Philippe Coutinho

[Laplacian]

Bayern's style of play under Flick is very specific. Muller is key to that, and no other player can play his role. Then it also needs two pacy, dribblers as wingers.
No position left for Coutinho, the style itself is not designed to have such a type of player.
Then, even if not 1st choice, he was not underwhelming. Flick subbed him on even in CL knockouts and he was always decent.

Then, I don't agree at all with the interpretation that his form 'dipped' suddenly around the summer of 2018.
This is actually a narrative (the narrative of Coutinho suddenly and inexplicably becoming shit after being the best player of a top team for 4 years).
You indicating that I am trying to pull up some narrative. Actually the opposite, I am arguing against simplistic narratives such as the above.

Ah, so it's Flick's specific style. Makes sense. Is that why Coutinho was also shit under Kovac? Lmao

 

[vegitot]

Coutinho, simply past his best.

No need to say more than that.

Coutinho was not really good for Bayern and of course a bench warmer later.

 

[Birdy]

Ah, so it's Flick's specific style. Makes sense. Is that why Coutinho was also shit under Kovac? Lmao

He was not shit at Bayern at all. I said that very clearly. He could not be a protagonist because of their style of play.

Again, you are avoiding the question. How could Liverpool's best player for 4 years turn to shit at Barca?
Maybe you prefer easy answers and false narratives.

 

[Laplacian]

He was not shit at Bayern at all. I said that very clearly. He could not be a protagonist because of their style of play.

No, he was shit. lol

Again, you are avoiding the question. How could Liverpool's best player for 4 years turn to shit at Barca?
Maybe you prefer easy answers and false narratives.

He was world class in 2017/2018 for us. If it was "our fault", that wouldn't have been the case. He was underwhelming for Brazil during the world cup, and all of his subsequent appearances for the national team since then. He was remarkably underwhelming for us in 2018/2019 when we had the same core, with an arguably better squad (fit Dembele, Malcom, Arthur etc). He was shit. He was shit for Kovac and Flick, and was displaced by geriatric Perisic and Muller. You seem to have a lot of excuses and reasons for a player failing under multiple squads, coaches, and teams and blaming everyone and everything else but him. The answer is "easy" because he isn't the first person to underperform after moving away from a club where he was a star. He isn't the first player to fail to make the transition from competing for top 4 to a club that expects UCLs and league titles almost every season. He won't be the last one either.

Barcelona is too slow for him, Bayern's too difficult (even though 17 year olds are excelling for Bayern right now LOL) for him apparently. You can go with "Coutinho can't dribble because of everyone else" narrative, I'll just go with him being shit.

 

[Respekt_III]

Then, I don't agree at all with the interpretation that his form 'dipped' suddenly around the summer of 2018.
This is actually a narrative (the narrative of Coutinho suddenly and inexplicably becoming shit after being the best player of a top team for 4 years).
You indicating that I am trying to pull up some narrative. Actually the opposite, I am arguing against simplistic narratives such as the above.

Again, you are avoiding the question. How could Liverpool's best player for 4 years turn to shit at Barca?
Maybe you prefer easy answers and false narratives.

Liverpool top team when they were struggling to get into the top 4? he was massively overrated and still is.

 

[JohnN]

But the case of Coutinho is not properly thought of and treated in this forum.
People act as he is utter shit, without realizing that we are talking about the best player of Liverpool for many years.
He was the best player since Rodgers days (after Suarez left) up until he was sold to Barca. First name when fit on the team sheet under Klopp.
So many goals, so many splendid performances at Liverpool.

And suddenly he turns into shit the moment he walks into Baca's XI?
Think for yourselves how can that be.

We usually take about another player too.. A player that was the best on the planet for 15 years, but that doesn't stop you from shit posting about him every chance you get, does it?
So, let us, little minded people, have our opinion on Coutinho, a.k.a. he is shit, and you can have your opinion too and it's all cool and dandy..

 

[olivis]

Coutinho was not only benched at Bayern but he was actually in the pecking order behind Perisic too. Just imagine that for a moment.

Can't blame Coutinho at all for being benched by Muller who is imo one of the best players of the last decade.

But there is no excuse being chosen off the bench behind 33 year old Inter reject Perisic.

We paid 150m for this it's so unbelievable. Such a stupid waste of money

 

[serghei]

Coutinho was not only benched at Bayern but he was actually in the pecking order behind Perisic too. Just imagine that for a moment.

Can't blame Coutinho at all for being benched by Muller who is imo one of the best players of the last decade.

But there is no excuse being chosen off the bench behind 33 year old Inter reject Perisic.

We paid 150m for this it's so unbelievable. Such a stupid waste of money

Lol, what's so funny about that? Perisic was extremely disciplined, a very hard worker, with a great mentality. Some dudes back in 2011 also wondered how Pedro got to play in that side. Well... he provided balance, hard work, and so on. A similar case can be made about Perisic.

Not everyone has to be a flair, super-technical player. If anything, too many players who are creative on the ball but not great workers and movers will destabilize a team.

 

[Birdy]

Liverpool top team when they were struggling to get into the top 4? he was massively overrated and still is.

Nah, I don't buy the 'we are bigger than Liverpool' line.
They were not struggling since 2016, and he was still their best player until he got transferred.

We usually take about another player too.. A player that was the best on the planet for 15 years, but that doesn't stop you from shit posting about him every chance you get, does it?
So, let us, little minded people, have our opinion on Coutinho, a.k.a. he is shit, and you can have your opinion too and it's all cool and dandy..

Your post and its relation to my point:
https://media0.giphy.com/media/49zC0Bm1kbu36/giphy.gif

Plus, the number of points contained in your post about Coutinho: 0

PS: If you want to make everything an occasion to talk again about Messi I am not going to play this game. I have replied to you in his thread many times.

 

[Respekt_III]

Nah, I don't buy the 'we are bigger than Liverpool' line.
They were not struggling since 2016, and he was still their best player until he got transferred.

they barely made the top 4 once with him before he transferred out. yeah totally a top team at the time.

<blockquote class="imgur-embed-pub" lang="en" data-id="a/oTOk6MQ" ><a href="//imgur.com/a/oTOk6MQ">epl 2014-2018</a></blockquote><script async src="//s.imgur.com/min/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Laplacian]

they barely made the top 4 once with him before he transferred out. yeah totally a top team at the time.

<blockquote class="imgur-embed-pub" lang="en" data-id="a/oTOk6MQ" ><a href="//imgur.com/a/oTOk6MQ">epl 2014-2018</a></blockquote><script async src="//s.imgur.com/min/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

My man is delusional about Coutinho, let him rest him peace and believe Barcelona's the reason behind his underwhelming performances.

 

[Fati_Future_BallonDor]

they barely made the top 4 once with him before he transferred out. yeah totally a top team at the time.

Yeah and they were in CL final, won PL and Cl when he was out...coincidence ?

 

[JohnN]

Nah, I don't buy the 'we are bigger than Liverpool' line.
They were not struggling since 2016, and he was still their best player until he got transferred.



Your post and its relation to my point:
https://media0.giphy.com/media/49zC0Bm1kbu36/giphy.gif

Plus, the number of points contained in your post about Coutinho: 0

PS: If you want to make everything an occasion to talk again about Messi I am not going to play this game. I have replied to you in his thread many times.

There is a single point about Coutinho you missed in my post. He is shit. That was it. Clear as day.

Everything else is not about Messi, it's about you. Your post history about Messi suggests that you have no right telling others they should respect or take into account Coutinho's past achievements before commenting on him. This derives from the simple fact that you don't do it yourself for a much better player.

There it is, after the I made it even simpler.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Lol, what's so funny about that? Perisic was extremely disciplined, a very hard worker, with a great mentality. Some dudes back in 2011 also wondered how Pedro got to play in that side. Well... he provided balance, hard work, and so on. A similar case can be made about Perisic.

Not everyone has to be a flair, super-technical player. If anything, too many players who are creative on the ball but not great workers and movers will destabilize a team.

Which Bayern player was about flair and not hard work? I would argue non.
If Coutinho was great, they would have no problem incorporating him in starting line up.
He was simply not worthy of dropping a role player for him.

 

[khaled_a_d]

Again, you are avoiding the question. How could Liverpool's best player for 4 years turn to shit at Barca?

Non football reasons?
It happens a lot, and people always forget about it.
Players struggle in new cities all the time, or have something private destroying their confidence or discipline, something we don't see.

We have seen it with Hleb, i would argue he was very close to Coutinho level when he left Arsenal, just with shitty finishing ability . But in Barca he looked like he aged 9 years, couldn't even buy a dribble.

I remember many Arsenal fans shitting on us, saying we destroyed him.
At the end, Hleb himself admitted it was private issues that happened to him that destroyed his game.

Coutinho shows every sign of this.