Xavi Hernández

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FC B

Senior Member
BBZ wont answer questions to give opinions up front anymore as when does gets it horribly wrong and essays proved to be ridiculously wide of the mark.

Will go on at length about how bad Pedri or FDJ are... but hides from giving opinion of how would like to see Barca mid from next season.

Will go on at length slaughtering Pep and even Xavi before he arrives...but wont say who coach should be.

Nothing new.

I myself won't hide Xavi here and now will most likely be a failure imo but that necessarily obliges me to name a proper coach that will succeed atm? I'd like some coaches that are not available and I'd chose Gallardo over Xavi from those rumoured to be targets, if I could. Here we have the right to think a coach won't be a success at Barca without comming ourserlves with better solutions since, clearly, we are not deciding members of the Board and top proven coaches are under contract for now.
 

ItachiXXX

New member
Pep gotta be the most overrated demigod in this forum. He is just another Valverde with all free will to buy players and luck to have an ATG Barca squad
 

Windhook

Well-known member
Pep praises every opponent, yes, but about matters concerning Barca I think his opinion is more honest than the usual "Oh, Steve Bruce is a fantastic manager!".
 

DonAK

President of FC Barcelona
Well Xavi seems to me exactly this type of a coach, a pure hardcore cruyffist.

And that is bad because?

Some of you guys keep saying this, but never say why it's a bad thing. Whose principles do you think Ajax have laid their foundation on?
 

serghei

Senior Member
And that is bad because?

Some of you guys keep saying this, but never say why it's a bad thing. Whose principles do you think Ajax have laid their foundation on?

It's because in their head Cruyffism = old and slow Busi and Pique passing it around at snail pace without any purpose.
 

JamDav1982

Senior Member
Pep is not full Cruyff clone anyway he took a lot of elements from different coaches... Wenger, Mourinho, Bielsa, Cruyff etc.

Couldnt care less if Xavi is full Pep clone if he gets the basics back in the team.

Cruyff has been one of the biggest influences on football and still is to this day but folk act like it is a bad thing in itself.

Xavi is only option at this point when Ten Hag wouldnt arrive.

Can have all the ideas in the world but the biggest factor for Xavi will be how brave he is to change the squad and charisma he has to inspire the players as need the going at full throttle and motivated if want to play like a Pep team.
 

serghei

Senior Member
Nobody is a one-to-one clone of somebody. Every manager adds his own spin on the elements that they take from somebody. There will no doubt be differences between Xavi and Guardiola style-wise, while the broad lines (high line, pressing, rondos etc.) will be very similar.
 

Jadentheman

Active member
And that is bad because?

Some of you guys keep saying this, but never say why it's a bad thing. Whose principles do you think Ajax have laid their foundation on?

I guess it depends on the interpretation. Some people are diehards while others take liberties and modifications.
 

BBZ8800

Senior Member
And that is bad because?

Some of you guys keep saying this, but never say why it's a bad thing. Whose principles do you think Ajax have laid their foundation on?

In my eyes, carbon-copy of Pep's style is the worst.

We talked about that a lot of times:
Netherlands and Ajax started it first.
Then Cruijff copied those ideas and added his own touch to it.
Then Pep copied Cruijff and added his own touch to it.

In their core, they are all the same.
But I don't like Pep's version because he killed variety and moved too heavily to possession and playing through the middle.
You know the story = when it works, it works perfectly.
When he is neutralized = it is painful to watch it.

The other part is that imo, his style worked perfectly only when he had Xavi on a field to execute it and Messi in attack to kill everyone.

Even though they are quite the same, I never hated Dutch football.
In fact, I always cheered for Netherlands, since Euro 1988.
To me they always had that "wow" effect.
On the other hand, I never liked Spanish NT version of Dutch football.
Dutch are physically stronger, their wingers are usually very fast, their midfielders are taller and stronger.
On the other hand, Spanish version of Dutch football is 6 Iniestas/David Silvas in midfield and attack (Del Bosque's 460).
I was always bored watching Spanish version of total football. It is just way slower and too possession heavy for my taste.

And now, someone will say: Dutch NT, Cruijff's Barca, Rijkaard's Barca, Pep's Barca, that is all the same.
For me, Pep's Barca is the most possession heavy out of all these versions.
And again, it worked while we had Xavi and Messi to kill everyone.

Now, my view is, that majority of coaches who copy Pep:
1. don't have Messi and Xavi as players
2. aren't as smart as Pep and Pep surely hasn't told them all of his tricks
And then, when you look at Pep's football from the outside, it may seem as if you figured out let's say 10 basic principles and that you can do the same.
But, in Pep's head, he probably has 90 other tiny details which your mind doesn't even register, so your copy of Pep's football will look like Pep's football, but something will be missing.

Imo, the perfect example was Tito.
He tried to continue where Pep left. And he played the same way, except without some Pep's tiny details.
And even though he had good results, it seemed that his team lacked some magic and some tactical parts.

Some won't agree, but Setien is the same.
He thinks that he figured out Pep's and Cruijff's football, but he is not.
He gets the basics, but doesn't know 100 little details which only Pep knew and which he keeps for himself.

Or Rijkaard after 2006, when his assistant Ten Cate left.
Since that day, we were just missing something all the time, tactical wise.

And now, when some coach (unless if you are Tuchel) says that he will copy Pep, in probably 99% of cases that will end exactly in the way explained above:
= he will copy some basics, but it will lack "soul" and 100s of things which only Pep knows.

I will give you an analogy.
That is the same how Arthur probably thinks that he has "figured out" Xavi's football and that he plays more or less the same as Xavi.
Yet, he surely has some similarities and he is doing some moves exactly like Xavi, but for example, he doesn't possess Xavi's brain to predict 4 moves into the future.
And then, even though Arthur thinks that he is the new Xavi, he is a soul-less budget Xavi who will never come even close to him.
You can find 100s of similar examples in music, movies, art etc = where one person thinks that he is as good as the original because he copied some of the areas from the original artist.

About Xavi, you know his comments about 80% possession, too long grass and similar.
When you pair an obssession with Pep, who for my taste also went too far into the possession area and killed some other aspects like counters or crossing (now JamDav will say that City has the highest amount of crosses in EPL. I mean: smart crossing to a tall No9, not crossing to Foden, Sterling, Jesus and other AMs).

In short:
1. copying usually ends bad and souless and you lack 100s of minor secrets which where the soul of a genius/the original
2. Pep's version of Dutch football is the most possession heavy, Xavi is leaning towards too much possession for now. So, in short, I have fears that Xavi's copy of Pep's football will be similar to how Arthur (or any other young player) thinks that he plays like Xavi and that he has figured him out. No you didn't and you never will.
 
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Windhook

Well-known member
Imo, the perfect example was Tito.
He tried to continue where Pep left. And he played the same way, except without some Pep's tiny details.
And even though he had good results, it seemed that his team lacked some magic and some tactical parts.

I dig what you just wrote in this another long post and I agree. But I'm gonna go off-topic - we can never judge what Tito had in mind because he battled this fucking cancer throughout the years he was at Barca. At one point he was gone for months for treatment while the team was managed by Jordi Roura, basically meaning the team played without a manager and the great pool of talent in the squad still provided for the triumph in La Liga. When Tito returned he looked a lot worse than before and that demotivated everyone. I know from personal experience because I lost my mother to cancer few years later after Tito and seeing a sick person doesn't motivate you to go Rocky Balboa all of a sudden, rather makes you depressed.
 
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