Thiago Translantara

[unknowngenius10]

It was probably Rosell's fault that Thiago could have felt not appreciated when he had to give away his number 4 shirt so that Cesc could be happy ( It was Pep who brought Cesc, The only responsible for Thiago's departure (from the beginning) is Pep. If Cesc wasn't here, it is very probable that Thiago would still be here b.c he wouldn't feel as if he's third option after Xavi and Cesc.

 

[DonAndres]

The reason Barca lost the league in Peps last season was down to passive performances in the big games. In the cup they were lucky not to get put out 4/5-1 by Madrid at Camp Nou and even against Chelsea Barcelona looked fairly clueless in 45mins against ten men.

If Pep could motivate these players better and change every game they would have had a better final season.

Depsite that there are plenty of games they came back in last season

Home to Atletico, home to PSG, home to Milan home to Madrid x2, away to Sevilla and countless others in the league.

A lot of these were down to tactical changes he made.

It wasn't as much about complacency under Pep as it was shakiness, inconsistency, and lack of motivation. They still pressed and played well but made a lot of stupid errors in both defense and attack.

Tito's tactical changes in games were mostly bringing Messi/Villa on when we weren't playing well which isn't an astute tactical change, moreover fixing the obvious. As for the games you mentioned there weren't many true tactical changes implemented (aside from Milan), just the team looking better in the 2nd half due to finishing chances and tiring them out more. Milan was one of the few games where motivation and tactics were perfect, resulting in a 4-0 drubbing. He wasn't clueless tactically, but not really notably innovative either. And besides, you're looking at clear changes/comebacks as a measure of being tactically smart, whereas even Pep himself didn't often make hugely drastic and genius tactical changes mid-game to turn it around. Comebacks aren't often measure of tactics unless it's undoubtedly clear and a fairly large comeback. The point of Tito not being tactically adaptable was that he didn't correctly anticipate or prepare for teams who were clearly superior or could take advantage of our weaknesses. For example he continued to play unbalanced defenses vs. Bayern, Madrid, and PSG who really troubled us on the wings and in counterattacks.

 

[ebc_99]

I don't know how it could be simpler to understand, honestly...Everything emanates from Rosell & this board, many of us were predicting this even ahead of his election...He was trying to undermine the club's success even during the best moments under Pep & Laporta - that is not someone who is interested in the club but himself & his ego...Ironic that he would claim it was Laporta's ego that made working for him untenable

Look at the exodus, look at the failings, look at the de-emphasis of the cantera, look at the changes to the image of the club and look at how he was clearly part of Pep's exit...Now you can tack on Victor Valdes, Thiago and who knows who else will follow

From the moment Rosell took office, it was his mission to discredit everything Laporta had done - before we read or heard much about his mandate or what he intended to do with the club, it was all about undermining everything that already was done...It's clear Rosell's 'success' would need to be predicated on wiping away everything Laporta, Cruyff & Pep put together...Something an astute culé would recognize was a big part of why the club dominated in this era the way they have...Today, even before Thiago's departure is made official and the cracks in the club's foundation really come to light, we are a shadow of the club under Pep & Laporta

A lot of people on this board decided before Rosell was elected that they did not like him and everything he has done since is wrong. I don't like him either but if he deserves credit I will give it to him.

Aside from bringing in a sponsor and getting rid of Abidal I don't see much else that he has done wrong.

The club is in very good shape whether people admit it or not, excellent squad, strong youth acadamy and improved finances.

The club is sending young players out on loan which is a good move, it is what should have happened with Thiago a few years ago. If the young players are good enough and have the right attitude they will get their chance, if the do not have these qualities they will be let go. That is the best way to deal with young players, the club can't keep everybody as only the best should play at the club and that will probably be 1 every couple of years on average. The 1 we have at the moment is Montoya and the next one may be Samper or Grimaldo or Rafina or none of them. It is up to the players themselves.

They have signed Neymar who was courted by all the top clubs, they were all desperate to get him but Barca were one step ahead.

He has remained loyal to Tito and backed him, yet is criticized for it. He is not bending over to please young upstarts like Thiago either which is not the case for most clubs.

You also are blaming him for things that have not happened yet and may never happen, there is no exodus, nobody has left yet. There has been failings but that is the same with every club every season in the history of football. I have not seen any changes to the image of the club since Rosell has taken over at all either. I think most of the problems you have with Rosell are in your head, you seem to be looking for things to criticize.

Pep leaving was his own decision, If Valdes and Thiago leave it will too be their own decision. Barca cannot go running around after people who want to leave, it is part of life that people move on. By allowing them to leave shows how strong Barca are, nobody at the club is worried about the future and nor am I. The club is not perfect by any means but it is well placed to have a very successful decade indeed, people just have to be patient. We had a few excellent years and now we are down but it won't be long before we are back on top. I remember really bad times at the club and this is not one of them, I have to say i am very optimistic about the short, medium and long term future of FC Barcelona.

 

[unknowngenius10]

It's not that he'd stay, it's that we'd get 90 million if he went as opposed to the 20 we'll get now (provided he leaves)

That's what I'm saying. People seem to care about money but then when Rosell works on marketing then they don't care about money. No one would have paid 90 millions for Thiago and Barca would not have kept a player who doesn't want to be here. The most we could have gotten for Thiago would have been around 35 millions ( there is no way he's worth more than that). We might get 22 now. We are getting 13 millions less than what we could have probably gotten from Thiago.

 

[JamDav1982]

It wasn't as much about complacency under Pep as it was shakiness, inconsistency, and lack of motivation. They still pressed and played well but made a lot of stupid errors in both defense and attack.

Tito's tactical changes in games were mostly bringing Messi/Villa on when we weren't playing well which isn't an astute tactical change, moreover fixing the obvious. As for the games you mentioned there weren't many true tactical changes implemented (aside from Milan), just the team looking better in the 2nd half due to finishing chances and tiring them out more. Milan was one of the few games where motivation and tactics were perfect, resulting in a 4-0 drubbing. He wasn't clueless tactically, but not really notably innovative either. And besides, you're looking at clear changes/comebacks as a measure of being tactically smart, whereas even Pep himself didn't often make hugely drastic and genius tactical changes mid-game to turn it around. Comebacks aren't often measure of tactics unless it's undoubtedly clear and a fairly large comeback. The point of Tito not being tactically adaptable was that he didn't correctly anticipate or prepare for teams who were clearly superior or could take advantage of our weaknesses. For example he continued to play unbalanced defenses vs. Bayern, Madrid, and PSG who really troubled us on the wings and in counterattacks.

Many, many games in Peps last season the pressing was not there including the last two against Real and in league games against average sides.

Pep never anticipated the best way to go against those counter attacking tactics either. Teams were becoming more and more clued up all the time.

Just look at the last couple of games against Real. In particular the 2-2 at Camp Nou.

 

[JamDav1982]

That's what I'm saying. People seem to care about money but then when Rosell works on marketing then they don't care about money. No one would have paid 90 millions for Thiago and Barca would not have kept a player who doesn't want to be here. The most we could have gotten for Thiago would have been around 35 millions ( there is no way he's worth more than that). We might get 22 now. We are getting 13 millions less than what we could have probably gotten from Thiago.

The best thing is that people claim that Rosell cares about nothing but money above the team. Then they claim he should have insisted to the manager Thiago play so as not to have an 18m release clause.

It makes no sense and he cant win.

 

[DonAndres]

Many, many games in Peps last season the pressing was not there including the last two against Real and in league games against average sides.

Pep never anticipated the best way to go against those counter attacking tactics either. Teams were becoming more and more clued up all the time.

Just look at the last couple of games against Real. In particular the 2-2 at Camp Nou.

Now you're just seeing what you want to see. Just because we were beaten and weren't the dominant team doesn't mean that we didn't press. Positional errors and shaky defending were the cause of us playing poorly against Madrid in the 2-2 draw, not lack of pressing.

Pep couldn't find the perfect way to anticipate counterattacks because there is no completely perfect way, but playing both Alba+Alves and letting both bomb forward as they pleased was the opposite of what to do.

 

[Cruijffista]

I have full confidence in Cesc to step up. No more playing him as a wing (Tito really didn't) or a False 9 and let him function as an AM.

He does have some sweet assists when he has movement in front of him.

 

[JamDav1982]

Now you're just seeing what you want to see. Just because we were beaten and weren't the dominant team doesn't mean that we didn't press. Positional errors and shaky defending were the cause of us playing poorly against Madrid in the 2-2 draw, not lack of pressing.

Pep couldn't find the perfect way to anticipate counterattacks because there is no completely perfect way, but playing both Alba+Alves and letting both bomb forward as they pleased was the opposite of what to do.

No it wasnt the pressing was not there in that 2-2 game or the league game where Real won 1-0.

The players clearly pressed less and looked a bit less motivated in Peps last season.

Above all it was a better season for Barca than the season before.

 

[unknowngenius10]

I hope i don't come across as disliking or hating Cesc, but the truth is that that spot was suppose to be Thiago's. I think most of us agreed that cesc was not necessary from the beginning. Thiago is leaving b.c Iniesta is still young and he would have to fight with Cesc to be xavi's replacement. If Cesc wasn't here, it is very likely that Thiago would feel more appreciated and with more possibilities to be a starter for barca. I just don't see how Rosell is blamed for this. A higher clause would have gotten us more money but he could have still left. ( but who cares about money ..right? forget the money)

 

[jamrock]

i don't know why people debate with jamdav if the consensus opinion on a topic is that its good to save a drowning child he would say the opposite especially if donadres agrees.

he constantly points to pep's failings in his last season as some. huge negative as if every year he should have won the league and the easy and cap argument that Madrid were figuring pep out ignoring the fact which he so loves asking for that the worst barca side in the past five years still beat the best Madrid side in that time period 3 out ofsix times.


then he jumps to this season and points out all the great things and by things i mean thing which is get to 100 points one more than pep ever got in a season that blows this past one out the water then when someone points out that we couldn't beat our biggest and only rivals to the la ligaments crown once in out best ever season!!!, when they were at the weakest their just complaining for the sake off it.

 

[unknowngenius10]

The best thing is that people claim that Rosell cares about nothing but money above the team. Then they claim he should have insisted to the manager Thiago play so as not to have an 18m release clause.

It makes no sense and he cant win.

lol i know right?
you made a great point there. That's a contradiction lol

 

[Cruijffista]

I hope i don't come across as disliking or hating Cesc, but the truth is that that spot was suppose to be Thiago's. I think most of us agreed that cesc was not necessary from the beginning. Thiago is leaving b.c Iniesta is still young and he would have to fight with Cesc to be xavi's replacement. If Cesc wasn't here, it is very likely that Thiago would feel more appreciated and with more possibilities to be a starter for barca. I just don't see how Rosell is blamed for this. A higher clause would have gotten us more money but he could have still left. ( but who cares about money ..right? forget the money)

It's the way it played out especially with Thiago missing so many games to injury.

Cesc is a better player than Thiago but Thiago is more suited for a Xavi-like role than Cesc is. It's time for Tito to get creative and earn his money.

It's been said before but I'll say it again, we need to invest whatever money we get from the Thiago deal (22M hopefully) and make a play for Oliver Torres. Torres could really grow as a player under our system and he's the ideal player to take over for Xavi, even more than Thiago is.

 

[JamDav1982]

i don't know why people debate with jamdav if the consensus opinion on a topic is that its good to save a drowning child he would say the opposite especially if donadres agrees.

he constantly points to pep's failings in his last season as some. huge negative as if every year he should have won the league and the easy and cap argument that Madrid were figuring pep out ignoring the fact which he so loves asking for that the worst barca side in the past five years still beat the best Madrid side in that time period 3 out ofsix times.


then he jumps to this season and points out all the great things and by things i mean thing which is get to 100 points one more than pep ever got in a season that blows this past one out the water then when someone points out that we couldn't beat our biggest and only rivals to the la ligaments crown once in out best ever season!!!, when they were at the weakest their just complaining for the sake off it.

Talk about missing the point. No one can say anything against Pep even the fact that his last season was not the best and there was many issues that started to appear that have continued under Tito?

I point to Peps failings in response to those who constantly quote the 'Pep era'.

This league season was better than last. There is no real debate on that. Again you miss the point hugely as I said I did not think last season was the best team but showed Tito at least had some idea wht he was doing.

If you are going to put a reply in next time at least take time to read the points and dont post drivel.

 

[Der Kaiser]

It's the way it played out especially with Thiago missing so many games to injury.

Cesc is a better player than Thiago but Thiago is more suited for a Xavi-like role than Cesc is. It's time for Tito to get creative and earn his money.

It's been said before but I'll say it again, we need to invest whatever money we get from the Thiago deal (22M hopefully) and make a play for Oliver Torres. Torres could really grow as a player under our system and he's the ideal player to take over for Xavi, even more than Thiago is.

I havent seen much of Torres but he looks like he needs a few years until he can actually play a part at Barca. Gündogan or Verratti are much more prepared for the first team. Verratti will be hard to buy but Gündogan might be available for 25-30m next summer, depending on how hard Dortmund try to hold onto him.