disagree we have to put it all on some supernatural curse. This Sociedad team was nothing like one we faced in previous season. Barca had the whole game to put 'em to the sword but all we saw was a dull, static and uninspired performance which led to only one chance the whole game.

I agree we have to give the benefit of the doubt and say let's give the whole season to Scrubique so maybe, maybe he turn to another Rijkaard. But from the progression we've made so far, and all these reports coming out that the players are not happy with the way Enrique is running the team (not only Messi) I'm not sure it is a good idea anymore. Do you, for example, have kept Moyes at United for the same reasons?
 

BBZ8800

Senior Member
Ursegor again nailing it imho. A lot of things against Lucho are just simply false hope that changing a manager it will change everything and we would take over Madrid once again. I don't think so, people in here underestimate the transition Barca is going through and impact that it usually has on team play. There is no patience at all, fans are not giving even a full season to the new manager anymore...
But communicative problems are real issue, that Usergor may underestimate. Lucho may even be the guy to lead Barca through those transition times, but when his message is not reaching to players, it is no use. He will be gone before trees start bearing the fruits. I have witnessed it in every kind of organization, if people with old habits do not understand the changes because they are not explained to them in understandable way these measures just won't work and the resistance is inevitable. And for Barca manager to loose a dressing room or Messi, it is only the highway...

Ursegor is surely right in some points.

But Lucho has done a lot of bad things also.
On the other hand, I also agree that a new coach after Lucho WON'T fix our problems.
Our team is good only on paper. With a big "maybe".
MSN is not clicking yet properly.
-- maybe they just need more time, but maybe they will never click together, time will tell

-- we don't have a midfield, we don't have a DR at all, and DL Alba is not the smartest guy in the world
-- so, even with a new coach, we won't have a midfield, plus we won't have fullbacks who can contribute anything decent
-- that leaves us with MSN trio in attack to do something
-- so, those 3 players against 10 opponent's players, more or less, this is our game

While I'll also think that Tata was better than Lucho, but people have now started to hail Tata too much.
-- about Tata, have people forgot the last 3-4 Months of the last Season?
-- do you remember how we played in almost every match (ok, we didn't have the depth and we had some injuries), but we had a bunch of games which were the same as today under Lucho
-- in the last 10 matches in La liga, too many times we managed to create only 2-3 shots in 90 minutes, both home and away

So:
1. in Pep's last Season, our team started to lose "magic"
2. In Tito's season, we were still good enough to trash La Liga opponents
-- but our deficiencies started to show against any stronger opponent
= so, with Tito, we were still good/creative enough against smaller teams, but were not good enough anymore against any stronger side
3. with Tata, the trend and a decline continues
= everything from a previous year is only multiplied and getting worse
-- with Tito, we were good enough against smaller teams
-- under Tata, in the 2nd part of the Season, we weren't able anymore to create even 5 clear chances in one match, against any La liga opponent
-- against bigger teams, lol, we played like, what, 6 matches against Atletico without a win?
-- do people really think that it was just a coincidence?
4. Lucho, wasn't it logical that everything will be even worse, team wise
-- ok, Lucho is probably the worst coach in the last 4 Seasons, but still
-- even Pep would struggle today, with this DEAD team
-- the downhill trend continued: we were poor against weaker teams with Tata, and in this Season, we are even worse
-- at home, we are somewhat good
-- but on away matches, lol, 0:0, 1:0 and 0:1 all the time
-- again, do people seriously think that it is just a coincidence?

We can bring Pep, Van Gaal, Rijkaard tomorrow, it won't help.
This DEAD team will play more or less the same against any crappy opponent in away La liga matches.

Yesterday on some other topics me and some people said that maybe it will be a time soon to sell either Messi, or Iniesta+Xavi+Busi+Alves+Pedro+Alba and a lot of players. A lot of fans laughed to that idea saying that Xavi, Iniesta and other guys aren't finished yet and how we need only a better coach.

But then, it means that both Tito, Tata and Lucho were bad coaches since none of them managed to create "magic" again with this team.
Plus, our team is worse and worse each new Season, and more or less, each new month.
-- so:
1. the team is the same all the time
2. coaches change
= then either coaches were poor (and the team is fine), or this team has some serious problems

Now, we will get a new board this summer, and people are happy.
But what is the point of a new board and a new coach if we will continue with Xavi, Iniesta, Busi, Alves, Pique, Pedro and similar guys?
Ok, new board won't be as dumb as the current one and they won't pay 100 Millions for Neymar, and they won't buy players like Douglas, but still.

We need:
1. a new board
2. a new coach
3. new players
4. some new ideas

Our current players share a lot of guilt for our decline also.
Not only Tata or Lucho.

And again, no coach in the world will again turn Xavi, Iniesta, Alves, and probably Busi, Pique, Pedro and other guys into a world class players.
 
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khaled_a_d

Senior Member
Ursegor, I agree on some points you are trying to make. You are trying to shift the blame from Enrique to the squad but I don't buy it all. If Enrique was aware of the squad diminish he had a whole summer to convince the club to make the right changes. Look at the arrivals and tell me if them, in your opinion, were enough to improve the squad in all departments. Tell me why the likes of Kroos and Laporte should be rejected for the likes of Rakitic, Mathieu and Vermaelen.

About the defence getting better, I disagree. In every big match Barca played this season the defence was heavily exposed. Last season despite having less options in the back the defence did much better. I don't think speaking statistically will say the whole truth and we haven't even played many remarkable opponents so far and already conceded 8 in 3 matches. Remembering the matches we were lucky it was only 8.

About the Sociedad match, I disagree we have to put it all on some supernatural curse. This Sociedad team was nothing like one we faced in previous season. Barca had the whole game to put 'em to the sword but all we saw was a dull, static and uninspired performance which led to only one chance the whole game.

I agree we have to give the benefit of the doubt and say let's give the whole season to Scrubique so maybe, maybe he turn to another Rijkaard. But from the progression we've made so far, and all these reports coming out that the players are not happy with the way Enrique is running the team (not only Messi) I'm not sure it is a good idea anymore. Do you, for example, have kept Moyes at United for the same reasons?

Lucho asked for Benatia & Cuadrado ,the club got him Douglas & Vermaelen .yeah we have a club whose board can be easily convinced by the coach :lucho2:
 

Chainsaw

Killahead
Lucho asked for Benatia & Cuadrado ,the club got him Douglas & Vermaelen .yeah we have a club whose board can be easily convinced by the coach :lucho2:

The club being up Marquinhos and Mathieu butts all the time say otherwise. I never saw the club even trying much to get Benatia had Lucho asked for him personally.
 

khaled_a_d

Senior Member
The club being up Marquinhos and Mathieu butts all the time say otherwise. I never saw the club even trying much to get Benatia had Lucho asked for him personally.

We have no prove about who wanted who but the media ,media said he wanted Benatia even b4 they said so about Marquinhos ,and we were linked to Mathieu in 2013 as Zubi liked him as CB option,he is Zubi signing
 

Chainsaw

Killahead
We have no prove about who wanted who but the media ,media said he wanted Benatia even b4 they said so about Marquinhos ,and we were linked to Mathieu in 2013 as Zubi liked him as CB option,he is Zubi signing

Does it make sense to you the club waste the whole summer trying to convince PSG of all the clubs to sell an overpriced Marquinhos than Barca try for a cheaper Benatia if Lucho asked for the latter personally? Mathieu in all the reports was asked by Lucho personally. The club eventually being forced to pay for Valencia's asking price should tell you the reports weren't exactly fabricated.
 

Irish_Cules

New member
While it's true that the general quality of our midfielders has declined, this is not the main reason for the problem in the area. It's obvious that Lucho is bypassing the midfield with his tactics. When you look at the passing statistics for any of our matches you never see Rakitic-Iniesta, Xavi-Busi or whatever as the top passing combos. They're not even close to being top. Rakitic might just not be good enough but he is a part of a midfield system that just doesn't function so this is obviously going to drain his confidence.
It's too easy to just right off our midfielders as being over the hill. A midfield of Rakitic-Busquets-Iniesta should not look as inept as it does when they play together.
 

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